Not By Works

[FollowHisSteps]

Thank you Mr. FHS.
I knew your bad intentions all along ...so do not believe for one Milli-second you have outsmarted me.
Lordship salvation is behaviour modification salvation and not the Gospel.
Salvation is a gift and the new birth/birthed from above is necessary.
You reveal you deceptive ways once again. This is why I choose my friends wisely.

I am sorry, bad intentions?

20 I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.
Acts 26

Truly you have a different faith. God bless you.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I am sorry, bad intentions?
20 I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.
Acts 26
Truly you have a different faith. God bless you.

A new morality. One has bad intentions and is deceptive sharing the saving gospel of repentance
and faith in Christ on a christian forum, where this theology is literally the theology of the church
and the body of Christ.

Deception is also to quote scripture that teaches and proclaims this same gospel.
You have to wonder what mental gymnastics and delusions you have to do to make someone
evil like this and also claim to follow Jesus.

No wonder many forums have problems knowing what to do with people like this.
In Christ we forgive, show love, and wonder what is going on, and can people caught in such
a contorted social framework ever find a way out. I do not know, but the Lord does, thankfully
I can leave it all in His hands.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Thank you Mr. FHS.

I knew your bad intentions all along ...so do not believe for one Milli-second you have outsmarted me.

Lordship salvation is behaviour modification salvation and not the Gospel.

Salvation is a gift and the new birth/birthed from above is necessary.

You reveal you deceptive ways once again. This is why I choose my friends wisely.

These people think they are right, no matter what, So they can never hear the actual words you say, they can only here what they think you are saying..

 

[UnderGrace]

These people think they are right, no matter what, So they can never hear the actual words you say, they can only here what they think you are saying..

Yes along with the ole "bait and switch"..... some say they never heard of Calvin til they came to CC... I never experienced the bait and switch tactic til I came here.

Calculated and planned, it would seem.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes along with the ole "bait and switch"..... some say they never heard of Calvin til they came to CC... I never experienced the bait and switch tactic til I came here.

Calculated and planned, it would seem.

I have been and seen some churches do some bad things in how they program their people. But I never imagined half the stuff I see in here could be seen in a place which people claim to be christian. (Not the site, but th people in the site.

 

[BillG]

Can't use quote function for some reason so will have copy paste the quote you responded to @UnderGrace which was.

"Please lay out the plan of salvation that you once believed and have now abandoned.... stating "OSAS" is not enough information to support the credibilty of your initial statement."

Hi UnderGrace,

Thank you for going through your testimony, in part.
It sounds like you never had a conviction of sin and your debt to Jesus, you just wanted salvation.
And you changed your mind, so now you have salvation.

This does not sound like a christian conversion experience at all, or anything most believers would
recognise. We have something developed many years ago called the 4 spiritual laws.

1. God loves you and created you to know Him personally.
2. Man is sinful and separated from God, so we cannot know Him personally or experience His love.
3.Jesus Christ is God's only provision for man's sin. Through Him alone we can know God personally and experience God's love.
4. We must individually receive Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord; then we can know God personally and experience His love.

http://www.4laws.com/laws/englishkgp/default.htm

This is a basic outline of leading someone to Christ, which I have followed with folk over many years.
It is our walk in Jesus and our way as believers.

Now it is not for me to judge another, or even to know where they are, just to share what I know and how
the Lord has worked in my heart.

The great thing about this, is admitting our need for change, and knowing Jesus has the power to bring
this about. Praise the Lord.

So dear undergrace, I am always open, always loving, always willing to understand and empathise, but
my calling and obedience is to Jesus and His word, Amen.

How on earth have you come the conclusion you have posted above?

You say. "It sounds like YOU never had a conviction of sin and your debt to Jesus, you just wanted salvation"
Then you say "you have changed your mind and now have salvation"
Then you say. "This does not sound like a christian conversion experience at all, or anything most believers would recognise"

Then YOU say it's not for you to judge another.
Now it seems there is judgement there.
You need to correct or clarify what you are trying to convey.

Also in the quote you responded there is nothing I can see that in any way shape or form where she has given her testimony in part.
She was asking a fellow member concerning OSAS.

IS OSAS ALL you saw and nothing else?

 

[UnderGrace]

Can't use quote function for some reason so will have copy paste the quote you responded to @UnderGrace which was.

"Please lay out the plan of salvation that you once believed and have now abandoned.... stating "OSAS" is not enough information to support the credibilty of your initial statement."




How on earth have you come the conclusion you have posted above?

You say. "It sounds like YOU never had a conviction of sin and your debt to Jesus, you just wanted salvation"
Then you say "you have changed your mind and now have salvation"
Then you say. "This does not sound like a christian conversion experience at all, or anything most believers would recognise"

Then YOU say it's not for you to judge another.
Now it seems there is judgement there.
You need to correct or clarify what you are trying to convey.

Also in the quote you responded there is nothing I can see that in any way shape or form where she has given her testimony in part.
She was asking a fellow member concerning OSAS.

