More on Baptism, simple version

[CorrectiveLens]

You're delusional. It's a requirement of salvation instituted by the Lord himself.

Mk 16:15-16

15And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. 16He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

pretty clear.

belief + baptism = salvation

belief + baptism are inextricably linked together by the conjunction and. Not either separately but both are necessary.
.

Mk 16: 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved
Acts 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after the Holy Spirit is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
It is the Holy Spirit that is the driving force for Christians to spread the Gospel of Jesus by preaching. That means that you have to be baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit which Christ does when you believe in Him. You get baptized in the name of the Father when He grants you the repentance necessary to turn to Him. You get baptized in the name of the Son when you put your trust in Jesus death for the forgiveness of sins. You get baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit when you get filled with the Holy Spirit who perfects you by filling your heart with the divine love shared by Father and Son so that all thoughts and actions are motivated by love which means that we will be obeying the Spirit of the Law upon which the Letter of the Law is based. It is the Holy Spirit that identifies us as part of the body of Christ , and as such, members of the Father's family.

Belief in Christ (baptism in the name of the Son) + baptism in the name of the Holy Spirit = salvation.
Father, Son, and Holy Spirit all have a part in our salvation

 

[DJT_47]

Respectfully, You must be blind. Paul first tells them that John said that they have to believe in Christ. It says that they were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ when they heard this, not after they heard this. They were already baptized with water but apparently that was not enough to be able to receive the Holy Spirit. You get baptized in the name of the Son, not when you get wet, but when you believe. You have to be baptized (without water) in the name of the Son (by believing) in order to get baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit because, as John said in Acts 1: 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now. Acts 1: 8 references the great commission which was given by Christ. Acts 1: 8 But ye shall receive power, after the Holy Spirit is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost paart of the earth. It's amazing to me that you think that when they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus they had gone back and got water baptized again. It seems that you are pretty obstinate, so what I'm going to do is pray for your understanding. Also, athe references to water baptism, such as Peter and Timothy and Phillip with the Ethiopian eunuch were done by Jewish Christians who still followed Jewish tradition of spiritual cleansing with water.

Don't pray for me, you're the one that can't read and/or understand. Pray for yourself. Goodbye 👋

 

[George71]

Romans 10:9-13 If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

 

[DJT_47]

Romans 10:9-13 If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

That's true, but not all. That's not the only passage in the bible that deals with salvation. Belief and confession are not all that's required.

 

[George71]

That's true, but not all. That's not the only passage in the bible that deals with salvation. Belief and confession are not all that's required.

But isn't submitting to baptism a graphic way of confessing that you are unclean/need cleansing?

 

[DJT_47]

But isn't submitting to baptism a graphic way of confessing that you are unclean/need cleansing?

When someone claims that baptism is only for some sort of outward expression to orhers, which it isn't as tge scriptures clearly teach otherwise, I always point them to the book.of Acts and the conversion of the Ethiopian eunuch in chapter 8. He was briefly taught the gospel by Philip, and he asked "See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?", in verse 36. Si obviously, Philip's preaching to him of the gospel included the need to be baptized. Philip said he may, if he believed, and the eunuch confessed he believed Jesus Christ is the Son of God, which also satisfies Romans 10:9 confession requirement, and he was then immediately baptized. So, you link that conversion record with Acts 2:38 which adds repentance and baptism for the remission of sins, and you have the complete picture and list of requirements.
1. Belief
2. Confession of belief
3. Repentance
4. Water immersion (baptism) in the name of Jesus Christ, in other words, by his authority.

Keep in mind the eunuch and Philip were in the middle of nowhere, so his baptism wasn't an outward demonstration of anything to anyone

 

[CorrectiveLens]

The first Christians were devout Jews who still celebrated Jewish traditions such as the Passover, circumcision, baptism , etc. When they figured out that Gentiles were included in salvation, they at first wanted the Gentiles to follow their same traditions and practices such as circumcision and baptism. They eliminated circumcision for the Gentiles, but the water baptism remained because the tradition was so strong and prevalent. John said that it will be Christ who will be baptizing with the Holy Spirit and not water.
Water baptism is a Jewish tradition that the Jews still practice today. It started in Leviticus where all the different ways to become spiritually unclean is given. In the middle of all these ways to become unclean is a scripture that explains spiritual cleaning with running water. Today, many Jewish synagogues have pools of water called mikvas where baptism occurs for spiritual cleansing. That is why Jews from all over went to John's baptism. They wanted to become spiritually clean.

