Predestination is misunderstood...

[studier]

Some will want to attack the teaching of the Rapture because it gives comfort to those who Jesus loves.

And some learned and very hard-working and faithful Christians disagree that the rapture is accurate teaching and think that it is harmful to the Faith.

They will keep trying as a result of developing a form of mental illness that might be classified as spiritual psychosis.

One of the things I've watched go on and have taken note of through the years is this "mental illness" I think you're speaking of. The highlights went kind of like this as I recall: When I saw US POTUS debates in the early 2,000 era include the topic of homosexuality Romans 1 came to mind and how the US was clearly under judgment as God was turning more people over to their worthless/reprobate minds for rejecting the light He has given to all men about Himself; the next phase in the next decade seemed to be a growing lack of capacity for thought re: basic truths. There's a thread that runs through the Text with a word used mostly in the LXX in Proverbs but also into the NC that speaks of mental capacity for thought which God ultimately controls; now here we are looking like madness and absolute stupidity is spreading.

It's all hatred for God and Paul picks up this word in Philippians and ties it to love and how love increases. On the other hand, no capacity for thought re: truth, then no love. Jesus speaks in Matt24 of love growing cold due to lawlessness. It's all interrelated.

Rapture or no rapture, things don't look good in these times we're in.

 

[sawdust]

And some learned and very hard-working and faithful Christians disagree that the rapture is accurate teaching and think that it is harmful to the Faith.

I've heard this argument before but I fail to see how it is harmful. People fail in prosperity as much, if not more, than they fail in persecution.

It's God's basic MO to remove His people from judgment (Noah from the flood, lot from Sodom), how can that be harmful?

 

[studier]

I've heard this argument before but I fail to see how it is harmful. People fail in prosperity as much, if not more, than they fail in persecution.

It's God's basic MO to remove His people from judgment (Noah from the flood, lot from Sodom), how can that be harmful?

Yes, some also see it as you do. And, yes, I agree with you that people fail in all times.

One man and his family being removed in each of the above events doesn't seem to bode too well for the Church and the rapture, but I understand how you're using the example.

Are you expecting the rapture? Soon?

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I've heard this argument before but I fail to see how it is harmful. People fail in prosperity as much, if not more, than they fail in persecution.

It's God's basic MO to remove His people from judgment (Noah from the flood, lot from Sodom), how can that be harmful?

Noah went through the Flood and Lot suffered loss but escaped physical harm but fear overcame him and he hid in the cave of the mountain.
Not sure how that equates to being removed but still having to experience the trauma and trial at hand.

 

[sawdust]

Yes, some also see it as you do. And, yes, I agree with you that people fail in all times.

One man and his family being removed in each of the above events doesn't seem to bode too well for the Church and the rapture, but I understand how you're using the example.

Are you expecting the rapture? Soon?

You haven't told me why you see it as harmful to the faith.

 

[sawdust]

Noah went through the Flood and Lot suffered loss but escaped physical harm but fear overcame him and he hid in the cave of the mountain.
Not sure how that equates to being removed but still having to experience the trauma and trial at hand.

Noah was taken out of the flood and placed in the Ark and Lot was taken out of Sodom. The resurrection of the Church is not about being removed from suffering, it is about being removed from God's judgement.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Noah was taken out of the flood and placed in the Ark and Lot was taken out of Sodom. The resurrection of the Church is not about being removed from suffering, it is about being removed from God's judgement.

But they still went through it and experienced it even in a safe means.

 

[Genez]

Noah went through the Flood and Lot suffered loss but escaped physical harm but fear overcame him and he hid in the cave of the mountain.
Not sure how that equates to being removed but still having to experience the trauma and trial at hand.

Noah was "raised above" the tribulation below him in the ark.
He did not go through the Tribulation of the flood.
God raised Noah above it.

Just like the Rapture will raise us above the Tribulation, and not through it.

 

[Genez]

But they still went through it and experienced it even in a safe means.

If Noah and his family had water filling their lungs?
Then they would have gone through it.
They were lifted up and went above the flood.

The Rapture is our Ark above the Flood of God's wrath to be poured out on earth during Satan's short lived seven year reign..

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.

The Ark and Noah went through the Rain, not above it.

 

[Genez]

And some learned and very hard-working and faithful Christians disagree that the rapture is accurate teaching and think that it is harmful to the Faith.

How can they be faithful if they work hard to justify a false teaching when they should know better if they truly were qualified to study God's Word? Dr. Bart Ehrman is a very hard working scholar.... Hard work alone does not have to equate itself with integrity.

Satan has his recruited agents working hard. Some even possessing genius IQ.

 

[Genez]

And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.

The Ark and Noah went through the Rain, not above it.

Rain does not kill you.

Floods do...

Why did I have to tell you that?

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Rain does not kill you.

Floods do...

Why did I have to tell you that?

Rain caused people to drown and created the floods.
You clearly downplay the rain for your own personal doctrine that is literally less than 200 years old and goes against 1800 years of Church History including written accounts from the Author of Revelation own Disciples (Church Fathers).

