Not By Works

[garee]

The gospel has always been simple, it is about finding God, being purified and forgiven
and walking in obedience with Him.

How can a person find Him since no one of their own volition can seek after Him who has no form seeing no man will be found with a righteous of their own after something they could do ?

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

It has been preached and followed since the time of Jesus.

What has been preached ? That Christ must be crucified again and again every time a person sins ?Or do better things accompany salvation like OSAS?

A new anti-legalism HG version is not suddenly the truth and the past got it all wrong.That is not how God works. He is God, and with open eyes, a pure heart you will see God.

But if your gospel does not have a loving pure walk with Christ, you have something fundamentally
wrong. The point about Jesus is this holiness and purity through the cross.

Once it becomes just arriving and God does the rest you have missed the point.
But I do not expect you to understand, because the only way you would understand if you were
walking this path, which it appears you are not, so there we stand.

Just arriving from where? For being born again by the incorruptible seed of Christ with a new eternal spirit that will never die and a new heart that our savoir continues to cleanse all the days of our lives.?

 

[PeterJens]

Why would I want to join you in your fallacy?....You cannot understand biblical salvation based upon faith and grace void of works......no thanks to your false gospel.....

Salvation stands alone, based upon faith into the FINISHED work of Christ....our works cannot, yea do not embellish, help and or keep one saved......sorry...Galatians, Jesus, Paul and even JAMES contradicts your religion of works.......

I am prepared to accept this. I believe when Christ speaks to you, you have to have
an open heart and be truly changed. An indication of this is obedience to Christs commands.

Now I understand your accusation, except it does not fit. I am not on your extreme of HG,
but just grace of Christ in the cross. And I do believe as free people in the Kingdom we are
called to act, as children of God, brothers and sisters of Christ. The clue is in Christ calling
us friends, not servants. He has called us in some form to be part of who He is as God,
which is blasphemy to many, but it is the meaning of His intent. He is one with the Father
and aspires that we might be one with Him and the Father also.

This is not possible is we are still impure, unholy and sinful. So your emphasis on the sinfulness
of man must be wrong. Or else these aspirations are just wind, a pipe dream, maybe in the
future, but not in the now.

To the pure, all things are pure, but to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure; but both their minds and their consciences are defiled.
Titus 1:15

Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God
Matt 5:8

These are both promises and judgments. If you find purity, you will
find God also. But while impurity remains, everything will be distorted.

I have found this emotionally true in my life. One strong emotion twists
all my responses, so I can neither see myself or what I am addressing.

So until all is settled and cleansed, so much seems a problem when actually
nothing is there, only our own turmoil.

 

[Grace777x70]

The following is a blanket statement which you have applied unto ALL who teach grace dia faith salvation....it is a blatant lie as NO ONE I KNOW who believes in grace dia faith teach, implies and or say such things........

YOUR QUOTE-->The HG followers regard themselves lawless which is a sign of the enemy
of Christ himself.

What happens in some people's minds is this:

Someone makes the statement:

"What a beautiful blue sky the Lord gave us today."

Someone else responds back to the above statement:

"What? The sky is not green- everyone knows that the sky is blue - you are lawless and an enemy of Christ".

When people have this kind of a mindset - it is impossible to have any kind of a rational discussion with them as they continually "see" something else than what is actually said. They then proceed to talk as if this "made-up thought" is real.

As the saying goes - There is something wrong in Denmark and is most likely just a waste of time to interact with such a mindset as no good can come out of it until repentance is granted by the Lord.

 

[PeterJens]

Funny how you refute a statement you are lawless, is to say which law
you ascribe to.

The lack of a response indicates one is lawless, but there is nothing to point
to because being lawless is a lack of something, so totally empty.

Paul argues we are slaves to righteousness, not slaves to sin and death.
As a slave one obeys what is right to do.

John says in love we find ourselves obeying Christ from our hearts.

Now if these experiences were happening in peoples lives they would be
saying amen, so obviously their hearts must be saying something different.

The law is for the disobedient, because only the disobedient feel condemned.

So when a believer says they cannot read the sermon on the mount without
being condemned, you understand Christs love has not fully worked out in them.

I have read the responses to this from the main proponents for months, and
they are just hollow, because the foundation is not the Holy Spirit or love.

But thankyou for pushing me to draw nearer to Christ to know His truth
ministering to my spirit, Amen, Praise the Lord.

 

[JaumeJ]

The nature of the law and how it is to be applied lawfully is elaborated upon and taught throughout the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He did not abolish the law and teh prophets, He completes them. This latter you will never comprehend if you do not learn from Jesus Christ and believe Him.

When uthe law is understood according to Jesus Christ all whill know how to use the law lawfully, but as long as grace only folks refer to anything approaching obeying Jesus Christ as being "under the law," they have risen above understanding and are judging those who chose to obey Jesus Christ according to His true teachings, and not just a line here and a line there from the Word. Idt must be all together........

It is the Gospel, not the Gpl.

 

[FreeNChrist]

The nature of the law and how it is to be applied lawfully is elaborated upon and taught throughout the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He did not abolish the law and teh prophets, He completes them. This latter you will never comprehend if you do not learn from Jesus Christ and believe Him.

