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The reason Messiah Yahshua came was to make all things new, not with blood of goats but with the blood of the perfect lamb of Elohim who knew
of sin but never sinned. Overcoming death he was raised from death to life and ascended to the right hand of the Father in Heaven. That is he renewed the covenants with man and specifically of the faith of Abraham. Moses was a shadow of the Messiah to come. As is the services of the temple where a shadow of the Heavenly temple. Now condemnation came for sin not the sinner. The law is still the plumb line we have to live by faith. Since when was any commandment of God to be treated commonly? If you loved Him you would confirm the law. Because we don't we are under a curse. Judged by the law we claim to be free from because all mouths will be stopped and all have sinned and fallen short the glory of God.
Openly I have to share I celebrate the Sabbath day and chance I get. It doesn't run my race however, I do by faith. By faith I know my sins are forgiven. By faith I have certain Hope of a greater redemption to come. There is evidence of my faith by the knowledge of the word. On my belt I ware a lot zitzit which for those who don't know it is the corner or a blue thread worn to remind us to guard the commands of YHWH our Elohim and to teach them to our children, etc. I only ware one and the reason is to remember that my walk is made perfect in Messiah. When a family member dies for a Jewish man he takes one zitzit off, I wear one to remember the one who was raised from the dead. So I do study the renewed covenant and hold fast to the testimony of Messiah Yahshua in my walk. If you really want to know me you should walk a few miles in my shoes.
As far as your question about the law of Moses. We know very well that keeping the Law of Moses is not what makes you rightous.
Yes by love we obey Messiah and he leads us to the Father if he desires it. You can be sure if you do trust in Messiah and question your walk a lot, that you will be saved, Messiah is powerful and he is Messiah of the God of Heaven and Earth and all mankind right? My hope is that all mankind might be saved. We won't be however if we can't first agree on this one thing, Sabbath day is still in effect in Messiah.
So you Keep the Commandments of GOD and Have the Testimony of the Messiah?
It is a New Covenant with GOD's Law put in our heart... not like the one they broke He states.
So I will continue to live by Faith in the New Covenant.
we all have our journey to make my dear you wrote to me and I am trying to establish where you are at.
i believe we are to Keep and teach even the least Commandment of GOD but know one is to be born again of the Holy Spirit which comes not by outward circumcision. If you abide with your own traditions then that is between you and GOD and nothing for I..
when I see a blue sky and fluffy white clouds I am reminded of the blue and white and smile.. and when the clouds which are often here cover the blue I still can smile for Christ is within me where ever whenever and that is the beauty of the New Covenant we are at liberty under Grace.. no longer condemned.
You say that, and yet you say this below which is the opposite of what you just shared above.
That is like saying that keeping the Sabbath is how any one professing Him can be made righteous & thus saved by Him.
So which is it? Do you really believe the first portion of your quote? Or the second? Because they oppose each other.
Though it may sound that way to you it is not what I am saying. I'm saying once you have come to know the Messiah we should all humbly seek the Father through love of the commands. A person is not condemned under the renewed covenant. We should be convicted to do what is right and according to the perfect and holy law of God however if we are born again. Otherwise I would be like a person who's conscious is burned. When I think on the Sabbath day about scripture or something I said earlier that week or month this did come to mind. Is there a Sabbath observance in Messiah? Yes there is and still it is different from the forgiveness of sins. All in all honesty everything is one in God however for our benefit the Sabbath day is set apart apparently and by design sets apart the person who practices it. By the word of Elohim Sabbath day was set apart with man and until the sacrifice at the cross men where unable to truly enter into the rest of the Sabbath. Now by grace through faith we can and my question is, should we? In my mind at least I say yes enter in it is your gift.
Is the law of GOD the 10 Commandments ? Or the law of Moses?
I guess New and Renew is the key here.
Thanks John.
The Ten. Also the judgments, ordinance, and righteous rulings. These are also days and times. We should know better then to celebrate some pecan festival in the name of Elohim or even Messiah for that matter. In stead humility says to return to the festivals of Messiah and forsake the Holy days of the world. As the word says don't even bring it into your houses so some curse won't fall on you.
The Holy Spirit Baptism comes by believing the Messiah is Son of GOD sent to give a New Testament from GOD.
The Just shall live by Faith without the deeds of the law.
You seem to accept the Messiah as part of renewing the Old Covenant, but GOD said:
31Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: 32Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: 33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
Not to dispute but that is my belief.
I will remain married to the New Husband and not revert back to the shadow now the Great Light is with Us.
This comes to mind:
Galatians 2
2 Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also.
2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:
4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:
5 To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:
7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles
9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.
19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
Galatians 2
2 Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also.
2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:
4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:
5 To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:
7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles
9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.
19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
The Word in print when imparted by the Holy Spirit is life because Jesus is the Word and He is Life.