 

[Genez]

Rain caused people to drown and created the floods.
You clearly downplay the rain for your own personal doctrine that is literally less than 200 years old and goes against 1800 years of Church History including written accounts from the Author of Revelation own Disciples (Church Fathers).

Oh boy... here we go!

Have fun.....

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Oh boy... here we go!

Have fun.....

We will just agree to disagree

It's not as if we would agree on everything all of the time.

 

[Genez]

We will just agree to disagree

It's not as if we would agree on everything all of the time.

As long as it makes sense.

 

[studier]

You haven't told me why you see it as harmful to the faith.

I said "some...." see the rapture this way. I didn't say how I see it. I have said that I was trained under one view and my thinking was later changed and I haven't really come to a conclusion re: eschatology which is a bigger topic than just the end of the world.

We can read other eschatological schools of thought on the rapture from our Christian siblings or search these days and read how other Christians view it or have been personally and negatively affected by it or click over to the News section of even this site and see how rapture and end times prophecy theories are having a field day now as it has had many times in history when things were thought to be looking bad. It's not only speculation and used in sensationalist ways, but a lucrative business for some.

Again, are you expecting the rapture? Soon?

Do you have May 18, 2024 marked on your calendar because God wrote a big aleph in the sky with the recent eclipses, the last one 40 days prior to that date to warn us of something impending? Do you think we'll see some major event by then or read of some things or another that God does in the world that some will point to and speculate was absolutely God doing something so their theory was proven?

 

[studier]

How can they be faithful if they work hard to justify a false teaching when they should know better if they truly were qualified to study God's Word? Dr. Bart Ehrman is a very hard working scholar.... Hard work alone does not have to equate itself with integrity.

Satan has his recruited agents working hard. Some even possessing genius IQ.

It fascinates me how once settled into a certain eschatological belief system, we can speak with such conviction of all other interpretations as false teaching and satanic. With reason I doubt that many of us can even explain the other schools of thought and why they are right or wrong. Saying they're satanic is easy.

 

[homwardbound]

Those who teach false doctrine are the first to strongly condemn false teachers.... Irony.
They will leave their trail of irony droppings that one must be careful to keep their own sandals off of.

Why do some feel an affinity for false teachings?
And, God does not stop them?

So, God can weed their intentions.
To be out in the open and clearly seen without denial on their part.

Why?

It makes the Evaluation of the Saints to go smoothly without any more appeals for a retrial.

The reason we see the mess we have been deployed into is because of Satan's Appeal trial that God
granted him. Granted because of the knowledge that needed to first be made known before the sentence
could not be argued any more.

That is why we are presently caught in the spiritual crossfire between the powers of darkness
and our Defense Attorney Jesus Christ.

“If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first." John 15:18

Some will want to attack the teaching of the Rapture because it gives comfort to those who Jesus loves.
Satan hates Jesus, and wants to hurt Jesus by proxy by making those whom the Lord loves to be miserable.

Demons scout out among carnal believers and unbelievers those whom will feel one with their demonic
resentment of the beauty of God's plan. They will become proud agents of spreading false doctrine as to
try to hurt the Lord by proxy.

When anyone defends sound doctrinal thinking? That one will receive hatred they harbor in their hearts for the Lord.
For he became the word of God made flesh!

The more sound doctrine we have in our possession?
And is being lived out in our life?
The more their hatred for the Lord must seep out sent in our direction.....

That negative realty grants us an even greater opportunity for more understanding by grace to become more and more
transformed in our souls to manifest His thinking...

Its the plan. False doctrine is the result as an attempt to thwart the plan they can not stop.

They Hate the Lord because they know they can not win. In spite of that reality?
They will keep trying as a result of developing a form of mental illness that might be classified as spiritual psychosis.

Enjoy the ride! !

It is a bumpy ride
Thank you, friend in the risen Jesus given you to express the truth you just expressed to me to see clearer than have, yet have it even deeper now, How high, wide and deep is this forgiveness, reconciliation, wow?
Isaiah 6:1-7
I, see me in court. The prosecutor is Evil. That literally takes anything I have done or might do and takes that to God, the Judge of all, not only me does evil do that to, it is To stop anyone, including me from entering God's courts with thanksgiving and praise (Psalms 100:4) over what is done for us all by Son on that cross. What is done? (Psalms 103:12) How far is the east from the west? it seems there is no end , to me I see that at least in thanksgiving and praise to God. so as said, I am in Court, I say thank you to God the Judge of all. Then I ask how to say no to unrighteousness? God replies trust me in my risen Son of you. It is not of work(s), it is of the done work(s) of my son for you.

 

[Genez]

It fascinates me how once settled into a certain eschatological belief system, we can speak with such conviction of all other interpretations as false teaching and satanic. With reason I doubt that many of us can even explain the other schools of thought and why they are right or wrong. Saying they're satanic is easy.

Truth does not change.
The desire to evade truth mutates an is always trying to find a way around it.

There will be some who find truth.
Anything that counters truth in its desire is satanic, no matter how smiley face it is.

Who has truth? God knows.

It will be sorted out at the right time.


For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine.
Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number
of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.


2 Timothy 4:3