Not By Works

[dcontroversal]

Can their faith save them?

your context is off

He does say or imply "that" in Greek, not "their" right?

 

[dcontroversal]

the audience is said in first verse of st.james letter, to the twelve tribes of israel scattered abroad. that should make it even easier to know who its directed to

100% agree....

 

[dcontroversal]

That’s why if one claims to,have faith. Yet has zero zip nada works the rest of his life.

his faith is dead..

can that faith (lack of) save him?

Jesus said the work of the Father is to believe on him whom he has sent ..

Does not a saved child of GOD have one work or not<--The work of the Heavenly Father....yes or no

and

To him that WORKS NOT, BUT BELIEVES on him that justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited to righteousness

Is he saved and has his faith BEEN CREDITED TO RIGHTEOUSNESS (JUSTIFIED) yes or no

so.....If one has worked the works of the Heavenly Father and DOES NOT WORK but has had faith which is credited to righteousness are they saved? Yes or No?

 

[dcontroversal]

so you think a child of God can live in sin, even though John said whoever does has never seen or known God? You scare me sometimes sis

I do not think she is saying that migo....

The implication is....the spirit born of God does not sin while the flesh is dead in sin and can do nothing but sin...you have said yourself that we all sin everyday in some form or fashion...I know from her posts she believes in ongoing sanctification which is a process of growth and maturity and at different levels in every true believer.....IMO it would be vain or foolish to disregard the high probility that there are some that have been truely born again, yet due to a lack of teaching or growth remain stunted and immature while struggling every day of their lives with the particular sins that beset their race......and there is a balance to be struck for sure, but we cannot alleviate the absolute truth that MANY will have works of wood, hay and stubble that get crispy fried yet they themselves are saved.......

 

[dcontroversal]

GLAD I aint the only one to notice EleventhHour is in some SERIOUS error. This is exactly why I said in my previous post about a week ago or something that SHE JUST PROVED all the OSAS opponents right by claiming what she did. WAY TO GO! All their criticism is actually CORRECT in the case of EleventhHour. BUT HEY, im placing my bet on the fact that she is so far in error that she will NEVER give up this false doctrine, which is why I wont be debating it, there is no debate or no discussion to be had its a SEALED deal and simple Scripture will prove her theory wrong, but what can ya do when its either ignored or twisted.

LUCKY FOR ME: I dont hold to that view, I hold to PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS. Eternal security of the believer, I believe in the GOD who gets thing DONE and is sanctifying His people not MAYBE sanctifying, not TRYING to sanctify, but actually succeeds!

Explain works of wood, hay and stubble that get burnt yet they are saved by the skin of their teeth--> so as by fire!

 

[EleventhHour]

Gotta love it. Well maybe one of you will bend or you can reach some antinomian (i mean uhh... free grace cause thats what grace totally is right eleventhhour?) compromise?

To hold to that ones gotta be ABSOLUTELY spiritually and mentally FRIED.

https://christianchat.com/threads/not-by-works.146296/post-4119995 For those interested in what the original perseverance of the saints was as taught by the reformers, not modern day loser teachers who will never amount to anything.

Do not accuse me of lawlessness....or that I promote lawlessness.
You know nothing about me.

 

[EleventhHour]

Gotta love it. Well maybe one of you will bend or you can reach some antinomian (i mean uhh... free grace cause thats what grace totally is right eleventhhour?) compromise?

To hold to that ones gotta be ABSOLUTELY spiritually and mentally FRIED.

https://christianchat.com/threads/not-by-works.146296/post-4119995 For those interested in what the original perseverance of the saints was as taught by the reformers, not modern day loser teachers who will never amount to anything.

Thank you ... you are so kind. .. sad you also equate grace as a license to sin.

All sin was dealt with at the cross...that is a truth I do not have a problem with...but law keepers do.

 

[EleventhHour]

I do not think she is saying that migo....

The implication is....the spirit born of God does not sin while the flesh is dead in sin and can do nothing but sin...you have said yourself that we all sin everyday in some form or fashion...I know from her posts she believes in ongoing sanctification which is a process of growth and maturity and at different levels in every true believer.....IMO it would be vain or foolish to disregard the high probility that there are some that have been truely born again, yet due to a lack of teaching or growth remain stunted and immature while struggling every day of their lives with the particular sins that beset their race......and there is a balance to be struck for sure, but we cannot alleviate the absolute truth that MANY will have works of wood, hay and stubble that get crispy fried yet they themselves are saved.......

Yes that is my point. Thank you.

 

[EleventhHour]

Lordship salvation teaches a person must do works, not that they Willard if people do not live a certain way, they must not be saved, I do not teach this.

if your gonna tell people like PS Chris and others a child of God will never do works and thus can live in sin and still be saved.

ugh!

I am very glad you do not follow that teaching. Maybe we are not understanding each other to some extent...discussion boards have their limitations.

