Mystery Babylon

[Cindi]

How is the faithful city become an Harlot!
It was full of judgement righteousness
lodged in it, but now murderers

Isaiah 1: 21 KJV

The word of the Lord came again unto me
saying Son of Man there were two women
the daughters of one mother, and they
committed whoredoms in Egypt they
committed whoredoms in their youth
there were their breasts pressed and there
they bruised the teats of their virginity. and
the names of them were Aholah the Elder
and Aholibah her sister and they were mine
and they bare sons and daughters thus
were their names : Samaria is Aholah and
Jerusalem is Aholibah and Aholah played
the harlot when she was mine and she doted
on her lovers on the Assyrians her neighbours

Ezekiel 23: 1- 5 KJV

And when her sister Aholibah saw this she
was more corrupt in her inordinate love than
she and in her whoredoms more than her
sister in her whoredoms

Ezekiel 23: 11 KJV


And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the
Great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt
where also our Lord was crucified

Revelation 11: 8

In Revelation the Whore is pictured as a parody of a
Jewish High Priest.

Jerusalem is the City where Christ was
Crucified. Its interesting to note that the only other city
in Revelation called 'great' is Babylon.

Saw what was going on in Jerusalem yesterday, thought it was relevant to note in these days...tragic 😦

https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/gay-pride-month/

 

[Lanolin]

Saw what was going on in Jerusalem yesterday, thought it was relevant to note in these days...tragic 😦

https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/gay-pride-month/

Huh. Do they have the same thing going on at the vatican. Or maybe they were just always prideful already and dont need to declare it.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Are catholic churches all decorated in scarlet in purple as a rule...I dont know never been to a catholic church service.

there is a period of "ordinary time" when they tend to wear green. During the Lent season and until Pentecost is when they are more likely to be wearing the purple and/or scarlet.

 

[Lanolin]

Arent the saints meant to be wearing white robes in heaven.
Why do these churches array themselves in purple and scarlet. Dont they even read the book of Revelation? Or do they just have the chinese whispers version of the Bible.

I would think the people in catholic churches might recognise themselves in chapter 17 if its so obvious to everyone else that its Rome. Or do their bibles say something else.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

This makes absolutely no sense.

The Antichrist is created by Satan to deceive people into thinking that he is the true Christ. Jesus said that many would come claiming to be Christ, and there have been quite a few false christs since that time. But this Man of Sin will dazzle the world with his charisma and his miracles, while he claims to be God and Christ. And since God will send strong delusion on an unbelieving world at that time, almost the whole world will believe that he is the true Messiah.

Islam is expecting the Mahdi at "end of days". Judaism is expecting their Messiah also at the end of days. Even Hindus believe that "the Christ" will appear at the end of days. Therefore this man will somehow convince all these groups (along with the rest of the world) that he is "the Christ".

How can you be so certain that the "Man of Sin" is to be just one and only one person?

Let us refer to Deuteronomy 18:18-19
"I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. I will put My words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. And I will hold accountable anyone who does not listen to My words that that prophet speaks in My name."

Are we to interpret Deuteronomy 18:18-19 so riggedly as to declare that God promised one and only one more prophet after Moses? This would be a mistake as we in fact know that God did send more than one prophet. Often though He had sent them one-at-a-time.

So if we should not be too rigged in our understand of "prophet" in Deuteronomy 18:18-19 then perhaps we should take care not to be too rigged in our interpretation of the "Man of Sin" in 2Thessalonians 2:3?

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Arent the saints meant to be wearing white robes in heaven.
Why do these churches array themselves in purple and scarlet. Dont they even read the book of Revelation? Or do they just have the chinese whispers version of the Bible.

I would think the people in catholic churches might recognise themselves in chapter 17 if its so obvious to everyone else that its Rome. Or do their bibles say something else.

No one can understand scripture without guidance from the Holy Spirit.
Many churches are dead (without the presence of the Holy Spirit).
therefore, they cannot understand scripture, and people at these churches are not getting saved

When did these churches go off the rails (become devoid of the Holy Spirit)?
I see Scripture giving us insight on this as well.

 

[Lanolin]

No one can understand scripture without guidance from the Holy Spirit.
Many churches are dead (without the presence of the Holy Spirit).
therefore, they cannot understand scripture, and people at these churches are not getting saved

When did these churches go off the rails (become devoid of the Holy Spirit)?
I see Scripture giving us insight on this as well.

Good question, I dont know, maybe when they copied anais and saphirra who,lied to the holy spirit and said they sold everything but actually kept some of it back for themselves?

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

1Timothy 4:1-
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.

---------------------
TIMELINE showing a progression of mandated celibacy

Peter, a Galilee fisherman, whom the Catholic Church considers the first Pope, was married. Some Popes were the sons of Popes.

The first written mandate requiring priests to be chaste came in AD 304. Canon 33 of the Council of Elvira stated that all"bishops, presbyters, and deacons and all other clerics" were to" abstain completely from their wives and not to have children."

A short time later, in 325 AD, the Council of Nicea, convened by Constantine, rejected a ban on priests marrying requested by Spanish clerics.

