Saved by faith alone. A surmised understanding?

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Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
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#41
It still in no way denies what i said.
It most certainly does.

You are forcing a panacea understanding into a rather general statement.
This is your error. I doubt you are willing to follow this narrative to its logical conclusion...universalism.

You failed to answer my question. Other than Grace what else is involved? according to paul in this passage?
Sense the verse is written in a rather general sense your question is impossible to answer. Paul simply states that God has shown His grace towards mankind and because of this we have hope.

Anything pass this is conjecture.
 

Blade

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2019
1,772
623
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#42
"by grace you have been saved". Grace unmerited favor form GOD the Great I Am. By grace through faith. Can you not see it? :)
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,843
1,854
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#43
It most certainly does.

You are forcing a panacea understanding into a rather general statement.
This is your error. I doubt you are willing to follow this narrative to its logical conclusion...universalism.


Sense the verse is written in a rather general sense your question is impossible to answer. Paul simply states that God has shown His grace towards mankind and because of this we have hope.

Anything pass this is conjecture.
In other words, You have no answer. As I thought.

Good day
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
909
133
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#45
"by grace you have been saved". Grace unmerited favor form GOD the Great I Am. By grace through faith. Can you not see it?
Yes, I can see it.

Is there some esoteric meaning other than what is written.

Please expound.
 

Bob-Carabbio

Well-known member
Jun 24, 2020
1,594
801
113
#46
we are actually saved by Grace,, Which is through faith..

we are not saved by faith..
Religious word games. "Grace" is nothing more than unmerited favor, and the reason that you weren'tdestroyed by God Immediately the first time you Sinned. "Grace" is the only reason God bothers with you at all.
 

JBTN

Active member
Feb 11, 2020
220
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#49
Why are there no verses that actually state that we are saved by faith alone? There are a number of churches that hold to this understanding but why no examples of such a simple notion?
Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves whoever has been born of him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5‬:‭1‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/59/1jn.5.1.ESV

If everyone who believes has already been born of God, as this verse says, how do you fit anything else in there?
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
909
133
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#50
If everyone who believes has already been born of God, as this verse says, how do you fit anything else in there?
Read the verse again.

It does not state: "Everyone who only believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God"

James 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before our God and Father is this, to visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.

If those who visit the orphans and widows and keep themselves unspotted from the world are pure and undefiled, how do you fit anything else in there?
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,581
3,615
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#51
As the verses state: "a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law".

Agreed but what about the question of salvation based upon faith alone???
All of us accept that the deeds of the law are not needed.
"""Romans 3 {24} Being justified freely by his grace"""
If our works are requiored then this scripture is a lie.. It's not for free if works are needed to pay for it..

(Romans 4:2-8) "For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. {3} For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. {4} Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. {5} But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. {6} Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, {7} Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. {8} Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin."
 

Prodigal

Active member
May 1, 2024
117
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Gone
#52
Type in "faith alone" to bible gateway or e-sword or some other Bible app and see what comes up ;)

Heres the results:


BIBLE SEARCH RESULTS
  1. James 2:24
    You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.
Hmm. I was under the assumption that I was made righteous by the blood of Jesus Christ.

I’m not entering into this debate. In fact, my phone gets shut off in an hour or two and I won’t be turning it back on anytime soon, maybe August if ever. But I will give my own personal take on this issue. Not that it matters, from the comments I’ve read in this thread, it’s not the Truth that matters anyways, it’s not the grace of God, His mercy, the blood of Christ, our sanctification, the edification of our brothers and sisters etc, but who can score the most points while displaying their superior understanding. That’s just my opinion. My apologies to anyone who may be offended at my candor. I’m just a servant, not a judge.

All that aside.

I was chosen by God before the foundations of the world. I won’t bother posting any proof texts, you’re all obviously very scholarly and astute.

It was the grace of God that led me to repentance, it is the grace of God that leads me in repentance. It was the grace and mercy of God that kept me all those years I wandered, and it was the Grace and mercy of God that led me home.

What must I do to do the works of God?
This is the work of God, that I believe. Notice in the text, they asked a question regarding their own works. “What must we do? Notice also that Christ did not answer their question. “This is the work of God, that you believe…” It’s Gods work, not ours. He gets all the glory. He gets all the praise.

