Saved by faith alone?

[mailmandan]

Yes, genuine faith produces or is followed/manifested by loving behavior (Gal. 5:22-23) or good deeds (Eph. 2:8-10),
persevering faith continues from first/conversion to last/death (Rom. 1:17, Matt. 10:22), and such non-meritorious faith
merely receives God's grace/salvation/HS (Rev. 3:20, 1Cor. 12:13).

Faith that saves continues and is not some shallow, temporary belief that has no root, produces no fruit and withers away. Man is saved through faith and not by works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is (evidenced) by works. (James 2:14-26)

*Jesus Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)

It is through faith "in Jesus Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 4:5-6; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies does not remain alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine. (James 2:14-26) *Perfect Harmony*

 

[mailmandan]

Jesus and Philip (Acts 8:37) both make it very clear that baptism is only for believers. Ever heard of an UNBELIEVER being baptized?? No need to state the obvious.

There have been plenty of folks who attend false religions and cults that have been water baptized but do not truly believe in Jesus unto salvation. Now these folks may believe certain things "about" Jesus but did not truly believe in Jesus unto salvation, trusting in Him alone for salvation. Many of these folks get water baptized anyway, primarily because they believe it will save them. I know multiple people who were water baptized in a church that taught a false gospel, then were later re-baptized after they truly came to believe the gospel. My wife and myself included. Now of course and atheist would not bother to be water baptized yet not only atheists are unbelievers. Anyone whose belief/faith falls short of trusting in Jesus Christ alone for salvation (John 3:18) is also considered an unbeliever. (Matthew 7:22-23)

 

[DJT_47]

"... whosoever does not get baptized will be condemned?"

Doesn't say that nor does it infer that since it makes no sense and is redundant. If you don't believe, why else would anything more be necessary to be said? If you believe you'll be obedient; if not, that's it.

 

[TrustandObey]

"... whosoever does not get baptized will be condemned?"

Classic redirection. Anyone can see this.

The Bible states that we stand condemned because of sin.

Not as you are implying, a lack of faith.

On judgement day we will not be accused of a lack of faith but sin.

 

[GWH]

Doesn't say that nor does it infer that since it makes no sense and is redundant. If you don't believe, why else would anything more be necessary to be said? If you believe you'll be obedient; if not, that's it.

Well, it is necessary to say what will be obeyed,
which is the commandment of Christ in John 13:34-35.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Classic redirection. Anyone can see this.

The Bible states that we stand condemned because of sin.

Not as you are implying, a lack of faith.

On judgement day we will not be accused of a lack of faith but sin.

So what do you do?
Try with all your might and willpower to quit sinning?

 

[GWH]

Classic redirection. Anyone can see this.

The Bible states that we stand condemned because of sin.

Not as you are implying, a lack of faith.

On judgement day we will not be accused of a lack of faith but sin.

Or more specifically, the sin of misdirecting faith, beginning with A&E's believing the serpent rather than God/GW.

 

[TrustandObey]

So what do you do?
Try with all your might and willpower to quit sinning?

Follow the advice of God.

Genesis 4:6-7
Then the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.”

We may debate what are the right things to do to be accepted but not the need to do the right things.

 

[Magenta]

Classic redirection. Anyone can see this.

The Bible states that we stand condemned because of sin.

Not as you are implying, a lack of faith.

On judgement day we will not be accused of a lack of faith but sin.

Everything that is not from faith is sin.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Follow the advice of God.

Genesis 4:6-7
Then the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.”

We may debate what are the right things to do to be accepted but not the need to do the right things.

What Cain and Abel's sacrifices represented was the issue.

3And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD. 4And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering: 5But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.

The firstlings of the flock represents the sacrifice that God would provide, while the fruit of Cain's labor represents the works that men do thinking that their works are acceptable sacrifices.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Classic redirection. Anyone can see this.
The Bible states that we stand condemned because of sin.
Not as you are implying, a lack of faith.
On judgement day we will not be accused of a lack of faith but sin.

You stand condemned because you as a sinner decide to add your attempts to quit sinning (obey the law, repent of sins, etc). The Object of your faith must change to the Only One Who atoned for all sins. It's stated 100 times in the Holy Bible in this one book alone.
This is from John 3

18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

 

[Beckworth]

Faith alone? Sure.

Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

The exact words of Jesus. Can’t argue with that! Mark 16:16

There have been plenty of folks who attend false religions and cults that have been water baptized but do not truly believe in Jesus unto salvation. Now these folks may believe certain things "about" Jesus but did not truly believe in Jesus unto salvation, trusting in Him alone for salvation. Many of these folks get water baptized anyway, primarily because they believe it will save them. I know multiple people who were water baptized in a church that taught a false gospel, then were later re-baptized after they truly came to believe the gospel. My wife and myself included. Now of course and atheist would not bother to be water baptized yet not only atheists are unbelievers. Anyone whose belief/faith falls short of trusting in Jesus Christ alone for salvation (John 3:18) is also considered an unbeliever. (Matthew 7:22-23)

We are not able to judge anyone’s heart to know whether or not they are truly trusting in Jesus or truly believing in Him. Only God can know that . He tells us not to Judge. You are basing your belief on judging, which is a sin, and your opinion, which you cannot prove.