It begins with the Tanakh, and all is contined in the Tanakh for the spiritually astute, for Jesus Christ has fulfilled all that is in It.
The New Testament is the evolution of the completion of the Old. This by no means is an indication any of th Word is not worthy of study and respect.
If any who have come to Jesus Christ do not understand the evolution of the Old as taught by Jesus christ, that person is not quite with Him yet.
His Gospel completes all of the Word as pertaining to our Salvation and, our actions and our eternal hope in the King and the Kingdom.
All too many who come in the forum come in swinging grace zall over the place with absolutely on familiarity with what Jesus has taught, not completely. The main missing and important teaching is the evolution of the law according to Jesus Christ.
Of course we are saved by grace, but this is never to be held as an excuse to abridge and/or censer God's Word, thhis is perverting Jesus Christ's image and message for all. He is clear, not you or I. If what you pass on to others as gospel is from Jesus, you have nothing to concern yourself about, but if you are changing what He has taught in the name of some missplaced and undervalued grace (by you), you must turn fully to His teaching.
Because of Jesus Christ the laws that remain have become our wisdome from Him, directly. It cannot remain a law written in stone not to kill, not to covet to honor parents and to honor God.
Satan has instilled in many a desire to destroy the gift of the Sabbath to all of us, that is the Seventh Day of creation given us by Jesus Christ upon the finishing of creation to this point in time
Jesus is the truth, the life and the Way......amen.
It begins with the Tanakh, and all is contined in the Tanakh for the spiritually astute, for Jesus Christ has fulfilled all that is in It.
The New Testament is the evolution of the completion of the Old. This by no means is an indication any of th Word is not worthy of study and respect.
If any who have come to Jesus Christ do not understand the evolution of the Old as taught by Jesus christ, that person is not quite with Him yet.
His Gospel completes all of the Word as pertaining to our Salvation and, our actions and our eternal hope in the King and the Kingdom.
All too many who come in the forum come in swinging grace zall over the place with absolutely on familiarity with what Jesus has taught, not completely. The main missing and important teaching is the evolution of the law according to Jesus Christ.
Of course we are saved by grace, but this is never to be held as an excuse to abridge and/or censer God's Word, thhis is perverting Jesus Christ's image and message for all. He is clear, not you or I. If what you pass on to others as gospel is from Jesus, you have nothing to concern yourself about, but if you are changing what He has taught in the name of some missplaced and undervalued grace (by you), you must turn fully to His teaching.
Because of Jesus Christ the laws that remain have become our wisdome from Him, directly. It cannot remain a law written in stone not to kill, not to covet to honor parents and to honor God.
Satan has instilled in many a desire to destroy the gift of the Sabbath to all of us, that is the Seventh Day of creation given us by Jesus Christ upon the finishing of creation to this point in time
Jesus is the truth, the life and the Way......amen.
Your words I believe are in error. When you said " the just will live by faith without the deeds of the law"
Though it is not the law that saves it is the law that is needed for a wicked and perverse generation. Not only to reveal how sinful they are but also to instruct in the path of peace too God and men. Besides are we not the body of Messiah and as the body of Messiah we should confirm the law. In error religion of men focus on the vengeful God when Messiah reveals a loving God. Not that God doesn't know how to use anger. It is stored up for the wicked for the day of judgment. What should blow our minds is what the word says a wicked man is. Food for thought John Talmid
It is the Faith of Abraham my dear the promise comes to all who believe.
The New Covenant is the Good Shepherd leading us on the path of righteousness restoring our soul.
We are to to build our House on His Words and the Old was always part of the Promise being fulfilled to Abraham.
Are you saying that a person must not be born again if they do not keep the Sabbath day?
Jesus is the free gift of eternal life to us. Jesus is the One we enter into for our rest; not the Sabbath.
As much emphasis that you place on this; where is that taught in any epistle to the churches?
It is one thing to infer that pagan holy days and sabbaths were referenced in Colossians, while another profess Sabbath Day Keeper ( an SDA ) says it is referring to Judaism's holy days and annual Sabbaths, thus alluding to the weekly Sabbath still needing to be kept, you are both wrong.
You are wrong in that it is not a reference to pagan holy days because if it was, then pagan used the sabbath days for their practices too.
The other brother is wrong because there is no exception given to clarify and to make sure readers are keeping the weekly Sabbath.
You are both wrong in that Romans 14th chapter warns believers from judging any believer by their esteeming a day as unto the Lord or not esteeming a day as unto the Lord, and the esteeming of the Sabbath day falls under that warning. How can it not when you are esteeming the Sabbath day and judging those who are not?
The reason the Lord is able to make believers stand for not esteeming the Sabbath day is because He dwells in them as our bodies are the Temple of the Holy Spirit; that is why His disciples were guiltless for profaning the Sabbath day because Jesus was with them in Matthew 12:1-7.