IS OSAS ALL you saw and nothing else?

Thank you BillG you are very kind ...... you can see how he obviously waited to make his "grand statement" that I had not really been redeemed or converted.

My doctrine is right, Romans 4:4 tells me so.

Sad that I took someone off ignore which I rarely do, once they are ignore they never come off, I shake the dust off my feet and move on (that is the Italian in me LOL).

Lesson learned.

 

[UnderGrace]

I have been and seen some churches do some bad things in how they program their people. But I never imagined half the stuff I see in here could be seen in a place which people claim to be christian. (Not the site, but th people in the site.

So true EG, after taking time off... it was only a very small handful of people, actually the ones that hang out on this thread that prompted me to login once again.

I do not mind the straight up front people, perhaps sometimes brash, but those that act so kind and then turn on a dime, just to show how they can one up you.... really sad indeed.

 

[Rosemaryx]

So true EG, after taking time off... it was only a very small handful of people, actually the ones that hang out on this thread that prompted me to login once again.

I do not mind the straight up front people, perhaps sometimes brash, but those that act so kind and then turn on a dime, just to show how they can one up you.... really sad indeed.

I noticed that to...
I was quite shocked at one lady , but not even sure if she is here anymore...xox...

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Can't use quote function for some reason so will have copy paste the quote you responded to @UnderGrace which was.

"Please lay out the plan of salvation that you once believed and have now abandoned.... stating "OSAS" is not enough information to support the credibilty of your initial statement."

How on earth have you come the conclusion you have posted above?

You say. "It sounds like YOU never had a conviction of sin and your debt to Jesus, you just wanted salvation"
Then you say "you have changed your mind and now have salvation"
Then you say. "This does not sound like a christian conversion experience at all, or anything most believers would recognise"

Then YOU say it's not for you to judge another.
Now it seems there is judgement there.
You need to correct or clarify what you are trying to convey.

Also in the quote you responded there is nothing I can see that in any way shape or form where she has given her testimony in part.
She was asking a fellow member concerning OSAS.

IS OSAS ALL you saw and nothing else?

Yesterday I asked UG what here testimony was.
She had stated that we are more immortally at a specific point in time, and that was important.
I said walking in faith with Jesus was the focus, not a particular point in time when you started.
She replied that I was wrong.
Over 5 posts she gave her testimony, but then missed the end point.
So I responded with the 4 spiritual laws.

The problem with this approach is coming to faith is specific to repentance, confession and trust
in the cross for the forgiveness of sins. It is what evangelists use as their introduction to faith.

So it is not unreasonable for me to describe according to this view, someone has not come to faith.

Now I realise in this forum, with this odd view of faith and coming to faith, I will be told a lot of
things. But anyway this is the summary

Thank you, then I am steadfast for the faith!!!
I am absolutely and completely persuaded that I am saved once and for eternity, this from when I was born again at twenty-one, I have never doubted.

I have learned that my testimony only has value for those with an open mind and heart.... are you open?

If this were true, then why to you take a stand against truth?
I can share that my testimony is different than most in that I did not regard myself as a sinner, I led a very wholesome life, had a wonderful childhood, plenty of friends, loving family, studying in University, really I had everything going for me.
But God was a mystery ... are you still with me FHS?

I was seeking after God..... because in my rational mind I believed that if God was real, which I believed He was, He should be knowable... after all I knew Jesus had told his disciples that He would be with them always.... but Jesus did not seem to be with me.
I asked everyone I knew the meaning of life, yet no one had a satisfactory answer.
I was having the same discussion with many students, day after day, at school for hours people came and went, I skipped all my classes ... then a person lingering around the table and listening asked if he could join in, I said sure, soon as he sat down I knew he knew something I had yet to be told.
Remember Mr. FHS.... I was that person trying to be good to assure my salvation.
Still open Mr FHS?

Not sure about the friend part, as my mom always taught me to choose my friends wisely.... Good advice I might add.
I am simplifying things a bit, since there were some other factors at play that were causing my desperate search but I amt so inclined to get into all the details.
Anyway... he explained "metanoia" ( the real metanoia, not contrition for sin) and not matter how sinless I thought I was I could never meet God's absolute standard.... the only thing I could so was accept by faith God's free gift of salvation earned for me by Jesus on the cross.
I knew what he spoke was truth... although I only understood in part.
People had been telling me all semester that I was overly concerned about salvation that I should just enjoy life and then here comes someone who tells me yes salvation/sin is absolutely a concern, but the problem has been solved.
Here I am thinking all these years I better be good and it was possible to be good to WOW.....I can never be good enough to merit salvation.
That Mr. FHS is a radical mind shift...have you had that radical mind shift?
not done yet...

You know what this young stranger told me.... that I needed to be born again.
My response, "How exactly can I do that?"
He said, "You can't but God can."
First of all we can only be born again when we come to God on His terms..... do you know what those terms are Mr. FHS?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So true EG, after taking time off... it was only a very small handful of people, actually the ones that hang out on this thread that prompted me to login once again.