When uthe law is understood according to Jesus Christ all whill know how to use the law lawfully, but as long as grace only folks refer to anything approaching obeying Jesus Christ as being "under the law," they have risen above understanding and are judging those who chose to obey Jesus Christ according to His true teachings, and not just a line here and a line there from the Word. Idt must be all together........

It is the Gospel, not the Gpl.

Applying the Law onto Christians is applying it unlawfully.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The nature of the law and how it is to be applied lawfully is elaborated upon and taught throughout the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He did not abolish the law and teh prophets, He completes them. This latter you will never comprehend if you do not learn from Jesus Christ and believe Him.

When uthe law is understood according to Jesus Christ all whill know how to use the law lawfully, but as long as grace only folks refer to anything approaching obeying Jesus Christ as being "under the law," they have risen above understanding and are judging those who chose to obey Jesus Christ according to His true teachings, and not just a line here and a line there from the Word. Idt must be all together........

It is the Gospel, not the Gpl.

your right.

HE COMPLETED THEM, because we can not. and never will be able to.

Which is why he turned us to the law of love, something the law of moses could never teach.

 

[Utah]

Some of tshe people in this thread are either confused or just big fat liars.

We who believe Jesus Christ also believe Paul is inspired by Him. Paul teaches some believers believe they may conduct themselves in one manner in the saight of God with a clear conscince, therefore they are not in sin.

Others believe they may do so in anothr manner in the same conditions, and they are not in sin.

Therefor thsoe who decry brethren in Christ for wanting to obey Him as best possible, yet realizing they are only saved by grace, are in great error, and have put themselves up as judges of the brethren.

All who think it wrong to obey God are in error, and should not teach against obedience, for we are made childre of obedience who perform works of light.

This is not a debate from me, so nothing is to be contested herein, for what I post gives credance to the freedom we have all received from Jesus Christ to act in accordance with a good conscience in the sight of God. If you do this you are not in ssin. If you teach this is not correct you make yourself a judge.

Gdo bless all who are in Jesus Christ and all who will come to Him, amen. Believe God........

Hey DC, you're right! Here is a perfect example of a works-based salvationist lying and bearing false witness. No one who believes in being saved by grace through faith says we should be disobedient to God, but here we are being accused of it

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hey DC, you're right! Here is a perfect example of a works-based salvationist lying and bearing false witness. No one who believes in being saved by grace through faith says we should be disobedient to God, but here we are being accused of it

Like I said a few days ago the only people who seem to be saying it are the accusers..

 

[Utah]

The simple disconnect is we are called to walk righteously, in purity, holiness and
love. And yes passion and desire are an issue, under which we need to exercise
self-control. But as Paul declares we do not sin in being married or abstaining.

Jesus says, For God so loved the world . . .

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jesus says, For God so loved the world . . .

yep.

1. He died for me when I was at my worse (his enemy)
2. He Gave me his spirit and shared his love to overflowing
3. Then somehow, even after all this, He will kick me out of his family, even though scripture says I can never get to the point I was BEFORE I was saved.

ie, he saved me when I was at the bottom, Yet if I do not make it to the top he will unsave me, Even though I am higher than the point he saved me..

 

[blue_ladybug]

How do I put this nicely? Heck with it, I'll be my usual real, straightforward self. lol

Peter, there is no such thing as hyper grace. IT DOES NOT EXIST. Grace is grace, simple as apple pie. Nothing more, nothing less. Anyone who says HG exists is a bald turkey faced liar..

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. From the Master.......when is mercy required? The response is teh beginning of understanding the subject so many here are expert uon.

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:13 Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

Understand just what makes our being a sweet odor to our Father, and you will understand much.

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:14 Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
Mat 5:15 Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.
Mat 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.


If you disobey the law as taught by Jesusw Christ in the sight of man, you are not shining any light for the world to see, you are exposing darkness.

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

If after learning this teaching from our Lord you believe the law is abolished and not clarified for all to understand, you are not understanding much. Yes, we do not save ourselves by any action, but this does not mean we harden our hearts to god's will as explained and delineated by Jesus Christ. Hear Himj, and do not pervert His words.

Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Will any of you here dare change the meaning of this teaching just because you live in grace? I live in grace but I know this teaching is true because Jesus teaches it.

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.


Is anyone here going to say I am under the law because I believe this new interpretation of the law? If so, you understand nothing, for I live in grace and I always obtain mercy from the Father because of the Blood of tha Lamb as do all who believe Him.

 

[JaumeJ]

Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

More clarification of the law and proper conduct for all who believe Jesus Christ. Are you an adopted child of God? If you are you believe His Only Begotten Son, not only here but throughout His teaching in the Word, especiall the New Testament. Will you say it is being 2under the law," to conduct oneself as He teaches?

 

[JaumeJ]

Read and do Christ's teachings, othewise you are simply a magpie repeating just some of the words in the Good Book with no understanding.

Never teach agains obedience, and do not pervert obedience as bing something not taught by our Savior.

Also worhty of meditation:
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.