 

[DJT_47]

Respectfully, You must be blind. Paul first tells them that John said that they have to believe in Christ. It says that they were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ when they heard this, not after they heard this. They were already baptized with water but apparently that was not enough to be able to receive the Holy Spirit. You get baptized in the name of the Son, not when you get wet, but when you believe. You have to be baptized (without water) in the name of the Son (by believing) in order to get baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit because, as John said in Acts 1: 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now. Acts 1: 8 references the great commission which was given by Christ. Acts 1: 8 But ye shall receive power, after the Holy Spirit is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost paart of the earth. It's amazing to me that you think that when they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus they had gone back and got water baptized again. It seems that you are pretty obstinate, so what I'm going to do is pray for your understanding. Also, all the references to water baptism, such as Peter and Timothy and Phillip with the Ethiopian eunuch were done by Jewish Christians who still followed Jewish tradition of spiritual cleansing with water.

Respectfully, You must be blind. Paul first tells them that John said that they have to believe in Christ. It says that they were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ when they heard this, not after they heard this. They were already baptized with water but apparently that was not enough to be able to receive the Holy Spirit. You get baptized in the name of the Son, not when you get wet, but when you believe. You have to be baptized (without water) in the name of the Son (by believing) in order to get baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit because, as John said in Acts 1: 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now. Acts 1: 8 references the great commission which was given by Christ. Acts 1: 8 But ye shall receive power, after the Holy Spirit is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost paart of the earth. It's amazing to me that you think that when they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus they had gone back and got water baptized again. It seems that you are pretty obstinate, so what I'm going to do is pray for your understanding. Also, all the references to water baptism, such as Peter and Timothy and Phillip with the Ethiopian eunuch were done by Jewish Christians who still followed Jewish tradition of spiritual cleansing with water.

They were baptized in water but not into Christ. John's baptism was in water but would have to be done over and over again upon renewed sinning. Being baptized into Christ is once and then simply repentance is necessary upon future sins. Furthermore, the Lord adds you to his body which is the church per Acts 2:47. Not so by John's baptism. Also by being baptized into Christ, you receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, the Spirit itself, and not gifts of the Spirit which become manifested through or by it. Not so with John's baptism. Hence., the need to be re-baptized, immerse in water again by by the authority of Jesus Christ, in his name. You couldn't be baptized into his death, as the scriptures say, while he was yet alive as when John was baptizing. So once again, the clear need to immerse.

Acts 22:16

And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

 

[WayneKCobb]

I go to an Anglican church from time to time. The minster preached on the "Jesus plus" gospel that has been common since the earliest days of the church. To claim that someone is not saved unless they are baptised in water is a "Jesus plus" gospel and is false.

This can be clearly shown from God's word. The clearest, to me at least, is found in Acts 15. I'll not recount the event as we can read it for ourselves. This is the part that refutes the "plus" of baptism:
Acts 15:10 (in reference to circumcision)

"Now then, why do you test God by placing on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11On the contrary, we believe it is through the grace of the Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

Acts 15:28 & 29
"It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond these essential requirements: You must abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals, and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things."

Even these requirements are post-salvation and not in order to be saved. As Peter said so eloquently, Israel was not able to fulfil God's commandments in spite of having the law and the prophets. Only those who are born again can be free from sin. And who is instantly holy in daily living? That's why we have the blood of Christ to cleanse us when we do sin.

The religious love to put burdens on people. Salvation is still by grace, through faith and not by works. I'll say it again, Christians should be baptised because they are born again, not in order to be born again.

I have some questions to ask in regards to these two scriptures:

Hebrews 11:1 - Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Hebrews 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

1. How does one get hope?
2. What is hope?
3. How is faith like hope?
4. How is faith different than hope?

Thank you very much for answering these questions!
Wayne Cobb

 

[Wansvic]

Respectfully, You must be blind. Paul first tells them that John said that they have to believe in Christ. It says that they were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ when they heard this, not after they heard this. They were already baptized with water but apparently that was not enough to be able to receive the Holy Spirit. You get baptized in the name of the Son, not when you get wet, but when you believe. You have to be baptized (without water) in the name of the Son (by believing) in order to get baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit because, as John said in Acts 1: 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now. Acts 1: 8 references the great commission which was given by Christ. Acts 1: 8 But ye shall receive power, after the Holy Spirit is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost paart of the earth. It's amazing to me that you think that when they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus they had gone back and got water baptized again. It seems that you are pretty obstinate, so what I'm going to do is pray for your understanding. Also, all the references to water baptism, such as Peter and Timothy and Phillip with the Ethiopian eunuch were done by Jewish Christians who still followed Jewish tradition of spiritual cleansing with water.

Baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus is water baptism. Acts 10:43, 47-48:

Acts 10:47-48
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

In each of the detailed conversion accounts the people experience receiving the Holy Ghost/Spirit, and being baptized in water in the name of Jesus.

Acts 2:38-39
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, AND ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.


Acts 8:12-17 (Samaritans-half Jewish-half Gentile)
But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done.
Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
(For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. THEY HAD ONLY BEEN WATER BAPTIZED)
Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

Acts 10:43-48 (Gentiles)
43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. THEN ANSWERED Peter,

Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.