I do not mind the straight up front people, perhaps sometimes brash, but those that act so kind and then turn on a dime, just to show how they can one up you.... really sad indeed.

Yes only a few. Most people are kind. Even if we disagree.

 

[UnderGrace]

Yes only a few. Most people are kind. Even if we disagree.

If you say so, but I am thinking I am pretty much done.

 

[BillG]

Yesterday I asked UG what here testimony was.
She had stated that we are more immortally at a specific point in time, and that was important.
I said walking in faith with Jesus was the focus, not a particular point in time when you started.
She replied that I was wrong.
Over 5 posts she gave her testimony, but then missed the end point.
So I responded with the 4 spiritual laws.

The problem with this approach is coming to faith is specific to repentance, confession and trust
in the cross for the forgiveness of sins. It is what evangelists use as their introduction to faith.

So it is not unreasonable for me to describe according to this view, someone has not come to faith.

Now I realise in this forum, with this odd view of faith and coming to faith, I will be told a lot of
things. But anyway this is the summary

Then quote her quotes that you are responding to rather than the one you did quote.
It had no bearing on what you responded with.

Above you have quoted her posts that you have responded to.

So to me based on the original quote you posted it looked like you were looking for an opportunity to go at her and all you saw was OSAS, now is my chance.
That to me is how it came across.

I can't answer for @UnderGrace but only myself.

Either way my point I tried to make still stands.
You said you are not here to judge but in fact you did even after you quoting the quotes you meant to respond to.


Back to post 105,806

 

[FollowHisSteps]

There is a simple problem, if you come to chastise and put straight other in regard to their
eternal destination, the foundation of their faith, and their experience in Christ, expect to be challenged.

This is not a beat people up, and expect them to roll over and die situation.

Gods word is

12 For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double--edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
13 Nothing in all creation is hidden from God's sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
Heb 4

In Christ we have our foundation through the cross.
Everyone can find rest here, Amen.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Then quote her quotes that you are responding to rather than the one you did quote.
It had no bearing on what you responded with.

Above you have quoted her posts that you have responded to.

So to me based on the original quote you posted it looked like you were looking for an opportunity to go at her and all you saw was OSAS, now is my chance.
That to me is how it came across.

I can't answer for @UnderGrace but only myself.

Either way my point I tried to make still stands.
You said you are not here to judge but in fact you did even after you quoting the quotes you meant to respond to.


Back to post 105,806

He misquoted her then misinterpreted he like he does all the time

 

[eternally-gratefull]

If you say so, but I am thinking I am pretty much done.

Can’t much say I blame you sis

 

[BillG]

There is a simple problem, if you come to chastise and put straight other in regard to their
eternal destination, the foundation of their faith, and their experience in Christ, expect to be challenged.

This is not a beat people up, and expect them to roll over and die situation.

Gods word is

12 For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double--edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
13 Nothing in all creation is hidden from God's sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
Heb 4

In Christ we have our foundation through the cross.
Everyone can find rest here, Amen.

That may be true.
But we must not judge and assume what we think based on our theological bent another person's walk with Jesus.

The main point is OUR WALK WITH JESUS.

Why?

Because we love him and want to be like him and honour our Father.
The Father who we can come before as a result of faith in Jesus.

 

[UnderGrace]

Salvation is a free gift and salvation is not discipleship.
To be saved we must be born from above
There are no wages due to God for salvation..................that is grace
Obviously some people have yet to understand Grace and what a gift is.

Romans 5:15-18:

But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many. And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification. For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

 

[UnderGrace]

That may be true.
But we must not judge and assume what we think based on our theological bent another person's walk with Jesus.

The main point is OUR WALK WITH JESUS.

Why?

Because we love him and want to be like him and honour our Father.
The Father who we can come before as a result of faith in Jesus.

While I do not disagree with you
that is the starting point is we need to be "born from above" otherwise there is no walk with Jesus.

And much like @dCon I make no apologies for promoting Grace which is gift apart from works and is not given based upon our promise of discipleship but is given based upon our belief (the type taught in scripture) in the work of Christ Jesus.

Salvation is not a reward for good works end of story!!

I fully understand Paul now and his frustrations seen in his letters, that some would be so bold and arrogant as to put God in their debt.

 

[BillG]

While I do not disagree with you
that is the starting point is we need to be "born from above" otherwise there is no walk with Jesus.

And much like @dCon I make no apologies for promoting Grace which is gift apart from works and is not given based upon our promise of discipleship but is given based upon our belief (the type taught in scripture) in the work of Christ Jesus.

Salvation is not a reward for good works end of story!!

I fully understand Paul now and his frustrations seen in his letters, that some would be so bold and arrogant as to put God in their debt.

Ooh the smiley at the end of a sentence.

I totally agree with you.
Unless we are born from above there is no walk with Jesus
Because works are useless because we do not know him
It's faith that saves.

But we are called to disciple.

I will never detract from saved by grace through faith.
Grace is free to us but it cost Jesus.