Not By Works

[Speak2Me]

In James 2:14, we read of one who says-claims he has faith but has no works (to back up his claim). This is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" He is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith.

James is speaking to christians about what living faith is & isn't.

These works are part of the MORAL aspect of the law. In Matthew 22:37-40, we read: Jesus said to him, 'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets. These works cannot be dissected from the two great commandments (Matthew 22:37-40) which are found in the law of Moses (Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18).

While keeping these two correctly will cause you to keep the others, that doesn't leave us with only two commandments to keep. Breaking any other commandment (adultery, murder, etc.) will cause you to break the laws of love. The NT teaches many commandments that the church should keep.

 

[Magenta]

... Yes i do not think the poster understands what is to be in faith.

If one has faith he will not do habitual sin and if believer happens to do sin he/she will seek forgiveness from lord.

All sins are forgiven in faith..

If you think you can sin all the time do evil be against lord.... well then most likely.. you have no faith...

It is an abhorrent antithesis such people set up for others, saying on the one hand you must obey the commandments while they themselves don't, while also saying if you believe in saving grace you agree with free license to sin. It is a cleverly contrived lie, but not so clever as to be not seen for what it really is.

 

[Speak2Me]

PHart's wording is off, which shows just how easy it is to have a false gospel message.

It isn't that a person MUST CONTINUE to believe, as if this were some effort on their part. Faith is first God's gift. Secondly, salvation in all of its phases is secured and irrevocable as per Romans 8:28-39. To believe in vain is not to have truly believed.

That a believer believes until the end is redundant, it is what a true convert does, it is what God does in them and through them, Philippians 1:6 &c. There is not one verse of Scripture that shows any person ever lost salvation. Depart from the faith? Yes. That is not loss of salvation.

PHart makes all this about what a person must do with effort or the person will not make it into heaven. Frankly, his asinine obsession with this effort is disturbing. It is to the point of being mental.

The workers have tricked themselves by misinterpretation into believing their efforts are not works. It's like:

"Concentrate really hard now, today, keep believing! Don't stop! Concentrate! CAREFUL!!!!!!!!! Do you believe now? Right now? In 5 minutes? Tomorrow????? CAREFUL!!! Hey, don't stop believing!!!!! Are you sure you believe????? Did you STOP? Watch out!!!!! Careful!!! Do you believe like RIGHT NOW????? 2018 is coming, better make a RESOLUTION to NOT STOP BELIEVING the WHOLE year!!! 2018 could be the year you STOP believing and then you're going to HELL pal!!! If you wake up tomorrow and don't believe, it is hell for you!!!!"

Not to mention the person also has to do something "really stupid" according to PHart's PHalse gospel.

Just imagine the "freedom" in the above paranoia and misunderstanding of texts such as 1 Corinthians 15:2 to which he has misused to arrive where he is. No thanks, I'll pass on that PHalse gospel.

Yep. PHart; perpetually trying to sift the wheat from the wheat and divide the sheep from the sheep.

So mocking another member is the Christlike way to reach them? That is godly discussion? Before you blame the other guy, your responsibility is to God first.
I'm trying to come up with a reason to believe this teaching when its proponents mock and condemn, & dump their likes on such a mess as this.
Some people simply have no shame.

 

[preacher4truth]

So mocking another member is the Christlike way to reach them? That is godly discussion? Before you blame the other guy, your responsibility is to God first.
I'm trying to come up with a reason to believe this teaching when its proponents mock and condemn, & dump their likes on such a mess as this.
Some people simply have no shame.

Hey, welcome back. Again!

I don't believe you when you say you're trying to believe it. Seems like pretense to me, a chance to garner sympathy while bashing others in the process. Seems frankly to be your m.o.

Funny thing is I see false teachers mocked throughout Scripture. NT/OT. Perhaps you need to become better acquainted with that?

 

[PennEd]

I warned you he would do it:

Hmm.. You've been here a week yet you know what DC is gonna say?

There seems to be a couple of "newcomers" that have jumped right in the fray, almost as if they've been here all along! And guess what position they have taken, and who they praise?
But that CAN'T be the case! huh?

 

[preacher4truth]

Hmm.. You've been here a week yet you know what DC is gonna say?

There seems to be a couple of "newcomers" that have jumped right in the fray, almost as if they've been here all along! And guess what position they have taken, and who they praise?
But that CAN'T be the case! huh?

They're back, been here before, same song and dance. Some of them (above) took right back up where they left off, in attack mode, name calling mode, after a few pretense posts, but then right back to their objective.

 

[mailmandan]

James is speaking to christians about what living faith is & isn't.
While keeping these two correctly will cause you to keep the others, that doesn't leave us with only two commandments to keep. Breaking any other commandment (adultery, murder, etc.) will cause you to break the laws of love. The NT teaches many commandments that the church should keep.

