Not By Works

[Grace777x70]

Wow scary. But it is obvious.

What all those posts show are the answers to what is really "falling from the faith" as Paul talks about in 1 Tim 4. I know this bothers works-based believers and unbelievers in Christ's finished work on the cross because it exposes their self-works for what they really are. This is a good thing for all of us.

Whenever someone talks about "falling away from the faith" - I merely show what Paul says about it. If that offends you or others - so be it.

I will continue to post the scriptures that show what true apostasy is and it is denying the work of Christ which is all by grace through faith in His finished work only and replacing His work for what "they do or don't do".

Blessed are those that are not offended because of Christ. He alone is our wisdom, righteousness, sanctification and redemption. These are all God's doing. 1 Cor. 1:30

 

[mailmandan]

What all those posts show are the answers to what is really "falling from the faith" as Paul talks about in 1 Tim 4.

Some "nominal" Christians will abandon the Christian faith for cults or other false religions. Such indicate that they had never been born of God as John declares in 1 John 2:19. The words "the faith" (Gr. tês pisteôs) in this context means the apostolic faith, the New Testament apostolic body of doctrines. This 1 Timothy passage does not refer to genuine born again Christians departing from saving faith in Christ. It refers to some who are in a state of professing adherence to the New Testament apostolic faith, but who nevertheless will in both doctrine and practice, depart from it, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons. Those who do so may not even be aware of it, but they may sincerely believe they are doctrinally orthodox.

I believe the beginning of such a major departing from the apostolic Christian faith was evidenced as the Roman Catholic church came into existence in the early 4th century. The RCC imposes on its clergy that they be unmarried (1 Timothy 4:3). This same professing body has many demonic doctrines such as transubstantiation, purgatory, indulgences, papal infallibility, Mary's perpetual virginity etc..

 

[JesusRules1]

They are not works of the flesh,for our works cannot save us,but they are works of the Spirit,which the Bible says do not quench the Spirit,and do not grieve the Spirit.

Every time we sin we are not led of the Spirit at that moment,and if we hold unto sin we are not led of the Spirit,until we get rid of the sin,and every time we spend money on things that are our wants,and not our needs,and do not help the poor and needy,we are not led of the Spirit at that moment.

With that being said all people that have received the Spirit might not always allow the Spirit to lead them,and if such is the case,then they are in a bad position concerning faith,for if they do not allow the Spirit to lead them,because they want to hold unto sin,or if they neglect the poor and needy when they have the means to help them,then faith without works is dead,for a person is justified by works,and not faith alone,after they receive the Spirit.

Faith alone-confessing Christ.

A person is justified by works,and not faith alone-after receiving the Spirit.

Harmonize scriptures,and understand what the scriptures are saying,and stop believing falsehood.

Heb 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
Heb 10:39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

These scriptures cannot be denied that it is possible for someone to withdraw from the faith,which God will have no pleasure in them,and they withdraw unto perdition.

Why do people argue about scriptures that are plain,and faith alone does not apply throughout our walk with God,but when we first confess Christ,and then when we receive the Spirit a person is justified by works,and not be faith alone.

And that is because some people withdraw from the faith,and some people do not allow the Spirit to lead them at times,in which they err concerning the faith,for they do not have the proper faith,and do not abide by the kingdom,and God,properly,and if they are not careful might get caught back up in the flesh and not get back to being led of the Spirit.

Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Your fingers had a serious brain fart, EG.. ovdercommers.. LOL

​lol Typing on an IPAD makes my spelling worse.. Thank God my salvation is not based on how well I spell

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

My wife just summed it up better than I could. " If your sorrow leads you to inaction then its not true faith."

Hmm...many men won't like this because they will think you are meaning "works of the law" when you say action, and they will think "inaction" is a very good word.

And I myself would tend to first agree with you but with reservations or caveats, then be curious as to what that all means to you. Men can be still (or again) gravitated back toward true works of the law as regards their sanctification and get stuck there for a bit until they realize that just as they couldn't save themselves, they find they also can't make themselves grow holier and once again put their hands in the air and say, I give up with all this trying to be holy, if it's to be done, you're going to have to do it because I always fail at some point, and miserably.
(or again) in varying stages of the growth in humility that allows them to see

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Re: Not by works.

