Not By Works

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eternally-gratefull said:

Satan was not born dead now was he?

Satan also is not offered grace and a chance to be saved now is he?

So your question concerning grace and satan is not valid.. is it?? You can not compare Satan and mankind.
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another right out there self leaning own understanding.. really et Mankind can not act like satan ?

or angels can not take up the form of man ? 1 corithians do you not know that we will Judge angels The truth is, when we die and go to heaven we become even greater than the angels.

The angels are spiritual beings who were created by God to be His servants,,,,,, and God has given them great authority and power to do His will. Just like us et he has given us the same enabling power to do his will And at the present time the angels are greater than we are, because God made us a little lower than the heavenly beings But the Bible also says that in heaven we will be higher than the angels and the reason is because we will be like Christ..

Et phone home and ask for all your delusions to be removed the same rules apply to angels as us.
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Agree




It is merited only on his promise. His work, and his character



If being the key word,

1. It would never happen
2. God would not save someone he KNEW was going to give him the finger at a later date (he knows us better than ourselves)




Amen, I agree again,, Not of works lest anyone should boast (basically be puffed up wiht pride or take credit for their own salvation)




Its called redemption, Atonement, Eternal life, Justification, Salvation,

OSAS is just a slang word for the term once a person is saved, their salvation lasts forever (once saved always saved) and it is based on fact. Now the calvin portion of it and how it happens may not be correct, but the actual wording itself is correct. Although i would prefer the terms Assurance in Christ, Eternal security etc etc.

I wish we would get off key words however, and just discuss what people believe.



Not sure exactly what you mean here.




Amen, God will perform or complete it It does not say he might complete it, it says he will. We are saved with the hope that this will happen. If we do nto trust God can do this, our faith is not really in God.. if it is not in God, can our lack of faith save us?
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I love OSAS and EASY BELIEVISM and GREASY GRACE and SLOPPY AGAPE<-------terms like this = no substance from the one's employing them......the bible is clear...eternal means eternal when it is applied unto biblical salvation and the ensuing life given in Christ to ALL who have been genuinely born again from ABOVE....We are kept by HIS POWER, saved to the UTTERMOST and he will finish the good work of faith he began in us....He promises never to leave us or forsake us and nothing shall separate us from his love.....

Sounds like eternal security to me!
 
JIMBO43 said:
of course your talking of punishment but God will only chasten those who are is,, will God chasten satan. ?

I believe in punishment spiritual prison etc.. but with a condition you have to have some Good or bare some fruits to be worthy of given a second chance after death in the Body..

However this opens the door to commit sin all your life.. so therefor this does not apply to those who dont bare any fruits what so ever..
psalms
165Those who love Your law have great peace,And nothing causes them to stumble.
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I was not talking about punishment as I assumed we were talking about "works" and "rewards". I understand from the Word that we will be judged (heaven or hell) one day and then we will be rewarded according to our works. I believe that anyone who has been saved and who strives to live according to the example and teachings of Jesus will automatically do "works". If as Christians our role model for the way we should be living is Jesus, then would we not adopt Jesus words that He came to serve and not to be served? Would we not want to help others and do good as Jesus did?

I am not really following what you are trying to say about Satan being chastened etc.
 
JIMBO43 said:
yes because you where dead befor you Got connected to the vine..thats where you slip up because you dont seem to recognise that some fig trees will not produce figs even tho every effert was made for it to do so..
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So God fails?

1. Can you attach yourself to the vine?
2. can you suck life giving nutrients from the vine?
3. Can you take what the vine gives you, and produce on apple?

or is it God that does it all?

If God gets a sniff of a tiny little bit good in you he can go to work on that.. you may have come from an unstable tree that produces a bit of good fruit.. so you may not harvest verry well to begin with.. but just like we have regenerative cells Gods has regenerative branches
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God may lift up off the ground, and prune branches, But his branches produce fruit. Some alot, Some very little. but all will produce fruit.

 
JIMBO43 said:
another right out there self leaning own understanding.. really et Mankind can not act like satan ?

or angels can not take up the form of man ? 1 corithians do you not know that we will Judge angels The truth is, when we die and go to heaven we become even greater than the angels.

The angels are spiritual beings who were created by God to be His servants,,,,,, and God has given them great authority and power to do His will. Just like us et he has given us the same enabling power to do his will And at the present time the angels are greater than we are, because God made us a little lower than the heavenly beings But the Bible also says that in heaven we will be higher than the angels and the reason is because we will be like Christ..

Et phone home and ask for all your delusions to be removed the same rules apply to angels as us.
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here we go folks, Jimbo think he is like satan, and has seen God as God is, and lived to tell us all about it..

and by the way, Keep up with your silly little comments like ET phone home. I will report you. Those are uncalled for.
 
FeedtheMachine said:
I was not talking about punishment as I assumed we were talking about "works" and "rewards". I understand from the Word that we will be judged (heaven or hell) one day and then we will be rewarded according to our works. I believe that anyone who has been saved and who strives to live according to the example and teachings of Jesus will automatically do "works". If as Christians our role model for the way we should be living is Jesus, then would we not adopt Jesus words that He came to serve and not to be served? Would we not want to help others and do good as Jesus did?

I am not really following what you are trying to say about Satan being chastened etc.
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last sentence - many of us have this same thought when interacting with this particular person.
 
eternally-gratefull said:
So God fails?

1. Can you attach yourself to the vine?
2. can you suck life giving nutrients from the vine?
3. Can you take what the vine gives you, and produce on apple?

or is it God that does it all?



