Obedient Woman
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Women’s obedience to men is not demanded in the Bible. A wife is taught to submit to her own husband, right after both are told to submit to one another out of reverence for Christ.
Bear in mind that much of Scripture is narrative, a record of what did happen, not a record of what should happen. The directive parts (laws, commands) don’t teach the submission of all women to all men.
Bear in mind that much of Scripture is narrative, a record of what did happen, not a record of what should happen. The directive parts (laws, commands) don’t teach the submission of all women to all men.
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No. I see it more as a story about Arab life. In Saudi Arabia, there were Jews, and early Christians. Early Islam happened in Western Arabia. If one studies, you will see elements of Judaism and Christianity in it. About one Quarter of the Koran is about Jesus and Mary. The reason that they struggle with Jesus as the Son of God is that if God (Allah SWT) is the highest God, they feel he can not have a body and cannot procreate. I am not saying I agree but their point of view is interesting.
Hello @Katia, here's an important passage about marriage. It tells spouses what is expected of them/how they are to act in regard to one another in marriage, what their roles are, and what the extent of their commitment to one another is supposed to be. Take note of how much more "ink" was used by the Apostle to instruct us men 
The supreme responsibility of husbands in regard to their wives is to love them with the same unreserved, selfless, and sacrificial love that Christ has for His church. Christ gave everything He had, including His own life, for the sake of His church, and that is the standard of sacrifice for a husband’s love of his wife. ~MacArthur, J., Jr., Commentary on Ephesians
God bless you!
~Deut
The supreme responsibility of husbands in regard to their wives is to love them with the same unreserved, selfless, and sacrificial love that Christ has for His church. Christ gave everything He had, including His own life, for the sake of His church, and that is the standard of sacrifice for a husband’s love of his wife. ~MacArthur, J., Jr., Commentary on Ephesians
Ephesians 5
22 Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord.
23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body.
24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her,
26 so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
27 that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless.
28 So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself;
29 for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church,
30 because we are members of His body.
31 FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND SHALL BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH.
32 This mystery is great; but I am speaking with reference to Christ and the church.
33 Nevertheless, each of you is to love his own wife even as himself, and the wife must see to it that she respects her husband.
God bless you!
~Deut
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Hello @Katia, here's an important passage about marriage. It tells spouses what is expected of them/how they are to act in regard to one another in marriage, what their roles are, and what the extent of their commitment to one another is supposed to be. Take note of how much more "ink" was used by the Apostle to instruct us men
The supreme responsibility of husbands in regard to their wives is to love them with the same unreserved, selfless, and sacrificial love that Christ has for His church. Christ gave everything He had, including His own life, for the sake of His church, and that is the standard of sacrifice for a husband’s love of his wife. ~MacArthur, J., Jr., Commentary on Ephesians
God bless you!
~Deut
The supreme responsibility of husbands in regard to their wives is to love them with the same unreserved, selfless, and sacrificial love that Christ has for His church. Christ gave everything He had, including His own life, for the sake of His church, and that is the standard of sacrifice for a husband’s love of his wife. ~MacArthur, J., Jr., Commentary on Ephesians
Ephesians 5
22 Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord.
23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body.
24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her,
26 so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
27 that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless.
28 So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself;
29 for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church,
30 because we are members of His body.
31 FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND SHALL BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH.
32 This mystery is great; but I am speaking with reference to Christ and the church.
33 Nevertheless, each of you is to love his own wife even as himself, and the wife must see to it that she respects her husband.
God bless you!
~Deut
Hello again Katia, you asked,
The answer is "yes", but Genesis 3:16 does not give us enough information to answer that question, so you'll need to look elsewhere.
On the other hand, the passage that I posited from Ephesians 5 does give us the needed information (see post #9 in this thread), and passages from 1 Corinthians 7, Colossians 3, 1 Peter 3, and others, do as well. Check them out if you are interested
God bless you!
~Deut
The answer is "yes", but Genesis 3:16 does not give us enough information to answer that question, so you'll need to look elsewhere.
On the other hand, the passage that I posited from Ephesians 5 does give us the needed information (see post #9 in this thread), and passages from 1 Corinthians 7, Colossians 3, 1 Peter 3, and others, do as well. Check them out if you are interested
God bless you!
~Deut
1 Peter 3
7 Husbands, in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered.
8 To sum up, all of you be harmonious, sympathetic, brotherly, kindhearted, and humble in spirit.
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The reality is [down where the rubber meets the road] submission needs for EVERYONE to be submitted in accordance with scripture, it is like a chain, if one link is broken then the whole thing breaks down.
If men are not submitted they are not in a strong place to demand submission from womens ... and the kids will go ape.
... isn't that what the situation is in reality?
If men are not submitted they are not in a strong place to demand submission from womens ... and the kids will go ape.
... isn't that what the situation is in reality?
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husbands are called to love thier wives as Christ loves the church with a sacrificial love , protective love ,
“Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.”
Ephesians 5:24-31 KJV
it’s definately mutual if we just say “ wives must submit “ we’re actually distorting it husbands are called to love and cherish thier wives , both are called to love each other and serve the lord as one . A lot of men will reject thier role and just focus on obedience to them but they are meant to forst be subject to Christ and then The wife is meant to willingly become subject to her godly husband o loves and cherishes and provides for her who loves her like Christ loves us all and gave himself for her
I believe when it’s understood you have a godly partnership that’s blessed abundantly in Christ and no one ever needs be the lord over the other because love itself is an act of submission and lifting the other up not pressing them down
I don’t think Scripture is meant to be selectively applied hope this consideration helps
“Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.”
Ephesians 5:24-31 KJV
it’s definately mutual if we just say “ wives must submit “ we’re actually distorting it husbands are called to love and cherish thier wives , both are called to love each other and serve the lord as one . A lot of men will reject thier role and just focus on obedience to them but they are meant to forst be subject to Christ and then The wife is meant to willingly become subject to her godly husband o loves and cherishes and provides for her who loves her like Christ loves us all and gave himself for her
I believe when it’s understood you have a godly partnership that’s blessed abundantly in Christ and no one ever needs be the lord over the other because love itself is an act of submission and lifting the other up not pressing them down
I don’t think Scripture is meant to be selectively applied hope this consideration helps
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Something I notice on forums like these is that I never see Christian men arguing that they do not have to love their wives as Christ loved the church, or try to explain it away.. say means something else... or that it does not apply today. But usually someone will do that with the wives submit to your husbands part.
I also don't see men saying, "I am doing perfectly at loving my wife like Christ loves the church." Occasionally, a wife will say she submits to her husband. The bar for husbands is way high. Many of us are willing not to evaluate our performance publicly and let God judge.
I also don't see men saying, "I am doing perfectly at loving my wife like Christ loves the church." Occasionally, a wife will say she submits to her husband. The bar for husbands is way high. Many of us are willing not to evaluate our performance publicly and let God judge.
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