It is not by works we are saved however it is through the correct works that we can know we are saved. False grace is the falling away from the 613 commandments in Torah and teaching others not to keep them or to not even try to do them. Faith the word has been changed to be interpreted as magic. Faith is not magic it is Torah. Same as it says in prov. Your word is truth..
You will know the truth and the truth will make you free

I agree with your first sentence, that through works we will know we are saved and move to a new level of trust and security and peace. The verse that says this is: and we know we love Him because we follow His commands. We marvel when this truly begins to happen because sometimes we have struggled with the sin in us for some length of time before we cry to Him that with men it is impossible to grow holier and begin to trust Him more to complete the work He said He would in us. And we sometimes go for a long time in that waiting also but usually not too long, before we begin to see the victories over our tongue and our temper and our emotions and we find that they are more in more in subjection to us than the other way around. And we almost faint with delight and say, the Lord has given me victory over my enemies, the battle truly DOES belong to the Lord and a righteous man truly DOES do what is righteous!

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

You have answered poorly. Sorry. I still love you, but you're not bering fruit to righteousness. You're confessing by your words you will feel godly sorrow that leads to repentance. This is the first step but the preordained works that you are called to is imitation of Messiah by doing the Kingdoms Instructions that will never change, like repentance which for example not worshipping the false holydays the God of Heaven and Earth that swallowed up those who bowed down to the golden calf. Or later when Israel was burning incense to the surpent on the stake and had forgotten the Torah of YHWH, (just like today). Remember the things that happened to them are examples for us today especially. What happened to them? The surpent of bronze was ground into powder and put in the river so they all had to drink it. Wormwood curse came upon them. They drank bitterness but that is a whole lesson y'all may not be ready for.

I regret that I can't answer this, but I don't know which things I said that led you to believe I was in error. But that's okay, discussion will usually lead back to it at some point.

 

[dcontroversal]

Huh. That's a lot more verbose than "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."

AMEN to that....or Whosoever believes on the SON is having everlasting life.....their concept is as false as one can be....not only does the bible teach birth and growth before works and or fruit, creation teaches the same thing....

NOTHING can do a work or produce fruit of any sort until it has been born and then had a period of growth and maturity....even a blind man can "see" this......

AND on top of that.....the bible teaches the word of God is spiritual and the natural man cannot discern it, much less apply it...more proof that a spiritual birth must take place 1st

AND on top of that any work or fruit produced in CHRIST ALREADY in that person by SPIRITUAL BIRTH doing the work and or producing the fruit.....

THE bible is right...ABRAHAM was declared righteous by belief...the works are the result of said faith that he already had....

Those who teach a works based salvation are false and preaching a hellish dogma that is double cursed and not even the gospel at all<--Galatians 1, 3

They personify the "plenteous" in number that will be cast into the lake of fire while boasting of their works as their right to enter....

How plain is...NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but according to his MERCY HAS HE SAVED US....I have come to the conclusion that those who teach a false works based lie are blind!

THE JUST shall live by faith--->NOT WORKS!

 

[Sully]

AMEN to that....or Whosoever believes on the SON is having everlasting life.....their concept is as false as one can be....not only does the bible teach birth and growth before works and or fruit, creation teaches the same thing....

NOTHING can do a work or produce fruit of any sort until it has been born and then had a period of growth and maturity....even a blind man can "see" this......

AND on top of that.....the bible teaches the word of God is spiritual and the natural man cannot discern it, much less apply it...more proof that a spiritual birth must take place 1st

AND on top of that any work or fruit produced in CHRIST ALREADY in that person by SPIRITUAL BIRTH doing the work and or producing the fruit.....

THE bible is right...ABRAHAM was declared righteous by belief...the works are the result of said faith that he already had....

Those who teach a works based salvation are false and preaching a hellish dogma that is double cursed and not even the gospel at all<--Galatians 1, 3

They personify the "plenteous" in number that will be cast into the lake of fire while boasting of their works as their right to enter....

