Saved by faith alone?
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You can receive the Holy Spirit before a water baptism. Please read the extract below.
Acts 10:44-47
While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message. All the Jewish believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had also been poured out on the Gentiles. For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter responded, “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?”
So the Bible does not say that we are given the Holy Spirit at baptism.
Acts 10:44-47
While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message. All the Jewish believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had also been poured out on the Gentiles. For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter responded, “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?”
So the Bible does not say that we are given the Holy Spirit at baptism.
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Ephesians 2:8-9
See also Romans 11:6; Acts 16:31; Romans 3:28; 4:5; 5:1; Galatians 2:16; 3:24; Ephesians 1:13; and Philippians 3:9 .
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Ephesians 2:8-9
See also Romans 11:6; Acts 16:31; Romans 3:28; 4:5; 5:1; Galatians 2:16; 3:24; Ephesians 1:13; and Philippians 3:9 .
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Amen! Ephesians 2:8 - For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith (apart from additions or modifications, hence faith alone) - and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, (not by faith and works, hence faith alone) so that no one can boast.
What in the verbiage of the verse demands "alone"?
Where is the definitive qualifier in this verse?
Why is "alone" not in the verbiage?
Your "hence faith alone" is in conflict with basic hermeneutics. (Inference without cause)
This is the deck of card that faith alone regeneration theology is based on.
You still can't figure it out? Salvation through faith in Christ alone continues to go right over your head. Prior to my conversion several years ago I did not get it either. Allow me to break it down for you.
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption alone and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)
Are you ready to place your faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or are you still clinging to works for salvation? (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9)
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption alone and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)
Are you ready to place your faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or are you still clinging to works for salvation? (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9)
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If this is your best reply to my questions, I suggest you rethink your theology.
You still can't figure it out? Salvation through faith in Christ alone continues to go right over your head. A childish attempt at mockery.
Prior to my conversion several years ago I did not get it either. Another plead to personal testimony. Bad hermeneutics. You are willing to admit you were wrong in the past (a positive sign) are you willing to admit you could be wrong now? I am willing to admit I could be wrong on this and other issues.
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption alone and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)
Here is the text:
24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. 25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement,[a] through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. 27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.
If you are going to attempt to proof-text your assertion at least provide text that has your qualifier. Where is the "alone" you are attempting to prove?
Are you ready to place your faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or are you still clinging to works for salvation? (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9 I have faith in Jesus Christ, that is why I obeyed and was baptized so that my sins would be forgiven. (Mark 16:16 & Acts 2:38)
You still can't figure it out? Salvation through faith in Christ alone continues to go right over your head. A childish attempt at mockery.
Prior to my conversion several years ago I did not get it either. Another plead to personal testimony. Bad hermeneutics. You are willing to admit you were wrong in the past (a positive sign) are you willing to admit you could be wrong now? I am willing to admit I could be wrong on this and other issues.
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption alone and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)
Here is the text:
24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. 25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement,[a] through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. 27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.
If you are going to attempt to proof-text your assertion at least provide text that has your qualifier. Where is the "alone" you are attempting to prove?
Are you ready to place your faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or are you still clinging to works for salvation? (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9 I have faith in Jesus Christ, that is why I obeyed and was baptized so that my sins would be forgiven. (Mark 16:16 & Acts 2:38)
so it was faith PLUS baptism that saved you? It's faith PLUS whatever Jesus commands. Faith unto itself does not save. (James 2:27, John 14:15, John 8:31 & countless more)
Ok so the thief on the cross is in hell because he wasnt dipped in the magic saving baptismal water. Are the sons of Aaron in hell because they did not use the "magical fire" commanded by the Lord? Do not mock the commands of God.
Ok so the thief on the cross is in hell because he wasnt dipped in the magic saving baptismal water. Are the sons of Aaron in hell because they did not use the "magical fire" commanded by the Lord? Do not mock the commands of God.
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I have nothing to rethink, but you have plenty to rethink. You should learn to use the (Quote) feature instead of responding in obnoxious red bold lettering.
There is nothing childish about what I said, and the truth does continue to go right over your head. So much for your attempt at mockery.
I was not trying to make my personal testimony about hermeneutics. It was simply a personal testimony.
Prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church, I was wrong about the plan of salvation then and just like you now, I was trusting in water baptism for salvation and NOT in Christ alone. I also had absolutely no assurance of salvation then as a works trusting Roman Catholic, but I have assurance of salvation now as a born-again believer in Jesus. (1 John 5:11-13; 1 Peter 1:23) Praise God!
You are wrong about the plan of salvation. We are not saved by works including water baptism. (Acts 10:43-47; Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9)
Amen! Now what happened to baptism in Romans 3:24-28?
24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. 25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. (not faith plus baptism, not faith plus works, but simply faith) He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. (faith in Jesus and not faith in Jesus "plus something else") 27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.
So that's what bothers you. The word "alone" is not specifically spelled out next to faith in Romans 3:24-28 and you can't seem to figure out that the word "alone" does not need to be specifically spelled out next to faith in order to figure out that the word faith "stands alone" in connection with receiving justification in Romans 3:24-28. Did Paul say faith "plus something else" in Romans 3:24-28? NO. He simply said faith. Did Paul simply say we are justified by faith in Romans 5:1 or did he say faith "plus something else?" He simply said faith. Did Paul say we are saved through faith "plus something else" in Ephesians 2:8 or did he say faith "plus something else?" He simply said faith. Hence, faith alone. This is not rocket science.
