Making an Image

[toyspy]

Good day. I hope all is well with you.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

This Exodus 20:4-6 verses, along with Leviticus 26:1, Deuteronomy 4:15-18, Deuteronomy 5:8, and others that I might have forgotten - what does the image include? Does it pertain to all and any images? Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God? What about photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, action figures, etc.?

Thank you very much.

 

[shittim]

No one has been under the curse of the Law since Jesus said "It is finished".
Jesus said "All things are new in me".
blessings

 

[ResidentAlien]

Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God?

This part, in my opinion. Something you see a lot are church buildings full of statues and idols. All over the place you see "Our lady" of this or that. Many of these idols supposedly have miraculous powers and people come from all over the world to worship them and get a miracle. They actually walk to them on their knees. As for paintings, sculptures and photos I think it just depends on what a person does with them.

 

[shittim]

When a post begins with "my opinion" , you have a huge red flag showing it can't be truth.
No one in Christ has an "opinion" that matters, His Own are "hidden in Him" as the truth of scripture states. His thoughts, actions and deeds become the believers thoughts, actions, and deeds as we become conformed to the image of the Son.
Please be forewarned, an unbeliever masquerading as a believer on a Christian forum will be oblivious of this.

This gentleman focused on the ministry of John G. Lake, who not only had a testimony of thousands of healings, but could teach the Creator's healing to others.
Welcome to the forum Toyspy,

 

[TruthDefender]

Good day. I hope all is well with you.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

This Exodus 20:4-6 verses, along with Leviticus 26:1, Deuteronomy 4:15-18, Deuteronomy 5:8, and others that I might have forgotten - what does the image include? Does it pertain to all and any images? Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God? What about photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, action figures, etc.?

Thank you very much.

I suppose all can be used as idols. If you put anything above God that’s your idol (job, money, animate item, etc).
None of these in themselves are wrong, it’s just how you view them….

 

[GWH]

Good day. I hope all is well with you.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

This Exodus 20:4-6 verses, along with Leviticus 26:1, Deuteronomy 4:15-18, Deuteronomy 5:8, and others that I might have forgotten - what does the image include? Does it pertain to all and any images? Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God? What about photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, action figures, etc.?

Thank you very much.

Only to idols and I-dolatry.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Physical images are OT shadows/types of NT reality, which is mental images, ie, the carnal mind, that war against the voice of the holy spirit in our hearts. So when Paul wrote to bring every thought captive to the obedience of Christ, this is what he was referring to

For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds; Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; 2 Corinthians 10:4-5​

​

So IMO, focusing on knowledge of scripture (mind) without listening to what the spirit is witnessing about scripture (heart) is worshipping an image that has become graven in our minds. That is why we continually need to be humble and listen so that we can put mental images to death and not let them rule our lives

And be not conformed to this age, but be transformed in the renewal of your mind, in the trying of yourselves, in what is the good and well-pleasing and perfect will of God. For I say by the grace being given to me, to every one being among you, to not be high-minded above what you must think; but to think to be of a sound mind; to each as God portioned a measure of belief. For just as in one body we have many members, but all members do not have the same action; Romans 12:3-4​

​

The OT high places where graven images were worshipped were shadows/types of being high minded, which essentially means thoughts that are exalted above the lowly spirit of God, the still small voice that witnesses to the truth,

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

When a post begins with "my opinion" , you have a huge red flag showing it can't be truth.
No one in Christ has an "opinion" that matters, His Own are "hidden in Him" as the truth of scripture states. His thoughts, actions and deeds become the believers thoughts, actions, and deeds as we become conformed to the image of the Son.
Please be forewarned, an unbeliever masquerading as a believer on a Christian forum will be oblivious of this.
,

Perhaps he was just being humble and didn't want to come across as "thus saith the lord" to people who are easily offended.

