Saved by faith alone?

[HeIsHere]

Well, Paul said saved souls will receive immortal spiritual bodies as they are resurrected to heaven (1Cor. 15:42-54).

That is not connected to what I wrote, do you know that words have different meanings and the context determines the correct meaning?

A "soul" as you are using it above is just an older form of saying "person."

 

[Mem]

I've often found myself exasperated in thinking that an agreement might've actually been achieved except for the participants' unwillingness to admit to even any semblance of it...

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

To be fair, I think equation might be a valid one. That is, I can believe a bridge will hold, but I may not necessarily trust that it will. So, I won't cross it unless I have (true faith) that it will hold. Is that not what the math sentence "believe + obey = trust/faith' claims?

not that I see it

that is a hard example to make. because basically the moment you said I trust the bridge, you had crossed it. Your actions followed.

A better example would be Abraham

He believed God and he accounted it to him as righteousness.

All of abrahams acts of obedience (and many acts of disobedience) Followed him being saved in Gen 15.

 

[PaulThomson]

No

Belief means I believe something, but I do not trust in that something, or I am not confident in that thing

Faith equals I have trust or faith in something

Belief may or may not have works (a person may believe but have faith in their works) or may present itself in a licentious way in which it has no works.

Trust or faith in the mode of salvation (we are saved by grace THROUGH FAITH not of works

But after salvation. there will be works.

I think you misspelled "Yes" in your first line.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

I've often found myself exasperated in thinking that an agreement might've actually been achieved except for the participants' unwillingness to admit to even any semblance of it...

It can be frustrating

The only reason I responded the way I did for that user is I know what he means by faith plus works.

He believes works are required for salvation. Not a byproduct of salvation

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

I think you misspelled "Yes" in your first line.

I believe you failed to show how I erred in what I said. and just mocked me.

quite a humble attitude there

back to you..

 

[Mem]

I believe you failed to show how I erred in what I said. and just mocked me.

quite a humble attitude there

back to you..

I'm sorry, but it made me laughed a little (but not the out loud kind of haha).

 

[GWH]

I believe Jesus told them three responses to the seed (the word)


I do not believe he was telling them to be any particular soil.. this would not fit the language or the parable

In fact. the disciples asked Jesus why he spoke to them in parables

10 And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”

11 He answered and said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given

It was not told for their sake at all. It was told for the disciples sake. so we could learn the mysteries of the kingdom. It shows them (and us) the 4 ways in which people react.

Your reply reveals that you are oblivious regarding the omnilove of God/Jesus, so you fail to understand that the reason Jesus told this parable was NOT because he hated those who were not his disciples but because he hoped every hearer (a,b & c) would repent and become his disciple/good soil and accept Him as Messiah, the One God sent to die for the sins of every spiritually sick soul. Such demeaning of divine love is blasphemous! Again, the simple and loving solution to your demeaning doctrine of divine hate is not to view saving faith as a meritorious work, just as accepting a Christmas gift does not mean the recipient deserves the gift.

 

[PaulThomson]

PaulThomson said:
Believe + obey = trust/Faith?

I believe you failed to show how I erred in what I said. and just mocked me.

quite a humble attitude there

back to you..

You wrote -

Everlasting-Grace said:
No
Belief means I believe something, but I do not trust in that something, or I am not confident in that thing

So, you are saying,
Belief = Trust - x
which is a re-arrangement of my expression -
Believe = Faith/trust - obey.

You wrote -
Everlasting-Grace said:
Faith equals I have trust or faith in something

So, you are saying -
Faith = trust
which is the same as my expression "faith/trust"

 

[Cameron143]

One is faith; one is the exercise of faith. Believing is separate and precedes action. Not believing leads to inaction.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

I'm sorry, but it made me laughed a little (but not the out loud kind of haha).

sometimes it is best just to laugh, even in silent..lol

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Your reply reveals that you are oblivious regarding the omnilove of God/Jesus, so you fail to understand that the reason Jesus told this parable was NOT because he hated those who were not his disciples but because he hoped every hearer (a,b & c) would repent and become his disciple/good soil and accept Him as Messiah, the One God sent to die for the sins of every spiritually sick soul. Such demeaning of divine love is blasphemous! Again, the simple and loving solution to your demeaning doctrine of divine hate is not to view saving faith as a meritorious work, just as accepting a Christmas gift does not mean the recipient deserves the gift.

Dude, I posted what jesus said.

But hey, believe what you want. I am at the point I could care less.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

PaulThomson said:
Believe + obey = trust/Faith?


You wrote -

Everlasting-Grace said:
No
Belief means I believe something, but I do not trust in that something, or I am not confident in that thing

So, you are saying,
Belief = Trust - x
which is a re-arrangement of my expression -
Believe = Faith/trust - obey.

No, Actually I said beliefe could come with works. or without works.. Not all belief is the same

You wrote -
Everlasting-Grace said:
Faith equals I have trust or faith in something

So, you are saying -
Faith = trust
which is the same as my expression "faith/trust"

No

You believe we must do works to earn or keep salvation

so when you say faith trust, You are trusting in your works. Not in God.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

One is faith; one is the exercise of faith. Believing is separate and precedes action. Not believing leads to inaction.

but people can believe and not have action.

even demons believe.. yet they tremble. they do not act..

sadly. many believe and do not even tremble. nor act.

 

[Cameron143]

but people can believe and not have action.

even demons believe.. yet they tremble. they do not act..

sadly. many believe and do not even tremble. nor act.

They believe Jesus is God. They tremble having evidenced His power in creation and being under His judgment. But they haven't believed in Him for salvation.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

They believe Jesus is God. They tremble having evidenced His power in creation and being under His judgment. But they haven't believed in Him for salvation.

Neither did the people James were speaking to.

He even said, if you believe (he questioned if they even believed) you do well.

And he said their faith was dead (lifeless)

that's why they did not do works. they would fit the licentious mold. easy believe mold of Jude and 2 peter 2.

James warned them as Paul warned those trying to insert works of the law with faith to be saved..

 

[Mem]

They believe Jesus is God. They tremble having evidenced His power in creation and being under His judgment. But they haven't believed in Him for salvation.

My analogy of a believing a bridge can hold but not trusting that it will hold (me, personally, because I fear it doesn't possess the capacity to bear my weight) demonstrates, imo, the difference between belief and trust. So, if I should cross the bridge even with that fear, wouldn't this, then, qualify as an actual faith?

 

[GWH]

1.That is not connected to what I wrote,
2. do you know that words have different meanings and the context determines the correct meaning?

3. A "soul" as you are using it above is just an older form of saying "person."

1. So, please connect them.
2. Indeed I do.
3. Yes, I am older.

 

[GWH]

Dude, I posted what jesus said.

But hey, believe what you want. I am at the point I could care less.

No, you posted your opinion about what Jesus meant.
Not caring is quite consistent with contradicting divine omnilove.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

My analogy of a believing a bridge can hold but not trusting that it will hold (me, personally, because I fear it doesn't possess the capacity to bear my weight) demonstrates, imo, the difference between belief and trust. So, if I should cross the bridge even with that fear, wouldn't this, then, qualify as an actual faith?

reminds me if the man who says I believe lord help me with my unbelief.