Not By Works

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loveme1 said:

Then we have established we are not led of the same Spirit.. For only one is Holy...

the power of is undeniable and I will continue Therin by GOD's Grace.

Many likes and supportive posts will not change the Truth of the matter.

Let GOD be true and all men liars.
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Oh dear it seems to me that you are saying one is wrong and one is right.
Is you or is stones?

Do you have the same spirit that she does not have or does she have the same spirit you don't have?
You seem to intimate that you have it therefore continue in Gods grace therefore stones does not.

Please explain to me the grace that you claim to have supports your above post.
 
loveme1 said:
Bill, im sure you are smart enough to consider it a little longer and if then you still understand not... you never will.
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It it is obvious this poster has no desire to discuss anything, just push her belief and attack people who question her,

so sad we have to have ave so many of these people.
 
loveme1 said:
Bill, im sure you are smart enough to consider it a little longer and if then you still understand not... you never will.
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Humour please.
Explain it to me as one would To a 5 year old.

I am sure others would like to know what you meant
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Then you should be more worried, and you show the problem in most chat rooms, people love to attack others, and claim they are deceived. When a lot of people would think they themselves are deceived.

Round and round. Where it stops no body knows.

Well ill it won't stop until people,show some humility,
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I'm more worried that many are being deceived and if I become an enemy for the sake of Truth then so be it. Scratching each other's ears is not going to help anyone.. too many not willing to speak out for GOD's Truth.. and me being the least and most simple.... shares the Truth by His Strength and wisdom.

who am I to know such things? Not worthy but the Holy Spirit leads and I share.
 
PHart said:
The point is not that believing is something you 'do'.
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And yet someone just said it was, which is what I was showing, not that I agree with it. As far as I know, I had never heard repentance and coming to believe the gospel classified as a work before, though for sure and of course they are the rock upon which Christ is building His church: our confession of faith in Him as the Son of the living God, believing Who He is (God manifest in the flesh), and why He incarnated, which was to seek and save the lost, to give His life as a ransom for those who believe on Him due to His great everlasting love for us, that we may pass from death into life ever after, being reconciled to God, through a rebirth into the Spirit from the flesh, according to His promises.

The point is believing is not among the things that you do that can not justify. Believing is not a part of the works that Paul says can not justify, and it never will be. Believing is in stark contrast to works of the law, not a part of those works. Believing is in fact the very thing you are to 'do' to be saved.
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Exactly :) Some seem to confuse the one time act of justification with the ongoing process of sanctification, asserting that if the latter is not evident or accomplished, the former is made null and void. However, that would invalidate any deathbed conversions to repentance and belief. Does it matter in terms of salvation at what point in one's life one arrives at the acceptance of Truth?

Works are required in that that is what believing looks like. Generally speaking, if your believing doesn't look like that then you do not have the faith that justifies all by itself apart from works. Even Paul himself, the author of the 'works vs. faith' doctrine in the Bible said the faith that justifies is the faith that is expressed in love (Galatians 5:6). He did not say the faith that does not express itself in love justifies. He said the faith that does express itself in love justifies.
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Only God knows our hearts :)

But so many people are taking false comfort in a so-called 'faith' that does not obey God in the two greatest commandments--love God/ love people. They don't even know what it means to love Biblically to begin with. I'm speaking generally of the church, of course. Love is not 'liking' people and then being nice to them because they are pleasing to you. That is not the love that justifying faith manifests itself in. Every lost human being on earth has that kind of love. That love does not come from God. No, justifying faith is signified by a very specific kind of God's love, the love of unconditional regard for other people. That's why godly love is the footprint and sign of being righteous through faith in Christ. The presence of the righteousness of Christ in a person by the Holy Spirit is signified by what that Holy Spirit does in a person.
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Scripture says that any who love are of God. But I understand what you are saying, and agree that people pleasing in order to be accepted for yourself, and pandering to the unrealistic demands of others, is not standing firm upon the Rock of Faith. Love of God must come first, and the rest will follow in His time.