Your complete disregard for that scriptural reference of how Jesus pointed out two examples on how saints had profaned the Sabbath day and were guiltless because they were in the Temple, Jesus announced that One greater than the Temple was here; mainly inferring Himself.
That is why Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath as He is in you is why you are guiltless for profaning the Sabbath day.
He is able to make you stand just by dwelling within you and He is the One that is presenting you faultless in Heaven; not you keeping the Sabbath day.
If you consider how you guys are keeping the Sabbath day differently than what was commanded of the Jews in the O.T., wherein they are ALSO supposed to stone those who break the commandment to keep the Sabbath, and yet there is no careful explanation in any letter to the churches on that important matter IF they were really supposed to keep the Sabbath, but yet not to stone believers for breaking the Sabbath, then you guys are found wanting as far as scripture is concern in the N.T.
You guys are weaving your beliefs into scripture of the N.T. where it is obviously not saying it outright while ignoring Jesus own words in Matthew 12:1-7 on why and how you are guiltless for profaning the Sabbath day and ignoring Paul's warning not to judge a believer for not esteeming a day which has to include the sabbath.
Romans 14:[SUP]4 [/SUP]Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand. [SUP]5 [/SUP]One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. [SUP]6 [/SUP]He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks. [SUP]7 [/SUP]For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself. [SUP]8 [/SUP]For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
You need to believe that His sacrifice for your sin is greater than the need to keep the Sabbath day, otherwise, you are saying that His Blood is not that good enough that you HAVE to keep the Sabbath day to prove you are born again.
You are free to esteem the Sabbath day, just as you are free to rest in Him as guiltless for profaning the Sabbath day, but you are not free to judge other believers as sinning or not born again or not saved ( if you are leading in that direction as you certainly are sounding like it ) when by Jesus Christ dwelling in us is why and how YOU & I are blameless for profaning the Sabbath day. That means you do not have to worry about keeping the Sabbath day the way they did in the O.T.
The Apostles kept the Sabbath
Acts 1:12
Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
Acts 13:14
But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
Acts 13:27
For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him.
Acts 13:42
And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
Acts 13:44
And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
Acts 15:21
For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
Acts 16:13
And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.
Acts 17:2
And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
Acts 1:12
Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
Acts 13:14
But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
Acts 13:27
For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him.
Acts 13:42
And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
Acts 13:44
And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
Acts 15:21
For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
Acts 16:13
And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.
Acts 17:2
And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
If this is all you have then it is exceptionally poor evidence for your contention that Christians are obliged to keep the Sabbath.
Not one of these texts actually means that the apostles were Sabbath-keepers.
Most of them refer to the fact that in order to evangelise Jews it was necessary to do it on the Sabbath in a synagogue when they were gathered together.
If Sabbath-keeping has the importance you insist it does then try to explain how it is possible that the apostles make no mention of it during the Jerusalem Council when these very issues of the law pertaining to New covenant believers were nutted out. And please don't trot out the excuse that the so-called law of Moses and the the so-called law of God are separate entities - they are not!
The fact is that you have listed several texts where the word 'Sabbath' is mentioned - the CONTEXT however has nothing to do with your agenda.
They preached on the Sabbath because that is where the Jews and God-fearers would be. They had little to no chance to get them to worship the first day of the week, until after they were converted, of course.
Sir, please stop teaching - with all due respect you rarely know what you are talking about. I say this in concern and brotherly love.
Prove to me in scripture that the Sabbath day is either Sunday or Saturday. Then you might have an argument. I think it may be neither. A Pope made Sunday the first day of the week. Are you a Catholic?
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I am not a Catholic and given preacher4truth's doctrinal positions he would have to be the world's first reformed Catholic!
This last post of yours is nothing more than a smokescreen, a straw-man.
The bottom-line is that the texts you posted do not prove your Sabbatarian position in any way.
Not attempting to prove anything. All I did was quote 8 scripture references from the book of Acts, and you went off. Follow these instructions of God if you are not unlawful. Thanks.
‘You shall not hate your fellow countryman in your heart; you may surely reprove your neighbor, but shall not incur sin because of him.You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself; I am the Lord.' (Leviticus 19:17-18)
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With respect you claimed that the apostles kept the Sabbath, and posted those texts to try to back your position - go back and review your post....Not attempting to prove anything. All I did was quote 8 scripture references from the book of Acts, and you went off. Follow these instructions of God if you are not unlawful. Thanks.
‘You shall not hate your fellow countryman in your heart; you may surely reprove your neighbor, but shall not incur sin because of him.You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself; I am the Lord.' (Leviticus 19:17-18)
Also if your latest text (Lev 19:17-18) equates to you believing that anyone who corrects your errors hates you then again you are in error. And again, if you believe that text means that no one can correct your errors for fear of contravening either the letter or the spirit of that text, you are again in error.