Are you ready to place your faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or are you still clinging to works for salvation? (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9 I have faith in Jesus Christ, that is why I obeyed and was baptized so that my sins would be forgiven. (Mark 16:16 & Acts 2:38)[/QUOTE] I see that you are still clinging to works for salvation, with a heavy emphasis on water baptism. That's not faith in Jesus. That's faith in baptism. What other works are you also trusting in for salvation "in addition" to water baptism?
Mark 16:16 - He who believes and is baptized will be saved (general cases without making a qualification for the unusual case of someone who believes but is not baptized) but he who does not believe will be condemned. The omission of baptized with "does not believe" shows that Jesus does not make baptism absolutely essential to salvation. Condemnation rests on unbelief and not on a lack of baptism.
If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then why did Jesus not mention it in the following verses? (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26). What is the ONE requirement that Jesus mentions NINE different times in each of these complete statements? *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.
John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.
*Also compare the fact that these Gentiles in Acts 10:45 received the gift of the Holy Spirit (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) and this was BEFORE water baptism. (Acts 10:47)
In Acts 10:43 we read ..whoever believes in Him receives remission of sins. Again, these Gentiles received the gift of the Holy Spirit - Acts 10:45 - when they believed on the Lord Jesus Christ - Acts 11:17 - (compare with Acts 16:31 - Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved) BEFORE water baptism - Acts 10:47. This is referred to as repentance unto life - Acts 11:18.
*So, the only logical conclusion when properly harmonizing scripture with scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 16:31; 26:18). *Perfect Harmony*
There is nothing childish about what I said, and the truth does continue to go right over your head. So much for your attempt at mockery.
I was not trying to make my personal testimony about hermeneutics. It was simply a personal testimony.
Prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church, I was wrong about the plan of salvation then and just like you now, I was trusting in water baptism for salvation and NOT in Christ alone. I also had absolutely no assurance of salvation then as a works trusting Roman Catholic, but I have assurance of salvation now as a born-again believer in Jesus. (1 John 5:11-13; 1 Peter 1:23) Praise God!
You are wrong about the plan of salvation. We are not saved by works including water baptism. (Acts 10:43-47; Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9)
Amen! Now what happened to baptism in Romans 3:24-28?
24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. 25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. (not faith plus baptism, not faith plus works, but simply faith) He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. (faith in Jesus and not faith in Jesus "plus something else") 27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.
So that's what bothers you. The word "alone" is not specifically spelled out next to faith in Romans 3:24-28 and you can't seem to figure out that the word "alone" does not need to be specifically spelled out next to faith in order to figure out that the word faith "stands alone" in connection with receiving justification in Romans 3:24-28. Did Paul say faith "plus something else" in Romans 3:24-28? NO. He simply said faith. Did Paul simply say we are justified by faith in Romans 5:1 or did he say faith "plus something else?" He simply said faith. Did Paul say we are saved through faith "plus something else" in Ephesians 2:8 or did he say faith "plus something else?" He simply said faith. Hence, faith alone. This is not rocket science.
Are you ready to place your faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or are you still clinging to works for salvation? (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9 I have faith in Jesus Christ, that is why I obeyed and was baptized so that my sins would be forgiven. (Mark 16:16 & Acts 2:38)[/QUOTE] I see that you are still clinging to works for salvation, with a heavy emphasis on water baptism. That's not faith in Jesus. That's faith in baptism. What other works are you also trusting in for salvation "in addition" to water baptism?
Mark 16:16 - He who believes and is baptized will be saved (general cases without making a qualification for the unusual case of someone who believes but is not baptized) but he who does not believe will be condemned. The omission of baptized with "does not believe" shows that Jesus does not make baptism absolutely essential to salvation. Condemnation rests on unbelief and not on a lack of baptism.
If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then why did Jesus not mention it in the following verses? (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26). What is the ONE requirement that Jesus mentions NINE different times in each of these complete statements? *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.
John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.
*Also compare the fact that these Gentiles in Acts 10:45 received the gift of the Holy Spirit (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) and this was BEFORE water baptism. (Acts 10:47)
In Acts 10:43 we read ..whoever believes in Him receives remission of sins. Again, these Gentiles received the gift of the Holy Spirit - Acts 10:45 - when they believed on the Lord Jesus Christ - Acts 11:17 - (compare with Acts 16:31 - Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved) BEFORE water baptism - Acts 10:47. This is referred to as repentance unto life - Acts 11:18.
*So, the only logical conclusion when properly harmonizing scripture with scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 16:31; 26:18). *Perfect Harmony*
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Read my post #32 which addresses the thief on the cross.
Saved by faith alone? - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
Saved by faith alone? - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
Universalism is the Belief that all people will be saved.. I do not believe that all people will be saved therefore i am not believe in Universalism.. I believe one must believe Jesus and trust 100% in the atonement of the LORD Jesus for the forgiveness of sin.. Do not be a false accuser of the brethren..
Yes people must have faith in what Jesus did for us... But still it is what Jesus did for us that saves us.. Our slavation is not based on our works... Oh and according to the Bible Faith is not a Work.. Look it up some time..
Oh and i am not a calvanist either..
Yes people must have faith in what Jesus did for us... But still it is what Jesus did for us that saves us.. Our slavation is not based on our works... Oh and according to the Bible Faith is not a Work.. Look it up some time..
Oh and i am not a calvanist either..
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