Acts 19:2-6 (Disciples who did not realize they had to water baptized in Jesus name)
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

NOTICE IT WAS AFTER THEIR BEING RE-BAPTIZED IN WATER THAT THEY RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST:
And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 22:14-16 (Paul's water baptism)
And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

I have some questions to ask in regards to these two scriptures:

Hebrews 11:1 - Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Hebrews 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

1. How does one get hope?
2. What is hope?
3. How is faith like hope?
4. How is faith different than hope?

Thank you very much for answering these questions!
Wayne Cobb

Precious friend, thanks for the Great questions - hope this helps -

1) faith, 2) love, and 3) hope:

Three Tenses of God's Eternal Salvation

Amen.

 

[Lamar]

To claim that someone is not saved unless they are baptised in water is a "Jesus plus" gospel and is false.

To claim that someone can be saved by faith without obedience is a "dead faith" gospel and is quite false.

You are playing with faith alone regeneration theology and it is rather dangerous.

No one is "saved" by faith alone, hence the lack of a biblical text example.

Salvation without the remission of sins??? Think about that.

 

[LightOfMyLife]

Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins. It is the blood that washes away our sins. Baptism represents the death, burial, and resurrection. I was baptized at age 7, but I was also baptized at 34 years old as an adult. Jesus was baptized in the Jordan River by his cousin John The Baptist.

 

[Gideon300]

To claim that someone can be saved by faith without obedience is a "dead faith" gospel and is quite false.

You are playing with faith alone regeneration theology and it is rather dangerous.

No one is "saved" by faith alone, hence the lack of a biblical text example.

Salvation without the remission of sins??? Think about that.

To claim that someone can be saved by faith without obedience is a "dead faith" gospel and is quite false.

You are playing with faith alone regeneration theology and it is rather dangerous.

No one is "saved" by faith alone, hence the lack of a biblical text example.

Salvation without the remission of sins??? Think about that.

Salvation includes the remission of sins. When you receive Christ (John 1:12) you are born again and your sins are forgiven. Jesus healed many and told them that their sins were forgiven. There was no requirement to be baptised either for healing or forgiveness. Some Christians want to make salvation way more complicated than it needs to be. There is no formula. "God be merciful to me, a sinner" is enough. Once a person is born again, God will lead him to the truth about salvation and what that entails. That is a lifetime's work.

 

[Gideon300]

I have some questions to ask in regards to these two scriptures:

Hebrews 11:1 - Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Hebrews 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

1. How does one get hope?
2. What is hope?
3. How is faith like hope?
4. How is faith different than hope?

Thank you very much for answering these questions!
Wayne Cobb

Great question, one that I struggled with for a long time. Faith is spiritual eyesight. We see with our physical eyes. We know that the sky is blue and grass is green. Tell that to a blind man and he will say, "What do you mean, blue?" However, faith must have something to believe in, otherwise it's meaningless. I had a few hippy friends as a young man. "Keep the faith, man" one would say. Keep the faith about what? That's where hope comes in. Someone described it as "the mould into which you pour faith".

Another way of translating Hebews 11:1 is "Faith substantiates things hoped for........." We get our hope mostly from God's word. There many, many amazing promises that God has given us. When we look at those promises with the mind's eye, logic and reason, we may say that they are impossible. For example, we may have a financial problem. I struggled to give as a young Christian. I reasoned that I could only give if I had enough. I never had enough! Eventually, I learned to trust God. I started to give. My finances became progressively better. It's clear as day in the Bible. Faith takes God at His word and hope is found in His word.

Faith is always "now". Hope is always future. Once we put our faith in God's hope, we have the experience of what we hoped for. And that is how faith and hope work. Both are essential. Both are eternal.

 

[Lamar]

Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins.

Agreed but no one is debating this.

It is the blood that washes away our sins.

Agreed but this is a very metaphysical term. I suspect you are using this term to negate the command for the remission of sins at the point of water baptism. Is my suspicion correct?

Baptism represents the death, burial, and resurrection.

Agreed and the wedding garment represents your acceptance into the banquet.

Matthew 22:10-13
10 So the servants went out into the streets and gathered all the people they could find, the bad as well as the good, and the wedding hall was filled with guests. 11 “But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12 He asked, ‘How did you get in here without wedding clothes, friend?’ The man was speechless. 13 “Then the king told the attendants, ‘Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

Both the good and the bad were in the banquet but only the one without the proper garment (deed) was thrown out. Jesus even called him friend but still had him removed because of the lack of the physical action of wearing the proper garment.


James 2:20-25
20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? 21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23 And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,” and he was called God’s friend. 24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.
25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? 26 As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

We may disagree on what may be needed to be obeyed but not the need to obey. Anyone who pushes the remission of sins without the need to obey is pushing a dead faith.

I was baptized at age 7, but I was also baptized at 34 years old as an adult. Jesus was baptized in the Jordan River by his cousin John The Baptist.

I don't know what this has to do with anything.