Not By Works

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HisHolly said:
You throw out grace like its the subject.. you can count and hope if you want... Faith and walking with Christ produces .. if you have nothing you're doing nothing but reading.. hearer only
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wrong faith produces walking with produces. you will not walk (work) if you do not have faith

your tryign to mix faith and works, CANT DO IT.
 
I can only surmise that those who insist works play a part, must either not have a clear understanding of scripture or they have a guilty conscience that no amount of works will ever expunge

the Bible CLEARLY states that all our righteousness is a filthy rags...as already been provided for in a couple of posts

the works that follow should come about by the Holy Spirit and not our efforts...the world does plenty of good works and yet they are not saved if they do not know Christ

clearly, there is some foggy thinking going on....
 
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Didn't I already say you're twisting my words... Ask for more instead of telling me I'm wrong
 
Some have a slippery way of leaving them out and it is to the misfortune of newbies that it happens.. let's be sound is all I'm advocating.. Paul said his hands were clean BC he didn't neglect to give them the full counsel of God...
 
HisHolly said:
Demonstrate, show, prove.. all words.. but I'm closed minded.:rolleyes:.
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Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not by the merits of our works.

It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24).

James does not teach that we are saved by works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Agreed?
 
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I know this. I'm not saying otherwise
mailmandan said:
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not by the merits of our works.

It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24).

James does not teach that we are saved by works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Agreed?
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It is very interesting that in James's examples of faith "being made alive" by a work or a corresponding action.

Both Rahab and Abraham each did a "one time" corresponding action to demonstrate their faith.

Abraham believed God and offered up Isaac on the alter. Rahab received the spies. Both one time events in their life - God calls this faith in action.


James 2:20-25 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?

[SUP]21 [/SUP] Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar?

[SUP]22 [/SUP] You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected;

[SUP]23 [/SUP] and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "AND ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS," and he was called the friend of God.

[SUP]24 [/SUP] You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

[SUP]25 [/SUP] In the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way?

By the way - Abraham was only circumcised "once" - we too were circumcised with the circumcision of Christ where our inner man in Christ is cut away from our flesh when we believed in Christ. Col. 2:11

Paul and James completely go together and do not cancel each other out.

We do the very same thing when we hear the message of Christ and we believe and then God seals us with the Holy Spirit. This is our faith with a corresponding action or a "work".

Ephesians 1:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

Romans 10:8-10 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] But what does it say? "THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART"—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching,

[SUP]9 [/SUP] that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

[SUP]10 [/SUP]for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

This is faith with corresponding action - or a work.
 
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A car can run or not run.. how do you gauge the speed if it is? The speedometer.. likewise.. how can someone know if they are of the faith? Works produced... Glossing over works as a visual helps no one
 
HisHolly said:
Thats what I'm saying.. you are twisting BC you fail to translate how I communicate
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um no you did not say this, You said FAITH PLUS Walking equals.

That is NOT THE SAME as saying FAITH PRODUCES walking. they are two different things.
 
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