God may lift up off the ground, and prune branches, But his branches produce fruit. Some alot, Some very little. but all will produce fruit.

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your creating straw men here havent got a clue what your on about
 
eternally-gratefull said:
here we go folks, Jimbo think he is like satan, and has seen God as God is, and lived to tell us all about it..

and by the way, Keep up with your silly little comments like ET phone home. I will report you. Those are uncalled for.
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another strawman are you sure your not double minded ?
 
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Originally Posted by FeedtheMachine
I was not talking about punishment as I assumed we were talking about "works" and "rewards". I understand from the Word that we will be judged (heaven or hell) one day and then we will be rewarded according to our works. I believe that anyone who has been saved and who strives to live according to the example and teachings of Jesus will automatically do "works". If as Christians our role model for the way we should be living is Jesus, then would we not adopt Jesus words that He came to serve and not to be served? Would we not want to help others and do good as Jesus did?

I am not really following what you are trying to say about Satan being chastened etc.

gb9 said:
last sentence - many of us have this same thought when interacting with this particular person.
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i never said anything about satan being chastened i said is satan going to be chastened,,,,,,,,,,,
 
JIMBO43 said:
quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by FeedtheMachine
I was not talking about punishment as I assumed we were talking about "works" and "rewards". I understand from the Word that we will be judged (heaven or hell) one day and then we will be rewarded according to our works. I believe that anyone who has been saved and who strives to live according to the example and teachings of Jesus will automatically do "works". If as Christians our role model for the way we should be living is Jesus, then would we not adopt Jesus words that He came to serve and not to be served? Would we not want to help others and do good as Jesus did?

I am not really following what you are trying to say about Satan being chastened etc.

i never said anything about satan being chastened i said is satan going to be chastened,,,,,,,,,,,
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Chastened like God chastens us because He chastens those He loves? This also doesn't make much sense to me. How can we compare God's relationship with us to His relationship with Satan? We cannot assume that God treats us and angels in the same manner. As people we are expected to believe in what we cannot see (faith) and we are saved because of this faith. Satan on the other hand witnessed first hand the majesty and power and love of God and yet he chose to reject it. God will chasten us out of His love for us so that we don't stray off the path, but for Satan that opportunity no longer exists. I'm not quite sure what you are trying to get at because I believe that God chastens those He loves and He cannot love Satan because He cannot love evil.
 
FeedtheMachine said:
Chastened like God chastens us because He chastens those He loves? This also doesn't make much sense to me. How can we compare God's relationship with us to His relationship with Satan? We cannot assume that God treats us and angels in the same manner. As people we are expected to believe in what we cannot see (faith) and we are saved because of this faith. Satan on the other hand witnessed first hand the majesty and power and love of God and yet he chose to reject it. God will chasten us out of His love for us so that we don't stray off the path, but for Satan that opportunity no longer exists. I'm not quite sure what you are trying to get at because I believe that God chastens those He loves and He cannot love Satan because He cannot love evil.
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The angels are like us they are an entity like we are.
you can not see your true form. coz god has you inside of a vessel. if you remove the vessel what will you look like ?

if you can answer this question then you might even recognise that all tho you may become like christ and higher than the angels it doesnt make the angels any less loved then we are..
 
PHart said:
Many Christians go on-line to insist that if they have to continue to believe in order to be saved then they are trying to earn their salvation. I just go by what comes out of their mouth.
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yup to believe is to sin by there own delusion.. totaly twisted may i add too
 
PHart said:
The problem is you are saying that all 'shallow believing' is 'not really believing'. 'No root' obviously can't mean 'no root at all' because the plant would not appear at all. The first kind of soil is the soil where there is no root, no believing, not the second soil.

The church can't seem to think in terms of 'weak faith/ strong faith'. It has been taught to only be able to think about faith in an 'either/or' way. But the parable of the sower shows us that there is indeed weak believing, and there is strong believing. Obviously, strong believing can endure. Weak faith may not. It may never grow up to the fourth kind of soil, but if you just look at your own life perhaps you have a testimony of being all four of the soils in a progressive move towards God. I do.
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I think it shows us the what happens when the word is given out, People react to it different ways.

What we know from scripture is this, Those grounded in Christ, will produce fruit. Those grounded in anything else but Christ will not.

1. Some will reject it outright (devoured immediately)
2. some will appear to grow quickly, but have no root, and thus were withered away
3. Some are sewn with the weeds (try to mix God and the world) and the thorns (world) choked them out, and they could bear no fruit.
4. Some fell on good ground, and sprang up and produced fruit. although the amount of fruit they bore varied.

it should be noted. only one type produced fruit, they rest did not. So to say any of the first three could people who were saved is to say one can be saved and never bare fruit (have no works)

yet amazingly, these same people attack the grace group by saying the grace group thinks one can be saved and produce no fruit..

I hope we see the pattern which begins to emerge.
 
JIMBO43 said:
The angels are like us they are an entity like we are.
you can not see your true form. coz god has you inside of a vessel. if you remove the vessel what will you look like ?

if you can answer this question then you might even recognise that all tho you may become like christ and higher than the angels it doesnt make the angels any less loved then we are..
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Sorry friend...I truly don't understand what point you are tying to make. I am really trying to understand, but I seem to be missing the point of your argument / statement.

I am not saying that angels are less loved. I am basically saying that Satan had his chance and he blew it. There will be no salvation, love or chastening for him. He rejected God after witnessing His majesty first hand and in doing so "sealed his fate".
 
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