One reason we've had so little discipleship is because many think Scripture is about only keeping and losing salvation. With this mindset we teach rules and religion not relationship and growth.
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Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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Bill, I like you, but I must disagree.........the only thing that makes brothers and sisters in Christ is biblical salvation.....someone who teaches a false gospel (according to the bible) is not a brother or sister in Christ....two cannot walk together unless in agreement....we need to get over this fallacy that everyone that names Christ is a brother sister in Christ......many will reject this, argue this, stand against this and probably deride and chide me....nonetheless it is the truth. One who teaches a false gospel is an enemy of the cross willfully or ignorantly.......I know this is a tough truth, but it is true.
This does not mean that I will not talk to them, debate them or even witness to them......or that I dislike them or hate them.......just saying
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i see what you are saying.
Maybe I can clarify what I was trying to convey.
keeping and losing are brothers. Brothers to each other.
As they work together they beat others up, missed the S of other.
Hope that makes more sense of what I was trying to convey.
As always open to correction.
ps, I like you as well
Cool....in the 80's and 90's played a lot of rock/metal like Dokken, Metallica, Scorpions, Poison etc.....Now when I pick it up I just jam my own stuff......go thru stages....will play it for a while and maybe set it down for months on end....I sold the only guitar my dad left me (killed when 3) a mint 61 Les Paul Gibson SG in 90 to move and get right....Serial number 187.....still kick myself....Like Ibanez, Jackson guitars with EMG 85 pickups.....
Ouch!! That stinks man.
I used to play a lot of the same stuff too, I actually use my double bass kick in some of the faster blues we play, just to keep to my metal roots
Works without an understanding of Spiritual reality in Christ misses the point completely. Works are not what we do to be saved, but they are the life of one who is saved. The reason so many trip over this is because the word, "Works" is quite nebulous. In Scripture terms it's literally love one another. The reason we employ the idea of "works" is because it distracts from the idea of our current spiritual reality in Christ. Please remember the natural mind is an enemy to the things of God. Thus in order to SEE what God is doing/saying we must go into the spiritual truths of Scripture. This journey is not found by our minds, but by accessing the Mind of Christ, who is Holy Spirit, the One who leads us, the Body of Christ.
I realize that may have been unclear, let me say it like this: I stress the new creation reality found in Christ because I believe it is the entry point of being discipled by the Spirit of our Lord. Works are the expression of this life. They are the navigation points we are given to discern if we are lead by flesh or Spirit. They calibrate us to where we are on our journey of discovery in Christ. But they are not what give us access nor are they what we strive to by the flesh. If we do it in our power, it misses the point of discipleship completely. They are done freely without strings that we might be purified by His Spirit and Truth. We are pruned by His word.
I realize that may have been unclear, let me say it like this: I stress the new creation reality found in Christ because I believe it is the entry point of being discipled by the Spirit of our Lord. Works are the expression of this life. They are the navigation points we are given to discern if we are lead by flesh or Spirit. They calibrate us to where we are on our journey of discovery in Christ. But they are not what give us access nor are they what we strive to by the flesh. If we do it in our power, it misses the point of discipleship completely. They are done freely without strings that we might be purified by His Spirit and Truth. We are pruned by His word.
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Amen Cee,
We always characteristic work and fruits as action and behavior, things that we as Christians "like" to see others display.
Yet a lot of the "works' we do are just taking us away from our true rest.
As humans we love to keep ourselves busy, so we ascribe the "work" we do as Gods work, to justify the fact that we are always busy, or that what we are doing is "for Gods Glory".
When it is possible that 9 out of 10 of the things we are doing aren't even what God desires us to do, and in actuality may hinder us from hearing from God and what He truly desires for us.
I think one would expect to see a change in someone that is born again, but what if we don't?
What if the change is not visible to us? We start to question, and condemn, and maybe even doubt a little bit.
This is the danger of putting things into boxes, and making ourselves "fruit inspectors" We start to make ourselves the arbiters of salvation, instead of trusting that God has got it, we attempt to change someones behavior, personality, actions into a mold of what we believe a Christian should look like.
I believe that it is my purpose to lead some folks to Christ, and truly believe that He will take care of the rest. That He will complete the work that He starts.
