Not By Works

[eternally-gratefull]

Look at what else he said.

I almost fell out of my chair when I read that!

well it seems he is no longer here.

 

[VCO]

The king was a lot more than the leader of a country. Presidents and Prime Ministers aren't "absolute" sovereigns. The sovereign in America is the individual, with us collectively appointing someone to manage collective interests. But again, there's really no need for such a mention in the context of this conversation. Did you feel the same way when Obama was in office and insert how necessary it was to honor him in random discussions?

YES, after elected, I should honor him, even if he is a Democrat.
I would stand at attention any time "Hail To The Chief" was Played, and would still Salute as he "Passed in Review", even though I am no longer in the Military.

So you think You can Dishonor President Donald Trump, without a Spanking from our Heavenly Father ? ? ?
GUESS AGAIN!

Romans 13:1-7 (NCV)
1 All of you must yield to the government rulers. No one rules unless God has given him the power to rule, and no one rules now without that power from God.
2 So those who are against the government are really against what God has commanded. And they will bring punishment on themselves.
3 Those who do right do not have to fear the rulers; only those who do wrong fear them. Do you want to be unafraid of the rulers? Then do what is right, and they will praise you.
4 The ruler is God’s servant to help you. But if you do wrong, then be afraid. He has the power to punish; he is God’s servant to punish those who do wrong.
5 So you must yield to the government, not only because you might be punished, but because you know it is right.
6 This is also why you pay taxes. Rulers are working for God and give their time to their work.
7 Pay everyone, then, what you owe. If you owe any kind of tax, pay it. Show respect and honor to them all.

 

[mailmandan]

Well that is too bad... people tend to gravitate towards law keeping ... grace the narrow path much harder to find.

There was a SDA who was previously a member of Christian Chat who went by the name of LoveGodForever (and was banned) then came back as 3rdAngel and was banned again. All that guy mainly talked about was keeping the 10 commandments (with a heavy emphasis on keeping the 4th commandment) as the basis or means of obtaining and maintaining salvation. His perverted gospel culminated in "salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works." He once made this statement to me below.

The counterfeit Gospel is out there. What is the other Gospel? It is a Gospel that tries to separate God's Law (10 commandments) from the Cross. It is a Gospel that tries to separate God's 10 commandments from the plan of salvation. God’s Law has always been part of the true Gospel of Christ. The counterfeit Gospel does not have it. God's forever Law (the 10 commandments) is the foundation of both the Old and the New Covenant and the very foundation and basis of the true Gospel of Christ.

 

[Judges1318]

What bothers me is when @Judges1318 and @Phoneman-777 are equating secure salvation/OSAS with license to sin.
As if the two go hand in hand .. they do not.

Yes, they do go hand in hand in the new osas.
In the new osas you have the license to think, do, and believe whatever wrong things you want and you will still be saved.
Even if you don't use it, the new osas says the believer has the license to sin with complete and total impunity in regard to his salvation.
The false premise for the doctrine being, since salvation is by you doing nothing at all, there is nothing at all that you can do to lose it.
They ignore the fact that salvation is not by nothing at all, it's by believing.
Stop believing in the gospel and you lose the salvation that you possessed by that believing:

"2 ...you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you..." - 1 Corinthians 15:1-2

 

[EleventhHour]

Look at what else he said.

I almost fell out of my chair when I read that!

And this to me.....

lightbearer said:
You mean satan. I understand your displeasure and lack of any real content. His spirit in you must be a terrible thing to deal with. Give yourself to God and His Son Jesus Christ and He will rid you of your demon.

 

[G2RBeliever]

Many thanks to some here that are firm but calm and polite.
These that post chapter and verse instead of paraphrasing their beliefs.
God's children will be gathered from many different places and or churches.


Keep the FAITH in Chris Jesus ,He gave ALL for us!

 

[Lightskin]

Taking that completely out of context. Paul was writing to the Roman church that had a problem, they were dividing themselves up between the Jewish believers and the Gentile believers. The law in mind doesn't mean a moral law of right and wrong but a far more limited law of ceremonial offerings and circumcisions. When Jesus spoke of false disciples in Matthew 7, he reproved two attitudes simultaneously. Those who would have no law to rule over them and those who thought through their good works they could impress God. Paul himself, when writing to the Corinthians that he was under Christ's law. And that's an actual, moral law.

God is Love, and Jesus is God, thus Jesus is love. And yet Jesus, with adamant passion, denounced the Pharisees for always shutting out the Kingdom of Heaven against others.

How is it you proclaim Jesus as Lord and Savior yet pigeonhole the very grace He affords to everyone who has faith in Him?

 

[Phoneman-777]

Are you serious??

God needs no proof..

I am never going to get out of here today!! Sigh

Right, God needs no proof. But, still great that God is both our Judge and our Lawyer.

 

[EleventhHour]

Right, God needs no proof. But, still great that God is both our Judge and our Lawyer.