Living faith is evidenced by works. Dead faith that produces no works is merely an empty profession of faith and is not living faith. Only genuine believers have living faith. The laws of love are summed up in the two great commandments. BTW the word “keep” does not imply sinless, absolute, perfect obedience 100% of the time as sinless, perfectionists teach.

 

[dcontroversal]

Hmm.. You've been here a week yet you know what DC is gonna say?

There seems to be a couple of "newcomers" that have jumped right in the fray, almost as if they've been here all along! And guess what position they have taken, and who they praise?
But that CAN'T be the case! huh?

Exactly what I was thinking................

 

[dcontroversal]

Living faith is evidenced by works. Dead faith that produces no works is merely an empty profession of faith and is not living faith. Only genuine believers have living faith. The laws of love are summed up in the two great commandments. BTW the word “keep” does not imply sinless, absolute, perfect obedience 100% of the time as sinless, perfectionists teach.

Amen....and I must reiterate....ANY and ALL who have exercised genuine faith into Jesus for a total and complete, eternal salvation have already done the will and works of the Heavenly Father which is to BELIEVE on him whom he hath sent......!!!!!

 

[loveme1]

Amen....and I must reiterate....ANY and ALL who have exercised genuine faith into Jesus for a total and complete, eternal salvation have already done the will and works of the Heavenly Father which is to BELIEVE on him whom he hath sent......!!!!!

So you have a crown you run the race.. what now for you dc? Hang out until you die or the Last Trump and you put on the immortal.. it makes for a good speech but the Lord's Word refutes you for those that believe in Him have much to do while they abide... for those that believe are to work according to the Lord you say you believe on..

Now the Messiah found many were falling short of His standard and warns that they will not make the cut.. yet they were believers and by your thought should of been home dry... but it is not so and may you stop your quest.. and seek the Truth in full by believing the Everlasting Gospel.

Christ came to forgive and reconcile us.. to purge us and make us worthy to walk with Him in white...

 

[dcontroversal]

So you have a crown you run the race.. what now for you dc? Hang out until you die or the Last Trump and you put on the immortal.. it makes for a good speech but the Lord's Word refutes you for those that believe in Him have much to do while they abide... for those that believe are to work according to the Lord you say you believe on..

Now the Messiah found many were falling short of His standard and warns that they will not make the cut.. yet they were believers and by your thought should of been home dry... but it is not so and may you stop your quest.. and seek the Truth in full by believing the Everlasting Gospel.

Christ came to forgive and reconcile us.. to purge us and make us worthy to walk with Him in white...

You must be as dense as lead.....I never said nor implied what you imply.....one would think that you could understand English......and my statement was factual....how about just agree and like it instead of embellishing it with your own implied understanding!!

 

[VCO]

AMEN.....Jesus begins, finishes and completes.....these three words alone dispel his ridiculous stance that a believer MUST KEEP himself saved when it comes to faith......!

And have you noticed, that those who want their righteous deeds to count as their earned righteousness, NEVER MENTION that they do those Deeds to show their LOVE FOR HIM?



John 14:15 (HCSB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] “If you love Me, you will keep My commands.



Thus the only Pure motive for Obedience is because we LOVE HIM.


1 John 3:14 (CSBBible)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] We know that we have passed from death to life because we love our brothers and sisters. The one who does not love remains in death. {Euphemism for "IS NOT BORN AGAIN".}

 

[loveme1]

You must be as dense as lead.....I never said nor implied what you imply.....one would think that you could understand English......and my statement was factual....how about just agree and like it instead of embellishing it with your own implied understanding!!

I may be as dense as lead.. and you may be more intelligent.. but it is so that believers were given warnings to Repent and believe.. to do works that He will find perfect.. or to stop partaking in certain behaviour.. to be found worthy to walk in white with Him.. some were told they had forgotten their First love.. So much to hear...

 

[dcontroversal]

I may be as dense as lead.. and you may be more intelligent.. but it is so that believers were given warnings to Repent and believe.. to do works that He will find perfect.. or to stop partaking in certain behaviour.. to be found worthy to walk in white with Him.. some were told they had forgotten their First love.. So much to hear...

I have never pushed a do nothing religion and have stated many times a believer will bear fruit and work...my contention has always been that the fruit and works are the result of the faith and salvation one already possesses in Christ.....NOT FOR SALVATION...TO GET...KEEP OR MAINTAIN IT.....

 

[loveme1]

I have never pushed a do nothing religion and have stated many times a believer will bear fruit and work...my contention has always been that the fruit and works are the result of the faith and salvation one already possesses in Christ.....NOT FOR SALVATION...TO GET...KEEP OR MAINTAIN IT.....

The believer is saved by Grace through Faith unto good works(absolute).. so you are eternally secure but those other believers works or lack of could result in them not being worthy to walk in white or others had more to do to be granted to sit with Him in His throne..

So your last capped line seems to be at odds..

Until we have been given the right to the Tree of life we are to Labour in love.. we have work of Faith.. we have our hope in our Lord... whom taught us what good works He wants us to do...