The scriptures only point to that if that's the only scripture you look at. The whole counsel of scripture reveals that you must stay in the believing you started out in to be saved on the Last Day.
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Yes, and the Scriptures also point to the fact that Jesus will not lose any who are given to Him. Our faith is placed in Him and what He does for us, not upon ourselves, and what we do for Him. This not to say we do nothing :)

Yes. So keep being a sheep of God. The life with God that never ends is only for the sheep. Not for goats, not for former sheep.
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I love being counted as one of His, thank you. And to you also I say, with all forbearance and love:

You were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— 3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— 6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

That's right. Your faith is how you secure the power of God until the Day of Salvation (1 Peter 1:5). You lose the power of God to keep you until the Day of Salvation if you lose that which secures it, your believing.
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I think this is one of the problematic areas where misunderstandings arise, for if Jesus will not allow anything or anyone to snatch us out of His hand, how is it we are able to lose that which He has given? I believe that some look upon those who are religious but lost, and when they walk away from their dead faith religion, they are seen to have rejected the faith, but theirs was not a saving faith to begin with.

A failure on Christ's part is never the reason why a person fails. His is a perfect ministry. That's why we must continue to rely on it. He will never be guilty of losing a believer through neglect or a failure to perform his priestly duties properly, as did the priests of old.
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Amen, His love will never fail.

Yep. It's an iron clad promise. He won't fail you. That's why we are exhorted to keep believing in his ministry:

"14Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven,[SUP]f[/SUP] Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess." (Hebrews 4:14 NIV)
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And again I say amen :)
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loveme1 said:



I'm more worried that many are being deceived and if I become an enemy for the sake of Truth then so be it. Scratching each other's ears is not going to help anyone.. too many not willing to speak out for GOD's Truth.. and me being the least and most simple.... shares the Truth by His Strength and wisdom.

who am I to know such things? Not worthy but the Holy Spirit leads and I share.
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Is that the same Holy Spirit stones has, or I have or EG has?
You say that you are the least But to be Hines sister you are coming across as you are the greatest.
 
Hi Rosemary,

I am not sure what PHart is saying really LOL, maybe he will clarify.

That you are manifesting outward the inward work of the Holy Spirit is as it should be.

However, what I think Phart is saying is those outward works (presence) of the inward reality are what save.

You are able to do those works because you are saved, their presence does not bring salvation.

If the presence of good works, even as an outward manifestation, brings salvation then how many would a person need?

Let see if he can clarify, because scripture is really not a muddled mess, it is pretty clear we are saved by grace not works.

Rosemaryx said:
Hi UG...I don`t think Phart is saying that at all...From what i see from his post, he is saying that once we have been baptized in Christ, we start to change, if we do not then something is a miss...In my early days when i accepted Jesus as my Savior, i sat back doing nothing lol, to the point my life was dull, now i go out and about and show the changes in me that our Lord is doing...It`s no good if the Holy Spirit is changing me from things that i once was and not going into the world to practice these things, it`s not my working that has changed me it`s the work of the Lord, but it is I who has to be the light on the hill to show Him to the lost, and by doing that i have to get up and do my part...We do have to do our works for the Lord, i know i am saved, sealed and i am secure in Christ as i type, i have no understanding of how one can lose Salvation unless they walked away from God and their hearts become hardened , but like i said, my race is running with Jesus, not running away in fear that i may lose Him, i just can`t imagine that happening, He is my first love and i truly love Him with all my being, even though I am not where i need to be...xox...
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loveme1 said:



I'm more worried that many are being deceived and if I become an enemy for the sake of Truth then so be it. Scratching each other's ears is not going to help anyone.. too many not willing to speak out for GOD's Truth.. and me being the least and most simple.... shares the Truth by His Strength and wisdom.

who am I to know such things? Not worthy but the Holy Spirit leads and I share.
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Would you mind expanding what you feel the many are deceived with.
It would help us to understand what you are saying and why.
 
BillG said:
Humour please.
Explain it to me as one would To a 5 year old.

I am sure others would like to know what you meant
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can you with a honest heart tell me that you or any other person here is not guilty of any wrong doing? And did you decide to call me out because your friends were involved?