The practice of priestly celibacy began to spread in the Western Church in the early Middle Ages. In the early 11th century Pope Benedict VIII responded to the decline in priestly morality by issuing a rule prohibiting the children of priests from inheriting property. A few decades later Pope Gregory VII issued a decree against clerical marriages.

The Church definitively took a stand in favor of celibacy in the twelfth century at the Second Lateran Council held in 1139, when a rule was approved forbidding priests to marry. In 1563, the Council of Trent reaffirmed the tradition of celibacy.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

1Timothy 4:1-
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.
--------------------------------
In Roman Catholicism
Current practice of fast and abstinence is regulated by Canons 1250–1253 of the 1983 code. They specify that all Fridays throughout the year, and the time of Lent are penitential times throughout the entire Church. All adults (those who have attained the 'age of majority', which is 18 years in canon law) are bound by law to fast on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday until the beginning of their sixtieth year. All persons who have completed their fourteenth year are bound by the law of abstinence on all Fridays unless they are solemnities, and again on Ash Wednesday;

In Methodism
"The General Rules of the Methodist Church," written by the founder of Methodism, John Wesley, wrote that "It is expected of all who desire to continue in these societies that they should continue to evidence their desire of salvation, by attending upon all the ordinances of God, such are: the public worship of God; the ministry of the Word, either read or expounded; the Supper of the Lord; family and private prayer; searching the Scriptures; and fasting or abstinence."[3] The Directions Given to Band Societies (25 December 1744) mandated fasting and abstinence from meat on all Fridays of the year,[5][2] a practice that was reemphasized by Phoebe Palmer and became standard in the Methodist churches of the holiness movement

In Anglicanism
Anglican formularies, particularly the Book of Common Prayer, have generally required abstinence from meat on Fridays, though it is difficult to gauge how widely followed this practice has been among Anglicans. The wording in the 1928 Book of Common Prayer of the Episcopal Church describes "All the Fridays in the Year, except Christmas Day and the Epiphany, or any Friday which may intervene between these Feasts" as days "on which the church requires such a measure of abstinence as is more especially suited to extraordinary acts and exercises of devotion"

 

[Lanolin]

1Timothy 4:1-
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.
--------------------------------
In Roman Catholicism
Current practice of fast and abstinence is regulated by Canons 1250–1253 of the 1983 code. They specify that all Fridays throughout the year, and the time of Lent are penitential times throughout the entire Church. All adults (those who have attained the 'age of majority', which is 18 years in canon law) are bound by law to fast on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday until the beginning of their sixtieth year. All persons who have completed their fourteenth year are bound by the law of abstinence on all Fridays unless they are solemnities, and again on Ash Wednesday;

In Methodism
"The General Rules of the Methodist Church," written by the founder of Methodism, John Wesley, wrote that "It is expected of all who desire to continue in these societies that they should continue to evidence their desire of salvation, by attending upon all the ordinances of God, such are: the public worship of God; the ministry of the Word, either read or expounded; the Supper of the Lord; family and private prayer; searching the Scriptures; and fasting or abstinence."[3] The Directions Given to Band Societies (25 December 1744) mandated fasting and abstinence from meat on all Fridays of the year,[5][2] a practice that was reemphasized by Phoebe Palmer and became standard in the Methodist churches of the holiness movement

In Anglicanism
Anglican formularies, particularly the Book of Common Prayer, have generally required abstinence from meat on Fridays, though it is difficult to gauge how widely followed this practice has been among Anglicans. The wording in the 1928 Book of Common Prayer of the Episcopal Church describes "All the Fridays in the Year, except Christmas Day and the Epiphany, or any Friday which may intervene between these Feasts" as days "on which the church requires such a measure of abstinence as is more especially suited to extraordinary acts and exercises of devotion"

Thats interesting i didnt know that about the methodist church. I thought they broke away from the anglicans but seems they retain much of their anglo-catholic practices.

 

[Lanolin]

Because there seems to be so many false churches around it must be really hard for a new believer to find their way into fellowship with the saints. I know when I first came to faith it was like what church do I go to, theres so many.

I suppose God leads you if you ask Him about it but I can see people that just unwittingly go to the nearest one and not be aware of the traps satan has laid.

The one thing thats curious about mystery babylon is that revelation does specify its a CITY, not a church. If it was a church, wouldnt it have said it was? The first few chapters all talk about seven churches and its obvious not all of them are perfect or are pleasing to Jesus.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

More Food for Thought.
Could Mormonism with its adulterous, polygamous history also fall under the umbrella of Whore of Babylon?

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Because there seems to be so many false churches around it must be really hard for a new believer to find their way into fellowship with the saints. I know when I first came to faith it was like what church do I go to, theres so many.

I suppose God leads you if you ask Him about it but I can see people that just unwittingly go to the nearest one and not be aware of the traps satan has laid.

The one thing thats curious about mystery babylon is that revelation does specify its a CITY, not a church. If it was a church, wouldnt it have said it was? The first few chapters all talk about seven churches and its obvious not all of them are perfect or are pleasing to Jesus.