 

[TruthTalk]

So you have a crown you run the race.. "what now for you dc? Hang out until you die" or the Last Trump and you put on the immortal.. it makes for a good speech but the Lord's Word refutes you for those that believe in Him have much to do while they abide... for those that believe are to work according to the Lord you say you believe on..

Now the Messiah found many were falling short of His standard and warns that they will not make the cut.. yet they were believers and by your thought should of been home dry... but it is not so and may you stop your quest.. and seek the Truth in full by believing the Everlasting Gospel.

Christ came to forgive and reconcile us.. to purge us and make us worthy to walk with Him in white...

Our "Sanctification", is a life long pursuit of holy living, separation from the world and service and worship to our Heavenly Father. As usual your insults are earthly, foolish and make no sense at all, you are just trying to disqualify a true believer. Not an honorable endeavor.

Another shameful post

 

[loveme1]

And have you noticed, that those who want their righteous deeds to count as their earned righteousness, NEVER MENTION that they do those Deeds to show their LOVE FOR HIM?



John 14:15 (HCSB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] “If you love Me, you will keep My commands.



Thus the only Pure motive for Obedience is because we LOVE HIM.


1 John 3:14 (CSBBible)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] We know that we have passed from death to life because we love our brothers and sisters. The one who does not love remains in death. {Euphemism for "IS NOT BORN AGAIN".}

I really think that is a little short of what so many have said always... but no matter.. the main thing is the Truth is shared..

 

[LoveGodForever]

Here is a bit of info on these pushing SDA doctrine, such as LoveGodForever who deny this while claiming to be non-denominational:

"SDAs use an effective, but deceptive, method of evangelism Adventists are very good at using mass media and sponsor many localevangelistic meetings often advertised as non-denominational Bible lectures orRevelation Seminars. They continue to target Christians in other churches as wellas unbelievers and baptize people by the thousands in all parts of the world."
They do this so others won't catch ton to the fact they are a cult.
Source: http://www.lifesassuranceministries.com/pdf fiiles/sprolet.pdf

I read this book years ago, and was shocked Walter Martin didn't include SDA as a cult. But, of course they lied to him and Donald Grey Barnhouse about their true beliefs when they formed a meeting to discuss what they believe prior to his writing of them in his book.

Walter Martin based his findings off of their discussion which was not forthcoming. He was lied to and was deceived by this cult.

Hello P4T,

We should not point people to the teachings of men over the Word of God. You point people to the books of men or the word of website. For me, he must increase and I must decrease. I only point all to the Word of God because it is there we find the one who loves us that we may love him. I know him and am known by him. All that he shows me I see and must show to all because I am blind. He tells me it is those that see that do not see. These are they that have once known him or do not know him.

Who am I that he should choose me out of the world? I am no one but he is all. If I did not believe him I would not know him. What can I do without him? He is love and now I love. I follow him now because I love him who first loved me. I do not judge you or anyone else here but His Word judges all because they are there for all to see.

All are welcome to see and hear God's Word, however many are called but few are chosen. Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils but His Words are promises to deliver us and it is here we must find safety.

The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house from the devil, how much more shall they call them of his household (a cult)? Jesus is of this household (the Word) and this is where I must live. It is hard to kick against the pricks. We ought to obey God rather than man. God is love and he that dwells in love dwells in God.

This is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that does evil hates the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that does truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

God has his people in all the Churches and outside the Church. God is calling his people out from wherever they maybe so that they will all be together with one Shepard and one fold (the Word) to worship him in Spirit and in truth.


In Christ Always!

 

[loveme1]

Our "Sanctification", is a life long pursuit of holy living, separation from the world and service and worship to our Heavenly Father. As usual your insults are earthly, foolish and make no sense at all, you are just trying to disqualify a true believer. Not an honorable endeavor.

Another shameful post

You can accuse and call me names until Kingdom come.. because the life long pursuit of Holy Living and separation from the world is through believing in the Messiah.. no other way.

Neither you or I have the power to disqualify anyone as much as we have not the power to qualify all are to Repent and Believe and be kept by GOD's Power.

 

[LoveGodForever]

THE FIRST LIE IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN

Gen 3:1,
Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

Gen 3:2-3,
And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

Gen 3:4,
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

Gen 3:5,
God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Key points from scripture:

• The original deceiver the devil (v1)
• Eve told the serpent that God commanded them not to touch or eat the fruit lest they die (v 2-3)
• The serpent lied to Eve saying that you will not surely die if you don’t do what God asks. You will be like God knowing good and evil (v 4-5).

Putting it all together:

The fall of mankind was from the original lie (John 8:44; 1John 3:8). When God commanded mankind to follow him lest they die. The Devil’’s original lie was that you can break God’s Law and not die. The teachings of many false religions today is the same as the original lie. If God asks us to do something and you do not do it…. “Ye shall not surely die” (Gen 3:4). But God's Word says we will die if we break God's Law (Rom 6:23). Who do we follow God or man?

For those that have ears to hear.........