I’m a son destined for Glory. I don’t know the why. And I am past the point of trying to figure it out. I know only the how. And that is by the unfathomable depths of Christs love for me, His sinless life, His stripes, His blood, His humility and humiliation, His resurrection, and His ascension to the right hand of the Father where as my High Priest, He continually intercedes on my behalf.

My very faith, though it be as small as a grain of mustard seed, this too, is a gift from Almighty God. And it will suffice.

God chose me. He sought me out. He revealed Himself to me. And He did all of this for His own Glory. And I will give Him all the glory due His name, by and through His own power and strength, and none of my own. I will boast only in the cross of Christ. I will love Him because He first loved me. I will diligently seek His face, because He, in His loving kindness, long suffering, and infinite wisdom and mercy, made it possible for me to do so. And I am so very grateful that He has.

May the Lord richly bless you with the knowledge of His Son, it’s the only knowledge that matters. And may you one day find yourself seated at His loving right hand, as He Himself is seated at the right hand of our Loving Father.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,859
845
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#53
Why are there no verses that actually state that we are saved by faith alone? There are a number of churches that hold to this understanding but why no examples of such a simple notion?
The verse below illustrates the same thing as being saved by faith.

Romans 5:1
Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,859
845
113
#54
Again, why are we stuck on Salvation again? It’s like never moving past being born.
Because church history is riddled with faith plus works.

We are unfortunate in that sense, we can't get past go.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,859
845
113
#55
Type in "faith alone" to bible gateway or e-sword or some other Bible app and see what comes up ;)

Heres the results:


BIBLE SEARCH RESULTS
  1. James 2:24
    You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.
You need to read the letter of James more carefully.

James 2:22
You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected.

Lots of people stumble in the letter of James.

If you want a rock solid faith in Jesus then perform some good works.
 

Burn1986

Active member
Mar 4, 2024
918
212
43
#56
The verse below illustrates the same thing as being saved by faith.

Romans 5:1
Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Why are there no verses that actually state that we are saved by faith alone? There are a number of churches that hold to this understanding but why no examples of such a simple notion?
You mean like why doesn’t Roman’s 10:9-10 doesn’t involve a “work” like opening your mouth and confessing or praying? Well, it does take a physical action like using your mouth. Now if you can’t speak, then you mouth the words and believe in your heart (that’s not written in the Bible but I’m pretty sure it would work).

It’s a pretty funny question “Why doesn’t the Bible say…” That’s kind of like saying “I’m mad at the law of gravity today. Why can’t I just break the sound barrier without going really fast? Why did I not check to see how much ch milk I had before I poured my cereal?! Why did I buy so many groceries? No I’ll have to make two trips! Why God Why???!!”
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
909
133
43
#57
If our works are requiored then this scripture is a lie.. It's not for free if works are needed to pay for it..
Are you implying "universal grace"?
It seems you are.

Grace without obedience?
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
909
133
43
#58
The verse below illustrates the same thing as being saved by faith.
No one is debating this point.

Focus on the lack of a definitive suggesting a general sense of meaning in the verses.

Example:

Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world. James 1:27

Would it be correct to add "alone" into this verse?
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,859
845
113
#59
No one is debating this point.

Focus on the lack of a definitive suggesting a general sense of meaning in the verses.

Example:

Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world. James 1:27

Would it be correct to add "alone" into this verse?
The verse you quoted is an instruction to participate in good works,
because good works will perfect your faith.

James 2:22
You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected.

Our reconciliation to the Father that Jesus performed on the cross,
was Christ's perfect sacrifice to atone for our sinful behavior. That
salvation is given to us in the form of a gift.

I don't think any Christian would ever think that they have any input
into that reconciliation. Nor would they consider that any of their works
were not a direct result of Christ's power, working in and through us.

We blow the trumpet of Jesus Christ, we confess the Christ, we call on
the name of Jesus!

By grace, a very long pause, through faith, then an eternal pause.

You have nothing to contribute, "alone" is the appropriate word.
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
909
133
43
#60
The verse you quoted is an instruction to participate in good works,
because good works will perfect your faith.
It does not say "good works" it clearly states:

"to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world."

So would it acceptable to assume that this is the only thing that will make "pure and faultless"?

Its a simple yes or no question.

I say no.

What about you?