Originally Posted by PHart
No, the soil is the person's heart. The seed is the word of God.
Even though the word of God is imperishable, it perished in the heart of soil #2. God's word did not fail. The soil did.
God gives the free gift of faith. We respond with our trust, our believing.
See the difference? God does not do our believing for us. He gives us the gracious gift of faith (knowing something is true) so that we can then do our believing. But even our believing is coached and encouraged by God. We are not left alone to do our believing.
I don't understand your point.
Mark 4.14-
[SUP]14 [/SUP]The sower sows the word.<<<<<<<<<<<<<the sower sows soil or seed?
Luke 8.11-
[SUP]11 [/SUP]“Now the parable is this: the seed is the word of God.
Though this seems to make sense it is denying the power of the gift given.
In Christ the power of love is everything, and it's source is knowing we can choose.
As soon as you remove this, one is a slave bound without choice.
The ,problem we have with words is they can build an idea beyond where God intends.
Yes God is great, and we cannot resist His intentions that build His Kingdom.
But He works through our will and His teaching of our hearts. And it really does not
matter how well people understand, because the chosen will.
And we chose to stay because we love our King.
Could I choose not to love my wife? Yes but I chose to rejoice in the love I have.
And some do betray their love, but only Gods knows why. Glory to His name.
The spirit of these words are wrong.
To judge like this you need to know your foundations properly. I have listened to too many who have
closed hearts, sealed off parts of their lives but are happy to condemn people to hell.
The problem is simple. Only God can judge, and it is judgement that determines peoples fate.
We are called to love, empathise, relate and encourage. Once you end up getting judgemental
over an emphasis, it is the judged who sins and who has blinded themself, becoming like God
but failing to leave such situations to God.
You know the antagonism and anger really shines through, along with the condemning words.
God bless them, may He forgive such behaviour because their past has taken them captive,
and they see this all as their mission to cleanse the church.
Our mission is to show the life of Christ to all, but as they openly confess, they find such a thing
impossible.
Seriously, you are claiming to fall into unbelief has no eternal consequences?
So why did satan fall or the angels?
You are saying after seeing the Kingdom, disowning it will not bring judgement!
This is make believe fairy land.
As Hebrews states, if Israel who were baptised in the red sea perished, how much more will those
who know Jesus yet trample His ways. It has always been this blunt.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
Jesus paid a part in our birth also, the cross
and he promised we will always be his children
Listen....my words are valid and true.....regardless of your ability to acknowledge the truth......end of story!
i hear you, but if discipleship wasn't needed to see fruit, Paul and Peter's letters wouldn't have been needed to remind believers who they were in Christ.
The DESIRE to love and do good is the first seed that is planted. Discipleship helps grow that seed into wonderful fruit. Scripture disciples our mind to renew it. And then we are no longer being conformed (discipled) by the world. But by the Spirit...
Absolutely he can be trusted.....Jesus is 100% truthful and every promise he has made will come to pass....
I will let you know if I do too!
Limey! I'm back and it was so exquisitely wonderful!!
I enjoyed the jazz but some of it was a bit too....tootley-tootley. Have no idea if you know what I mean there...
But the blues bands were just...oh, just really good!
There was a blues singer who performed at Obamas inauguration ball. She was tremendous, but the keyboard, horn and drums was too loud and drowned her out a bit which was slightly disappointing. They just weren't correctly balanced...didn't give her the space I think she should have had.
I can definitely say that fusion jazz is not my favorite. Or at least what I heard so far.
I can see why people take to blues. Just tremendous! And a positive message throughout, with many of the women singing songs about God which I didn't expect at all!
And there was a rapper who rapped a positive message and he was so amazingly good! ((Apparently, standing up and yelling bravo! is a little out of the norm
). I'm quite a square.Oh and there was a song, think it might have been called...Summertime? And the young womans voice just gave me goosebumps! I would bet she is going to become famous. Never heard someone do the things she could with her voice! She reminded me of a singer I heard when I was very little, I think her name was Minnie Ripperton...not that the songs were anything alike really, but the voices my gosh!
Okay, I just really enjoyed myself and will shut up now.