 

[rrcn]

No one has been under the curse of the Law since Jesus said "It is finished".
Jesus said "All things are new in me".
blessings

How do you reconcile the following with “the curse of the law”?
The mark of the beast itself is idol worship:

[1Jo 5:21 KJV] 21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
[1Co 10:7, 14 KJV] 7 Neither be ye idolaters, as [were] some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. ... 14 Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry.
[Rev 9:20 KJV] 20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:
[Rev 13:15 KJV] 15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

 

[TruthDefender]

Perhaps he was just being humble and didn't want to come across as "thus saith the lord" to people who are easily offended.

Then they should re-evaluate their thinking if they get offended by what God said….

 

[TruthDefender]

Only to idols and I-dolatry.

An idol is whatever is set/ you put above God; whether animate or inanimate.

 

[shittim]

I suppose all can be used as idols. If you put anything above God that’s your idol (job, money, animate item, etc).
None of these in themselves are wrong, it’s just how you view them….

"Idol" implies worship, anything we give first place to over the Lord.
best wishes

How do you reconcile the following with “the curse of the law”?
The mark of the beast itself is idol worship:

[1Jo 5:21 KJV] 21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
[1Co 10:7, 14 KJV] 7 Neither be ye idolaters, as [were] some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. ... 14 Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry.
[Rev 9:20 KJV] 20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:
[Rev 13:15 KJV] 15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

How do reconcile asking me when we are each to take all things to Him first?
By this time in His plan we should each be in one on one relationship to receive His wisdom and truth, not leaning on our own understanding.
His Own are not under the Law.
best wishes

 

[TruthDefender]

"Idol" implies worship, anything we give first place to over the Lord.
best wishes


, not leaning on our own understanding.
His Own are not under the Law.
best wishes

Exactly what I said and was eluding to.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Good day. I hope all is well with you.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

This Exodus 20:4-6 verses, along with Leviticus 26:1, Deuteronomy 4:15-18, Deuteronomy 5:8, and others that I might have forgotten - what does the image include? Does it pertain to all and any images? Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God? What about photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, action figures, etc.?

Thank you very much.

it’s a commandment to a people who had lived four hundred years in ancient Egypt , one of the most idolatrous places and times ever . Thier pharoahs were claiming to be and were worshipped as gods by the Egyptian people. And at that time they were the “ world “ power as far as the nations of people on earth .

they made idols and worshipped them and through them the idols they made of things like animals and animal human hybrid looking creatures like sphinx . What I’m saying is they made heaven images of pharoahs and animals and even mythical fantasized creatures , and the purpose of making the idols was worship of these false diety pharoahs . And men claiming to be God. Holding the dominion on earth in corruption and rebellion against the true and only God the creator and Lord of all things.

when he redeemed and delivered them from slavery in Egypt he was dealing with a people he hadnt spoken to in four hundred years since Jacob went into Egypt with his seventy , the original tribe of Israel who is Jacob the man. But for four hundred years they lived in an idolatrous nation and learned these idolatrous ways building images and worshipping idols they created with thier own hands as tbier god.

If you look closely this was Israel’s problematic disposition and really was a focal point of Moses law given to the children of Israel from Sinai and at horeb and also throughout thoer time in the desert of sin.

Infact before Moses even descended from the mountain with the tablets of the commandments this is what they did

he delivers them and then speaks the commandment to them from Sinai

“I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭20:2-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

i think the key is to look at that as a whole commandment not different ones . What I mean is I see it as him saying “ I Am your God, thou shall not have any god besides me , don’t make graven images of other things and bow down to worship them as gods and give them my glory I Am your God. “


And so then in my opinion having a photograph made of someone , oainting a picture of something or a child playing with a toy horse . Would in no way be recognized as violating any commandment. But the commandment is given to an idolatrous people and is about worship of idols and false gods represented by animals and figures that they worshipped like this before Moses came back down with the tablets of the covenant law

“And when the people saw that Moses delayed to come down out of the mount, the people gathered themselves together unto Aaron, and said unto him, Up, make us gods, which shall go before us; for as for this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him. And he received them at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a molten calf: and they said, These be thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭32:1, 4‬ ‭

thier intent was to have a god to worship so then they made an idol of a calf and began to worship it as thoer god . This was thier way in Egypt and what they onew but alreqdy they had broken Gods covenant the very first commandment .