How plain is...NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but according to his MERCY HAS HE SAVED US....I have come to the conclusion that those who teach a false works based lie are blind!

THE JUST shall live by faith--->NOT WORKS!

Right on. And I never got the def of "false grace"...

 

[Sully]

Who is the Lord in that scripture?

You do make a good lawyer, there may be a black robe in your future...

 

[dcontroversal]

Paul-not saved by works,by faith alone,when we initially come to Christ,for our works according to the flesh cannot save us,and our righteousness is as filthy rags,so the only thing we can have is faith.

James-faith without works is dead,and a person is justified by works,and not be faith alone,after we confess Christ,and receive the Spirit,and are saved,then we have to have works to have faith active in our works.

2 different scenarios,not we are not saved by works throughout the time we are saved,but when we initially come to Christ,and when we receive the Spirit,then a person is justified by works,and not faith alone,for when we first come to Christ our works do not count for they are of the flesh,but when we receive the Spirit then our works count for they are of the Spirit.

And those works are love people,and help them with their needs,which we know we are supposed to do anyway,for James said if you do not help people with their needs,how do you have faith,and how can the love of God dwell in you,and Paul said they have erred from the faith.

So Paul and James say the same thing,Paul-they have erred from the faith,and James-how do you have faith,if a person does not help people with their needs.

NO not really....actually they both present entirely different scenarios.....

PAUL-->BEFORE GOD we are justified by FAITH void of any work
James-->OUR FAITH that JUSTIFIES us before GOD is SEEN by MEN based upon our ACTIONS

JAMES-->SHOW ME YOUR FAITH!

 

[dcontroversal]

People please listen. This is the root of all religion all over the world. As long as I AM righteous. I will make it.. If I have more good works than I have bad works, I will be ok. If I am super duper good. Then I will not only make it to heaven but get all these amazing gifts to go with it.

In fact, this is why it is so easy to get people to commute murder by suicide, Find the one who are close to 50/50 or who will never make it, Prtomise them eternal life based on martyrdom, and they will gladly kill themselves to kill the infidel.

This is a lie. It is what Satan wants you to think. When anyone stands before God. They will stand either saved, having all their sin washed away by7 the cross. Or condemned, having to live by their on works (each one was judged according to their work, And the final book was opened, the book of life" WHoever was not written in it was cast to outer darkness.

All of your good deeds will not help you spend one second in heaven, let alone an eternity. If you wish to stand based on how well you do on this earth. How righteous you think you are. I beg of you. Repent. Get on your knees, Beg for God to expose the truth to you. Expose your pride. And tear it down. Ask for his mercy, for he freely gives it to you. And he will save you. Call out to him, and he will save you,. And he will make changes in your life you will not believe.

Plenteous in number<----LORD, LORD did we not do many WONDERFUL WORKS in your name...blah, blah, blah....tragic day for those who think their works will facilitate, help, keep them saved........

 

[dcontroversal]

What all those posts show are the answers to what is really "falling from the faith" as Paul talks about in 1 Tim 4. I know this bothers works-based believers and unbelievers in Christ's finished work on the cross because it exposes their self-works for what they really are. This is a good thing for all of us.

Whenever someone talks about "falling away from the faith" - I merely show what Paul says about it. If that offends you or others - so be it.

I will continue to post the scriptures that show what true apostasy is and it is denying the work of Christ which is all by grace through faith in His finished work only and replacing His work for what "they do or don't do".

Blessed are those that are not offended because of Christ. He alone is our wisdom, righteousness, sanctification and redemption. These are all God's doing. 1 Cor. 1:30

AMEN.........just like Galatians, Hebrews and other books or sets of verses......going back to a Pharisee(ical) based pseudo false religion of works for salvation or to keep and or facilitate salvation....

another lie of Satan that leads to hell.....

 

[JIMBO43]

Deluded people think they can be rightouse without praying first... just my thoughts,,, the mind say i am rightouse and i can say at this moment of thinking this thought that i have the right to say whatevr i like without seeking his word first..... the whole of the word... the works of the word..... the faith of the word.......... the love of the word............the hope of the word.............the secrets of the word.......... the frindship of the word.........all of theese thing we can fall from grace... te me has the people of this thread who declare they have recieved there final due also think they have masted the the seven deadly sins to....