 

[GWH]

The exact words of Jesus. Can’t argue with that! Mark 16:16


We are not able to judge anyone’s heart to know whether or not they are truly trusting in Jesus or truly believing in Him. Only God can know that . He tells us not to Judge. You are basing your belief on judging, which is a sin, and your opinion, which you cannot prove.

Yes, but Jesus does want us to discern correctly based on sufficient evidence
so that we may remove the plank in our own eye and then reprove our brother lovingly (Matt. 7:3-5).

There may be sufficient evidence to discern between the true Christian creed and a heretical cult,
although yes, it is God who judges the individual hearts.

 

[mailmandan]

The exact words of Jesus. Can’t argue with that! Mark 16:16

The second clause clarifies the first ..but he who does not believe will be condemned. Can't argue with that. You need to read it all. What happened to baptism in (John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Can't argue with that either. *Hermeneutics.

We are not able to judge anyone’s heart to know whether or not they are truly trusting in Jesus or truly believing in Him. Only God can know that . He tells us not to Judge. You are basing your belief on judging, which is a sin, and your opinion, which you cannot prove.

I'm not judging all individuals. I'm simply giving a general observation based on multiple other people's experiences including my own in regard to baptized make believers in various false religions and cults. With that being said, some folks will actually come to saving faith in Christ, in spite of what their false religion or cult teaches, but not because of what they teach. Bottom line. There have been plenty of people who have received water baptism that were not genuine believers at the time. I've heard numerous testimonies over the years.

 

[Mouse_Cheeks]

The second clause clarifies the first ..but he who does not believe will be condemned. Can't argue with that. You need to read it all. What happened to baptism in (John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Can't argue with that either. *Hermeneutics.

I'm not judging all individuals. I'm simply giving a general observation based on multiple other people's experiences including my own in regard to baptized make believers in various false religions and cults. With that being said, some folks will actually come to saving faith in Christ, in spite of what their false religion or cult teaches, but not because of what they teach. Bottom line. There have been plenty of people who have received water baptism that were not genuine believers. I've heard numerous testimonies over the years.

True. Can't argue with God if we take him at his words. That he alone as holy Spirit gives us understanding. And so that we heed his calling and leave our natural minded condition so to know his voice ,repent, and be in his eternal covenental salvation.

Of all that the father gives me I shall lose none.

 

[ATG]

Does the phrase, "saved by faith" equivalent to the term, "saved by faith alone"?

No more than A = A+B.

Letters may not be so different, but it's the spirit behind them that matters most.

Having faith alone is condemned in the Bible, and so is not the same as having faith in Jesus Christ alone. The one is faith alone without living it, and the other is having faith in Jesus as the only true Christ of God, rather than a false christ.

 

[HeIsHere]

No more than A = A+B.

Letters may not be so different, but it's the spirit behind them that matters most.

Having faith alone is condemned in the Bible, and so is not the same as having faith in Jesus Christ alone. The one is faith alone without living it, and the other is having faith in Jesus as the only true Christ of God, rather than a false christ.

I see what you are saying, but faith always has an object.
"faith in"

 

[Beckworth]

Yes, but Jesus does want us to discern correctly based on sufficient evidence
so that we may remove the plank in our own eye and then reprove our brother lovingly (Matt. 7:3-5).

There may be sufficient evidence to discern between the true Christian creed and a heretical cult,
although yes, it is God who judges the individual hearts.

I agree, if we are talking about “creeds” and “cults”. But we are talking about “hearts”, and deciding whether someone’s conversion is real or not; or whether they are truly “saved” or not. THAT, we cannot know—only God is capable of knowing that. , which IS WHY He tells us not to judge.

I wonder if the ones saying “they were never saved in the first place” realize how arrogant they sound in making judgements that only God is capable of making?

 

[Magenta]

I agree, if we are talking about “creeds” and “cults”. But we are talking about “hearts”, and deciding whether someone’s conversion is real or not; or whether they are truly “saved” or not. THAT, we cannot know—only God is capable of knowing that. , which IS WHY He tells us not to judge.

I wonder if the ones saying “they were never saved in the first place” realize how arrogant they sound in making judgements that only God is capable of making?

Didn't you claim to know between 50 and 100 people you said you knew had been saved but then lost their salvation?

 

[GWH]

I agree, if we are talking about “creeds” and “cults”. But we are talking about “hearts”, and deciding whether someone’s conversion is real or not; or whether they are truly “saved” or not. THAT, we cannot know—only God is capable of knowing that. , which IS WHY He tells us not to judge.

I wonder if the ones saying “they were never saved in the first place” realize how arrogant they sound in making judgements that only God is capable of making?

Yes, and those who say MFWists or TULIPists are not saved rather than merely mistaken.