All that is done when we are born again/born from above.

A saved person (meaning they are saved from start to finish, no one looses their salvation) appears before the BEMA seat not the judgment seat.

 

[Phoneman-777]

There is no middle ground

Romans 6:14, "You are not under law but under grace.

15 "What then, shall we sin because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 "Know ye not" (Paul is incredulous that Christians think they can serve sin and go to heaven) "to whom you yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, or obedience unto righteousness."

 

[Phoneman-777]

All that is done when we are born again/born from above.

A saved person (meaning they are saved from start to finish, no one looses their salvation) appears before the BEMA seat not the judgment seat.

Then for what reason does Paul say Christians have to stand before the Judgment seat? Formalities?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

15 "What then, shall we sin because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 "Know ye not" (Paul is incredulous that Christians think they can serve sin and go to heaven) "to whom you yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, or obedience unto righteousness."

death and hades are delievered to Christ for judgment, and all who are delivered will suffer one fate. eternal death

We are ressurected by Christ and are judge for the things we do, and either receive reward or see those rewards burnt

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Then for what reason does Paul say Christians have to stand before the Judgment seat? Formalities?

no because we will

what christian wants to stand in front of God and see all he did burnt to ashes?

 

[EleventhHour]

15 "What then, shall we sin because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 "Know ye not" (Paul is incredulous that Christians think they can serve sin and go to heaven) "to whom you yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, or obedience unto righteousness."

Again "grace" is the sustaining power, the very influence of Christ in the life of the Christian..... not the law.

So of course "under grace" we do not desire sin, grace is the very influence of God in our heart.

This is all of Paul's teaching ..... grace and how grace is the narrow path... exhorting us to draw form Grace/Jesus for profitable Christian life and live the life of Liberty.

Focus on sin and you will sin... grace is the focus not sin, grace restrains sin.

 

[Lightskin]

Are you saying you've never had a situation where someone has commited some injustice against you and you had to swallow your pride and accept that there is injustice for the sake of peace? Seems to me that this would be a universal experience, but you're so saintly that you do it without even a smidge of worldliness. Who is it that is acting like they don't sin, exactly?

You’re saying loving and forgiving people is work? Under certain circumstances, no doubt, but as an overall lifestyle, not at all. And it seems as though you’re equating work with sin in your last sentence. Don’t be so defensive.

 

[Phoneman-777]

I didn't see the responses from you or 11th, but Matt 24:3 is precisely about being saved during the great tribulation (which was in the 1st century)

(Luke 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh)

The context for the above in Luke is when Jerusalem was surrounded by the Roman armies in the war of 66-70 AD

(Luke 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.)

Paul also stated the deliverance was near when he wrote:

(Rom 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.)

(Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.)

Paul stated the day was at hand when he wrote, not 2000 years into his and the Romans' future.

Here's why you're wrong:

Verse 12 is clearly speaking of the spiritual condition - about "agape", which only the saints possess, growing cold and dead.

Verse 13 is connected to verse 12 by the coordinating conjunction "but" which is placed between words, phrases, or clauses of equal rank and importance. The verse, therefore, continues the context of spiritual condition.

God could care less about a bag of bones that is but a momentary vapor bound for the slaughter all the day long. He's got new models waiting for Christians who don't backslide ito Fire Lake.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You’re saying loving and forgiving people is work? Under certain circumstances, no doubt, but as an overall lifestyle, not at all. And it seems as though you’re equating work with sin in your last sentence. Don’t be so defensive.

i do not seem to remember Jesus thinking loving others was work.

 

[Phoneman-777]

death and hades are delievered to Christ for judgment, and all who are delivered will suffer one fate. eternal death

We are ressurected by Christ and are judge for the things we do, and either receive reward or see those rewards burnt

We are presently judges of church affairs...we are not presently judges of eternal fates of sinners/devils - that is at the end.

We must first stand before the Judgment Seat of Christ and be found faithful, after which we will judge sinners.

 

[SoulWeaver]

All that is done when we are born again/born from above.

A saved person (meaning they are saved from start to finish, no one looses their salvation) appears before the BEMA seat not the judgment seat.

That, and also who will accuse before Christ when the accuser of brethren was cast down... whoever is saved belongs to the brethren. So shall satan return to Heaven to accuse brethren? Jesus is not an accuser, God convicts, accuse is something satan does. How can anyone attribute it to Jesus.

"Woman, where are your accusers?"

 

[EleventhHour]

He should change his name to NONlightbearer.............because what he peddles does not in any way, shape or form set forth LIGHT.......

Yes that became completely evident yesterday....

To me ...

You mean satan. I understand your displeasure and lack of any real content. His spirit in you must be a terrible thing to deal with. Give yourself to God and His Son Jesus Christ and He will rid you of your demon.

Child of the devil actually. Sad
You should call all your cohorts. Call them by name; Legion

To us...

OSAS is a doctrine of satan. And all who follow and teach it are of Satan and His legion