Now maybe you will master them one day and maybe when you do God will throw you in a situation to test your works....

And maybe you might pass with flying colours,,, or maybe you might fail...

Now you may be at work wanting that promotion... you just suddenly say one day screw you team mates im going to shine in my work while you lot will just follow shadows...

Or you may just say one day oh get lost begger..

Or you may just say one day ya can stick your frindship up ya ............ anyways all this said some trees to wither away befor there day of sweet chariots taking them home...this is reality...

Now when you say hey im going to change so i dont keep being mean with trashing the truth of God he loves kindness.. im going to actually make it my goal to make friends here no matter what,,, in stead of making enemies..

May that mean attitude will disapear but i doubt verry much that people with issues never reallly walk at all,, because why,, well it is writen that people pray for a selfish ambition...the reality is this is a bad works...and not a good fruit..
Now is this the state you go into in heaven like still having thos withered away fruits... ,,, i hardly thinks so pals.....

I hardly think your going to be allowed to carry on with selfish prayer in his kingdom.

 

[dcontroversal]

Deluded people think they can be rightouse without praying first... just my thoughts,,, the mind say i am rightouse and i can say at this moment of thinking this thought that i have the right to say whatevr i like without seeking his word first..... the whole of the word... the works of the word..... the faith of the word.......... the love of the word............the hope of the word.............the secrets of the word.......... the frindship of the word.........all of theese thing we can fall from grace... te me has the people of this thread who declare they have recieved there final due also think they have masted the the seven deadly sins to....

Now maybe you will master them one day and maybe when you do God will throw you in a situation to test your works....

And maybe you might pass with flying colours,,, or maybe you might fail...

Now you may be at work wanting that promotion... you just suddenly say one day screw you team mates im going to shine in my work while you lot will just follow shadows...

Or you may just say one day oh get lost begger..

Or you may just say one day ya can stick your frindship up ya ............ anyways all this said some trees to wither away befor there day of sweet chariots taking them home...this is reality...

Now when you say hey im going to change so i dont keep being mean with trashing the truth of God he loves kindness.. im going to actually make it my goal to make friends here no matter what,,, in stead of making enemies..

May that mean attitude will disapear but i doubt verry much that people with issues never reallly walk at all,, because why,, well it is writen that people pray for a selfish ambition...the reality is this is a bad works...and not a good fruit..
Now is this the state you go into in heaven like still having thos withered away fruits... ,,, i hardly thinks so pals.....

I hardly think your going to be allowed to carry on with selfish prayer in his kingdom.

Talk about rambling on....and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.............

 

[Sully]

If your going to claim to know men's hearts, you'll have to provide more proof than just faulty, illogical opinion.

 

[JIMBO43]

I hardly think praying prayers of selfish prayes is holy... i mean you cant pray this way... but people do now this is not such a bad thing,,, but there hardly the finished article for praying like this... the finished article in my book would not do this... the finished article will alos have all the works of christ... and until he gets there if hes worth it he will be saved and saved again...

 

[dcontroversal]

If your going to claim to know men's hearts, you'll have to provide more proof than just faulty, illogical opinion.

Good luck with that........it seems that all he has is opinionated opinion......you know the verse that states a heretic after the first and second admonition reject....the word heretic = opinionated one in Greek......

I just refer to such a one as a hairy tick......hah yeah I know......

 

[Sully]

I hardly think praying prayers of selfish prayes is holy... i mean you cant pray this way... but people do now this is not such a bad thing,,, but there hardly the finished article for praying like this... the finished article in my book would not do this... the finished article will alos have all the works of christ... and until he gets there if hes worth it he will be saved and saved again...

See, you're just clowning now...Lol, jokes on us who've taken you seriously. Good one.

 

[dcontroversal]

I hardly think praying prayers of selfish prayes is holy... i mean you cant pray this way... but people do now this is not such a bad thing,,, but there hardly the finished article for praying like this... the finished article in my book would not do this... the finished article will alos have all the works of christ... and until he gets there if hes worth it he will be saved and saved again...

Who has said this or implied this........?