I would say if we are worshipping a figure or person or anything at all even technology wise , today an idol can be a iPad or a video game or money ect then we would be included in tbat commandment . But just my opinion

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Good day. I hope all is well with you.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

This Exodus 20:4-6 verses, along with Leviticus 26:1, Deuteronomy 4:15-18, Deuteronomy 5:8, and others that I might have forgotten - what does the image include? Does it pertain to all and any images? Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God? What about photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, action figures, etc.?

Thank you very much.

I've wondered if the same at some point. After all, children pretend and girls are given baby dolls. Boys enjoy playing with images of animals like when I was 4 my parents bought me a new pair each week for the Noah's Ark at the end. That was awesome! It was the theme of a ministry later on.
Then there were army men and GI Joe action figures. I saved a collectable Peg Leg the pirate for perhaps when the Lord blesses me with a boy of my own some day.

Some would consider photographs sinful in violation of Exodus 20:4 too. I've visited a certain denomination that had no wall hanging or photographs and thought it odd. This seemed to be their belief.
If that's the case , then they should not violate their consciences by being on a computer. It is a collection of images and moving images.

To determine where I was going to stand on this issue as a man who is saved, I decided to look at the context.

We see from Exodus 20:3 the subject is...

"3Thou shalt have no other gods before me."

False gods
Then the end of vs 4 reads....

5Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me

The devil worshippers commonly hate the true God Who gives life and breath and all things.
They worship and serve the damned devils which lead the wicked to make idols, images to them.

Acts 17:29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

ANYTHING treated as an idol is not to have any place in a Christian's life.
When trying to evaluate the many images we are surrounded with, I have to go by this principle.
Is it an idol?

 

[TruthDefender]

it’s a commandment to a people who had lived four hundred years in ancient Egypt , one of the most idolatrous places and times ever . Thier pharoahs were claiming to be and were worshipped as gods by the Egyptian people. And at that time they were the “ world “ power as far as the nations of people on earth .

they made idols and worshipped them and through them the idols they made of things like animals and animal human hybrid looking creatures like sphinx . What I’m saying is they made heaven images of pharoahs and animals and even mythical fantasized creatures , and the purpose of making the idols was worship of these false diety pharoahs . And men claiming to be God. Holding the dominion on earth in corruption and rebellion against the true and only God the creator and Lord of all things.

when he redeemed and delivered them from slavery in Egypt he was dealing with a people he hadnt spoken to in four hundred years since Jacob went into Egypt with his seventy , the original tribe of Israel who is Jacob the man. But for four hundred years they lived in an idolatrous nation and learned these idolatrous ways building images and worshipping idols they created with thier own hands as tbier god.

If you look closely this was Israel’s problematic disposition and really was a focal point of Moses law given to the children of Israel from Sinai and at horeb and also throughout thoer time in the desert of sin.

Infact before Moses even descended from the mountain with the tablets of the commandments this is what they did

he delivers them and then speaks the commandment to them from Sinai

“I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭20:2-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

i think the key is to look at that as a whole commandment not different ones . What I mean is I see it as him saying “ I Am your God, thou shall not have any god besides me , don’t make graven images of other things and bow down to worship them as gods and give them my glory I Am your God. “


And so then in my opinion having a photograph made of someone , oainting a picture of something or a child playing with a toy horse . Would in no way be recognized as violating any commandment. But the commandment is given to an idolatrous people and is about worship of idols and false gods represented by animals and figures that they worshipped like this before Moses came back down with the tablets of the covenant law

“And when the people saw that Moses delayed to come down out of the mount, the people gathered themselves together unto Aaron, and said unto him, Up, make us gods, which shall go before us; for as for this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him. And he received them at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a molten calf: and they said, These be thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭32:1, 4‬ ‭

thier intent was to have a god to worship so then they made an idol of a calf and began to worship it as thoer god . This was thier way in Egypt and what they onew but alreqdy they had broken Gods covenant the very first commandment .

