Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked

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posthuman said:
Do you believe you have salvation?
Why or why not?
On what basis?
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Yes I have salvation. I’m saved by grace through faith, not of works. I am led by the Spirit and I follow that path. Being spiritually born again, it’s pretty easy, but our physical bodies are not born again. Not a problem, God is training me and disciplining me as necessary to make me stronger and bring me to repentance as required. It’s all for His glory.

are you saved and how do you know?
 
posthuman said:
i remembered that you do not believe salvation is a present possession.
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RM had better haul out his Greek interlinear. Because salvation being a present possession is exactly what the Bible says with impeccable clarity.
 
cv5 said:
What is biblically correct is that Christians are born again into the family of the Father. Out of Who's hands we can never be snatched.
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Being snatched means someone is doing the snatching. Falling away of your own choosing is more like it.
 
cv5 said:
RM had better haul out his Greek interlinear. Because salvation being a present possession is exactly what the Bible says with impeccable clarity.[/USER]
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[/QUOTE]

cv5, you shouldn’t believe everything people say here. People say false things about me every day.
 
Runningman said:
Being snatched means someone is doing the snatching. Falling away of your own choosing is more like it.
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Jesus says we can never be snatched. You say that men (including ourselves) can.

Who ya gonna believe?
 
cv5 said:
Jesus says we can never be snatched. You say that men (including ourselves) can.

Who ya gonna believe?
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I never said that. Wow. Two back to back false accusations. I’m doing something right to be getting all of this flak.
 
Runningman said:
I didn’t say that. When did I say anyone can’t be saved today?

“Today is the day of salvation.”
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Present possession (was the salient point) of something foreordained from eternity past.

You try to be slippery but really you come off as simply clumsy.
 
Runningman said:
Yes I have salvation. I’m saved by grace through faith, not of works. I am led by the Spirit and I follow that path. Being spiritually born again, it’s pretty easy, but our physical bodies are not born again. Not a problem, God is training me and disciplining me as necessary to make me stronger and bring me to repentance as required. It’s all for His glory.

are you saved and how do you know?
Click to expand...

If it is not of works how could works negate it?
If it is God working in you, how can God fail to finish what He began?

i know i am saved with all confidence because i know He is faithful. i have no confidence in myself nor need confidence in myself; the security of my salvation is dependent on Him who saves me, not me who is being saved.

doubting it would be doubting Him. if it were anything other than this, my confidence and my trust would be in myself rather than in Him.

Because God is faithful and true, it is impossible that salvation can be lost.
 
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posthuman said:
If it is not of works how could works negate it?
If it is God working in you, how can God fail to finish what He began?

i know i am saved with all confidence because i know He is faithful. i have no confidence in myself nor need confidence in myself; the security of my salvation is dependent on Him who saves me, not me who is being saved.

doubting it would be doubting Him. if it were anything other than this, my confidence and my trust would be in myself rather than in Him.

Because God is faithful and true, it is impossible that salvation can be lost.
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This thread is toxic. False accusations and others saying bad things about me. I’ve been patient with you all and tried to help. Keep your OSAS false doctrine. I’ll have no part of it. If you or anyone ever changes their mind, I’m here as always. Peace to you and @cv5 .
 
Runningman said:
I didn’t say that. When did I say anyone can’t be saved today?

“Today is the day of salvation.”
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is it not your position that eternal life is an uncertain outcome for those who presently have salvation?

it directly follows from that position that just as you do not believe you can be sure the life in you through Christ is eternal neither can you be sure you actually have salvation, but perhaps you only have a deceptive, temporary illusion of salvation.

Salvation and eternal life are inextricably conjoined. He is Salvation; knowing Him is eternal life.
 
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Runningman said:
This thread is toxic. False accusations and others saying bad things about me.
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Oh. I see some of the other posts now. But I did explain to you why it logically appeared to me you don't believe salvation to be a present possession, because of your position on eternal life being uncertain and future.

It also follows from your position on loss of salvation: if it can be lost it is not presently possessed at all - if it is uncertain then it is only a future potentiality of salvation, not an actual salvation.

Friend if you truly believe we can be actually saved "today" then you should not doubt the unshakeable truth of that salvation: that it is real salvation, effective and permanent.
 
posthuman said:
Witnessing that we can have full trust in the faithfulness of God is "toxic"??

Wow, that's a new one.
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Why do you deliberately lie about me? That isn’t what I said. I explained why this thread is toxic. I said it’s because of the false accusations and @cv5 saying bad things about me. I don’t have to take that kind of abuse.
 
You know what? Who cares about the nasty things you all are saying while hiding behind the thinly veiled guise of genuine good will. I am totally not seeing Christ when people say bad things about me or lie or say "there's a gulf fixed between us" and such nonsense like that.

So look at this.

What's this say? You're under grace upon the condition of being led by the Spirit. If you aren't and are doing things like lying and speaking evil about people, that's called an act of the flesh and it puts one under the law. This plainly means salvation can lost.

Galatians 5
16So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. 18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

Romans 6
14For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.
 
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