Predestination or free wiil.
- Thread starter RDK
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Sure, that was after the resurrection. I was asking about beforehand. FGC was stating that no one can understand spiritual things without the Holy Spirit which the disciples did not have until after the resurrection in Acts.
The Gospels end with the resurrection and a bit after. That is when Jesus promised to send the spirit. Therefore it happened in Acts. Your question either is a trick question or asked in ignorance! Which is it?
I am not agree, not to steal is spiritual. Some non Christian not steal. Helping the poor is spiritual, some non Christian helping the poor.
My question is not in regards to you or anything you have posted. FGC has been posting concerning 1 Cor. 2 and how he claims man must be regenerated by the Holy Spirit before they hear the gospel and believe it. He claims one cannot understand anything spiritual unless one is indwelt with the Holy Spirit. Are you in agreement with FGC?
F...,
Aren't you mixing ........".those that He chose".....with..."those who qualify by following G-d's commandments to His satisfaction"...?
It appears so.
J...,
Salvation by Christs' sacrifice on the cross is available to ALL.
The fact that some choose not to participate in the offering is what produces a number not in compliance......thus the loss (spiritually dead) group.
The eternal deliverance for those that Christ died for was accomplished on the cross, and every one of them will live in heaven, without the lose of even one, and after Christ accomplished that, he said "it is finished". No more souls will be eternally delivered after the cross. Christ's offering was offered to God, for God's approval and not to man for man's acceptance. All of those that Christ died for will be born into this world as spiritually dead. Sometime in their life, those that he died for , will be regenerated (made spiritually alive) as explained in Eph 2:5.
Eternal deliverance was accomplished by Christ on the cross for all of those that God gave to Christ. Christ's sacrifice was offered to God for God's acceptance, and not to man for man's acceptance. All that he died for will live with him in heaven, without the lose of even one. Christ said, on the cross, "it is finished", meaning that there will be no more sacrifice for sins, thus, no more souls saved eternally after the cross.
We cannot determine who the elect are and are not. By our nature we are a very corrupt people and the non elect can do seemingly spiritual things to deceive for their own gain.
Not scriptural.... souls are saved daily.
"It is finished"...is properly interpreted to mean...His assignment here on earth ..."is finished".
That is just the tip of the iceberg. "It is finished"is a very comprehensive statement which encompasses (1) the fulfillment of all the types and shadows of the Old Covenant, (2) the end of the Old Covenant, (3) the finished work of redemption on that Cross, and (4) the totality of God's perfect salvation in Christ.
The reason that you don't think it to be scriptural is because you fail to see that the Greek for "saved" is "a deliverance, and most of the salvation scriptures are referring to deliverance we receive on earth. The bible is not written to eternally save souls, but to instruct God's children on how he wants them to live their lives here on earth. Eternal salvation was accomplished by Jesus for all that the Father gave him. Jesus's sacrifice offering was to God for God's acceptance, and not to man for man's acceptance. God's instruction to repent, confess, accept, believe etc. is directed to God's disobedient children and not to the natural man.
As I said...He finished His assignment here on earth.
Obviously that includes all the above you mentioned and more.
Because we can qualify by following G-d's commandments and thereby meeting His expectations under His rule of righteousness.
No one is limited in that opportunity.
Do you realize what you are saying?
You are saying that a person who is not one of God's "elect" can follow God's Word, confess Jesus Christ is Lord and believe in his/her heart that God raised Christ from the dead, and that will only "deliver" the person in this life.
If the person is not "elect", he/she will still find him/herself cast into the lake of fire even though he/she followed God's Word, confessed Jesus Christ as Lord and believed in his/her heart that God raised Christ from the dead.
You are also saying that if a person is "elect", he/she can behave as shown in Rom 1:18-32, thumb his/her nose at God, do things which God considers abomination, never believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and still have eternal life.
You have swallowed a lie from the father of lies!!!
If I may, let God give grace to answer...
Predestination is a very delicate doctrine if you do not know God personally it could lead astray, God knows everything that's an aspect of who he is and he do not hide it from us; let's put it in this way, if you will: we have this gift of choosing whatever we want, no matter good or bad, but God has set a reaction for every action and that cannot be changed, the decision is our but the consequences are God's, that cannot be changed.
Yes, God make a plan to save the world and the way to it but it is written even He changes His mind so if we are fearful of Him and obedient to His word and if we trust in Him alone, he promised to give us what we ask for. In the end none of this matter because he is the beginning and the end, eventually every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord.
I, by no means, consider this to be a topic to evade but there are more important things to do and learn about, so that's my answer.
Grace&Peace
Predestination is a very delicate doctrine if you do not know God personally it could lead astray, God knows everything that's an aspect of who he is and he do not hide it from us; let's put it in this way, if you will: we have this gift of choosing whatever we want, no matter good or bad, but God has set a reaction for every action and that cannot be changed, the decision is our but the consequences are God's, that cannot be changed.
Yes, God make a plan to save the world and the way to it but it is written even He changes His mind so if we are fearful of Him and obedient to His word and if we trust in Him alone, he promised to give us what we ask for. In the end none of this matter because he is the beginning and the end, eventually every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord.
I, by no means, consider this to be a topic to evade but there are more important things to do and learn about, so that's my answer.
Grace&Peace