Know this as someone has chosen to wrongly malign me I do not preach lawlessness....grace can never be equated to lawlessness that is just plain wrong.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jesus covers this....by FAITH we have done the WORK of the Heavenly Father.......

It’s the work of God we believe

Faith is not our work it’s Gods work in us

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jesus said the work of the Father is to believe on him whom he has sent ..

Does not a saved child of GOD have one work or not<--The work of the Heavenly Father....yes or no

and

To him that WORKS NOT, BUT BELIEVES on him that justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited to righteousness

Is he saved and has his faith BEEN CREDITED TO RIGHTEOUSNESS (JUSTIFIED) yes or no

so.....If one has worked the works of the Heavenly Father and DOES NOT WORK but has had faith which is credited to righteousness are they saved? Yes or No?

Sorry bro I have no idea what your trying to say, can you try to rephrase, you seem to be talking presalvation. I am talking post. As is James

Question, Can a child of God live in sin?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I have said 50 times we cannot alleviate that statement in James as that IS THE COMPARISON he makes....and it is directed at the JEWS which have the same issue to this very day....THEY, just like demons, BELIEVE IN GOD, but do not posses saving faith INTO CHRIST....it blows my mind how many side step this OBVIOUS truth from James!

Yes
they have a claimed faith. But unlike most Jews. These Jews went the other extreme. Instead of legal is they went licentious

 

[eternally-gratefull]

the audience is said in first verse of st.james letter, to the twelve tribes of israel scattered abroad. that should make it even easier to know who its directed to

Ya still have to get context
rom 4 was a fight against Jews also. But appears to say the opposite
the question is why

 

[eternally-gratefull]

He does say or imply "that" in Greek, not "their" right?

Does it matter
can that claimed faith save them
who claimed to have that faith?

Those who were hearers and not diets bruise who hade mere belief yet never trusted god with saving faith

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I do not think she is saying that migo....

The implication is....the spirit born of God does not sin while the flesh is dead in sin and can do nothing but sin...you have said yourself that we all sin everyday in some form or fashion...I know from her posts she believes in ongoing sanctification which is a process of growth and maturity and at different levels in every true believer.....IMO it would be vain or foolish to disregard the high probility that there are some that have been truely born again, yet due to a lack of teaching or growth remain stunted and immature while struggling every day of their lives with the particular sins that beset their race......and there is a balance to be struck for sure, but we cannot alleviate the absolute truth that MANY will have works of wood, hay and stubble that get crispy fried yet they themselves are saved.......

I know she is not

But that’s what she claimed

I think the issue is what is living in sin

A child of god can’t. Why?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Explain works of wood, hay and stubble that get burnt yet they are saved by the skin of their teeth--> so as by fire!

Yet the still had at least one work according to James

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I am very glad you do not follow that teaching. Maybe we are not understanding each other to some extent...discussion boards have their limitations.

Know this as someone has chosen to wrongly malign me I do not preach lawlessness....grace can never be equated to lawlessness that is just plain wrong.

I know you don’t sis

 

[EleventhHour]

GLAD I aint the only one to notice EleventhHour is in some SERIOUS error. This is exactly why I said in my previous post about a week ago or something that SHE JUST PROVED all the OSAS opponents right by claiming what she did. WAY TO GO! All their criticism is actually CORRECT in the case of EleventhHour. BUT HEY, im placing my bet on the fact that she is so far in error that she will NEVER give up this false doctrine, which is why I wont be debating it, there is no debate or no discussion to be had its a SEALED deal and simple Scripture will prove her theory wrong, but what can ya do when its either ignored or twisted.

LUCKY FOR ME: I dont hold to that view, I hold to PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS. Eternal security of the believer, I believe in the GOD who gets thing DONE and is sanctifying His people not MAYBE sanctifying, not TRYING to sanctify, but actually succeeds!

Good for you.....too bad scripture does not support that we are robots.

 

[JohnW34]

Blah blah....nice way to skirt the question....it's ok WD-40.......you have been consigned to the NO TRUTH OR FRAUDULENT TRUTH group......not worth time engaging you and having you drag Jesus and the truth through the mud of selfism.......!

Thank you for the response, it just confirms you have nothing to say about the issues.
The issues are God sending John the Baptist to make straight the path of Israel.
Repentance followed by baptism for the forgiveness of sins.

Jesus also forgave people their sins by telling them their sins were forgiven.

Now if forgiving sins and walking the straight path is Gods reality, then claiming sin turns
us to need Christ and can never be resolved is wrong.

Put another way if Zechariah and Elizabeth were righteous and blameless, so can we be walking
in the Holy Spirit.

And to Jesus goes all the glory to make the impossible possible.

 

[JohnW34]

Addiction is addiction regardless of its impact.

Romans 6:22-23
But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life.
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord

Being set free from sin, is this learning the causes of addiction and avoiding it, rather than addiction being removed. God promises strength through our limitations and weaknesses, love and our faith conquering all.