I would say if we are worshipping a figure or person or anything at all even technology wise , today an idol can be a iPad or a video game or money ect then we would be included in tbat commandment . But just my opinion

I agree. Egypt wasn’t the only nation for idolatry, though; idolatry has been found around the world.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I agree. Egypt wasn’t the only nation for idolatry, though; idolatry has been found around the world.

Yeah I was talking about at that time when israel was led into Egypt and given the land of goshen and for the four hundred years while they were there not hearing from God. Remember genesis 15 and the promises but yes your right it’s been the main point of all mankind’s rebellion not acknowledging the true and only God and his word to them which for some reason so few will trust and take his word because of who he is

“Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
The Pharisees therefore said unto him, Thou bearest record of thyself; thy record is not true.

…….Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:12-13, 31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Jesus answered, “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me. Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.”
‭‭John‬ ‭7:16-17‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Every word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.”
‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭30:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it’s what we were designed for and what gives us life

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

““Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.””
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:37-38‬ ‭NIV‬‬

 

[tyler87432f]

Yeah I was talking about at that time when israel was led into Egypt and given the land of goshen and for the four hundred years while they were there not hearing from God. Remember genesis 15 and the promises but yes your right it’s been the main point of all mankind’s rebellion not acknowledging the true and only God and his word to them which for some reason so few will trust and take his word because of who he is

“Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
The Pharisees therefore said unto him, Thou bearest record of thyself; thy record is not true.

…….Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:12-13, 31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Jesus answered, “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me. Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.”
‭‭John‬ ‭7:16-17‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Every word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.”
‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭30:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it’s what we were designed for and what gives us life

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

““Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. Give, and it will be given bios aethersx2 to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.””
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:37-38‬ ‭NIV‬‬

Yes i see this

 

[Randy4u2c]

The bottom line is, "you shall not bow down to them nor serve them." Anything that you worship other than God is an idol.

 

[tablet123]

Good day. I hope all is well with you.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

This Exodus 20:4-6 verses, along with Leviticus 26:1, Deuteronomy 4:15-18, Deuteronomy 5:8, and others that I might have forgotten - what does the image include? Does it pertain to all and any images? Or only those that are likely to be worshipped as idols and replace the worship of God? What about photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, action figures, etc.?

Thank you very much.

Exo 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
Exo 20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
Exo 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

Deu 4:15 Take ye therefore good heed unto yourselves; for ye saw no manner of similitude on the day that the LORD spake unto you in Horeb out of the midst of the fire:
Deu 4:16 Lest ye corrupt yourselves, and make you a graven image, the similitude of any figure, the likeness of male or female,
Deu 4:17 The likeness of any beast that is on the earth, the likeness of any winged fowl that flieth in the air,
Deu 4:18 The likeness of any thing that creepeth on the ground, the likeness of any fish that is in the waters beneath the earth:
Deu 4:19 And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven.

Act 17:29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent.

Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

The graven image has to do with worshipping the graven image to worship a false god, a false deity.

Like Babylon, and the nations did, that they wanted a physical image to worship a god they cannot see.

Also God said do not make a graven image to worship Him for you do not know what He looks like.

We are not to worship God by a physical object and we are not to worship a false god, or anything that we think is important by a physical object.

We do not worship nature like the occultists who honor the God of forces the Cosmos.

Luk 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

Mat 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Photos, sculptures, paintings, toys, and action figures do not apply as a graven image if you are not worshipping it as a deity.

But if you put those things above Jesus or anything else as more important than it is wrong.

Jesus does not mean to actually hate your family but do not put them above Jesus as more important in your life.

2Ti 3:4 lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Some people love sin more than God.