I have been mocked and called all sorts.. and mind not.. but then don't jump on something less that I do.. it is not about Truth with some of you but being accepted of each other.. which is fine... but stop the hypocrisy.. it is time consuming and possibly deliberate.
 
loveme1 said:



I'm more worried that many are being deceived and if I become an enemy for the sake of Truth then so be it. Scratching each other's ears is not going to help anyone.. too many not willing to speak out for GOD's Truth.. and me being the least and most simple.... shares the Truth by His Strength and wisdom.

who am I to know such things? Not worthy but the Holy Spirit leads and I share.
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I am sure people could say the same concerning you, and I am sure they think the HS is leading the, also.

will you answer Bill's question please, what heresy are you attacking?

 
BillG said:
Is that the same Holy Spirit stones has, or I have or EG has?
You say that you are the least But to be Hines sister you are coming across as you are the greatest.
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GOD is the Greatest... I'm just serving in Spirit and Truth for His Glory and the Salvation of men.
 
loveme1 said:
can you with a honest heart tell me that you or any other person here is not guilty of any wrong doing? And did you decide to call me out because your friends were involved?

I have been mocked and called all sorts.. and mind not.. but then don't jump on something less that I do.. it is not about Truth with some of you but being accepted of each other.. which is fine... but stop the hypocrisy.. it is time consuming and possibly deliberate.
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why cant you answer the question? Blaim shifting and deflection are not good examples of being led by the spirit,
 
loveme1 said:
can you with a honest heart tell me that you or any other person here is not guilty of any wrong doing? And did you decide to call me out because your friends were involved?

I have been mocked and called all sorts.. and mind not.. but then don't jump on something less that I do.. it is not about Truth with some of you but being accepted of each other.. which is fine... but stop the hypocrisy.. it is time consuming and possibly deliberate.
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With an honest heart I can say that I myself is guilty as charged, yet I can't speak on behalf of anyone else.

I have not called you out because I am friends with others. In fact there are others that I don't agree with doctrinally at times yet at times I have agreed with them and those that I agree with at times I have disagreed.

I myself have been mocked and closed a great gracer, into easy believism but if you were to go back and read my posts that is so far from the truth.

Trust me I am not picking on you I am trying to engage, not to out you and humiliate you.
Its just that I don't fully understand what you are saying at times and where you are coming from.

Please trust me humiliation is not goal but love is.

If you feel I not done this with you then I ask you forgive me and hopefully we can walk together chewing the cud.
 
UnderGrace said:
So then why do you refuse to elaborate on Truth when faced with heresy?

How is this serving?
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read through the thread... so much shared.

If you can not see the article is deceptive then you have not the Holy Spirit.. it guides, comforts and brings Truth to mind.

If I become an enemy for the Truths sake then so be it.




 
BillG said:
With an honest heart I can say that I myself is guilty as charged, yet I can't speak on behalf of anyone else.

I have not called you out because I am friends with others. In fact there are others that I don't agree with doctrinally at times yet at times I have agreed with them and those that I agree with at times I have disagreed.

I myself have been mocked and closed a great gracer, into easy believism but if you were to go back and read my posts that is so far from the truth.

Trust me I am not picking on you I am trying to engage, not to out you and humiliate you.
Its just that I don't fully understand what you are saying at times and where you are coming from.

Please trust me humiliation is not goal but love is.

If you feel I not done this with you then I ask you forgive me and hopefully we can walk together chewing the cud.
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we all are guilty, but we must realize, our attacking others with these arguments which can be used by the other said d against us, and attacking them is not going to change anyone's view, and just goes to show we are to proud t actually discuss anything
 
BillG said:
With an honest heart I can say that I myself is guilty as charged, yet I can't speak on behalf of anyone else. I have not called you out because I am friends with others. In fact there are others that I don't agree with doctrinally at times yet at times I have agreed with them and those that I agree with at times I have disagreed. I myself have been mocked and closed a great gracer, into easy believism but if you were to go back and read my posts that is so far from the truth. Trust me I am not picking on you I am trying to engage, not to out you and humiliate you. Its just that I don't fully understand what you are saying at times and where you are coming from. Please trust me humiliation is not goal but love is. If you feel I not done this with you then I ask you forgive me and hopefully we can walk together chewing the cud.
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I commend you for offering apologies for possibly unintentionally offending a person. You'd be surprised how many people on here show pride & contempt for others with no remorse.
 
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