The church is not a building or a denomination. According to the Bible, the church is the body of Christ—all those who have placed their faith in Jesus Christ for salvation. The universal church consists of everyone, everywhere, who has a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

Local churches are gatherings of people who claim the name of Christ. Members of a local church may or may not be members of the universal church, depending on the genuineness of their faith.

I content that the Vatican is a City, but not a part of the universal church.

 

[Lanolin]

The church is not a building or a denomination. According to the Bible, the church is the body of Christ—all those who have placed their faith in Jesus Christ for salvation. The universal church consists of everyone, everywhere, who has a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

Local churches are gatherings of people who claim the name of Christ. Members of a local church may or may not be members of the universal church, depending on the genuineness of their faith.

I content that the Vatican is a City, but not a part of the universal church.

How do you tell they are genuine. I think what many people are saying is the RCC is not a genuine church or body of Christ. But many people make the city of mystery Babylon out to be Rome, not the Vatican.
Although isnt the Vatican IN Rome. Not many people actually live in the Vatican..think the population is only about 1000 or so. If so how does revelation 18:4 apply when it says 'come out of her my people, and do not partake in her sins, and recieve not of her plagues.

As far as i know there are rcc gatherings all over the world and many cities of the world

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

How do you tell they are genuine. I think what many people are saying is the RCC is not a genuine church or body of Christ. But many people make the city of mystery Babylon out to be Rome, not the Vatican.
Although isnt the Vatican IN Rome. Not many people actually live in the Vatican..think the population is only about 1000 or so. If so how does revelation 18:4 apply when it says 'come out of her my people, and do not partake in her sins, and recieve not of her plagues.

As far as i know there are rcc gatherings all over the world and many cities of the world

Sure, the RCC "sits by many waters" [Rev17:1] meaning it is worldwide. But it is all centralized and ruled by Vatican City. Many other denominations although considered to be different pledge allegiance to the very same "catholic and apostolic church" as the RCC does.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Another way to look at it is that Rome is that City. The Vatican, with its courts and walls, and veils and altars..., is the Temple within that city. Vatican City is the temple where the Man of Sin resides.

Many other denominations which are considered to be different or reformed from the RCC are really still in allegiance to Rome.

 

[Lanolin]

Another way to look at it is that Rome is that City. The Vatican, with its courts and walls, and veils and altars..., is the Temple within that city. Vatican City is the temple where the Man of Sin resides.

Many other denominations which are considered to be different or reformed from the RCC are really still in allegiance to Rome.

Ok. Well you might as well give a list for peoples edification. But then would that make the SDA church the 'only true church' because they are the main ones who fiercely oppose catholics. They claim they are the remnant too.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Ok. Well you might as well give a list for peoples edification. But then would that make the SDA church the 'only true church' because they are the main ones who fiercely oppose catholics. They claim they are the remnant too.

I'm not sure what you mean by your first sentence.

I am not involved with the Seventh-Day Adventists (SDA). I have never been to one of their services or buildings. Actually, I know very little about SDA and have yet to formulate an opinion on them. I have gathered thus far that my eschatology views align more with SDA then say with Baptists. But please don't group me with SDA simply b/c of my eschatology views.

One is either Born Again of Water and Spirit or they are not. Those who are truly born of the Spirit are members with Christ and members in the 'only true church'. Those who are not born of the Spirit remain deceived by the evil one - there are many deceptions and false claims out there.

Therefore, I do not embrace, give glory or trust any denomination. I embrace, give glory, and trust in Christ alone!

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Another way to look at it is that Rome is that City. The Vatican, with its courts and walls, and veils and altars..., is the Temple within that city. Vatican City is the temple where the Man of Sin resides.

Many other denominations which are considered to be different or reformed from the RCC are really still in allegiance to Rome.

The prophesy of the Whore of Babylon encompasses a period of time, perhaps several hundreds of years.
So this has to be accounted for in the interpretation, and where we fall into it at the present time.

For example some protestant reformers were probably successful in fully separating from the RCC while others may not have been. Those sects or denominations that say did fully separate from the RCC may over a time period migrate back toward union with the RCC.
- We see this with a number of the mainline protestant churches where they and the RCC did not recognize each other's baptisms for a time, but today they now do.
- A number of mainline protestant churches ceased performing the imposition of Ashes on the forehead, but today they are now re-adopting this tradition.

 

[Lanolin]

I'm not sure what you mean by your first sentence.

I am not involved with the Seventh-Day Adventists (SDA). I have never been to one of their services or buildings. Actually, I know very little about SDA and have yet to formulate an opinion on them. I have gathered thus far that my eschatology views align more with SDA then say with Baptists. But please don't group me with SDA simply b/c of my eschatology views.

One is either Born Again of Water and Spirit or they are not. Those who are truly born of the Spirit are members with Christ and members in the 'only true church'. Those who are not born of the Spirit remain deceived by the evil one - there are many deceptions and false claims out there.

Therefore, I do not embrace, give glory or trust any denomination. I embrace, give glory, and trust in Christ alone!

Im not lumping you with them its just an observation. I think a few posters had posted links to sda sites regarding mystery babylon thats all. SDAS are quite vociferous about catholicism being the whore and sunday worship being the mark of the beast.