Loss of salvation???

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BillyBob

Well-known member
Dec 20, 2023
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Texas
We must endure in our faith in Jesus Christ.

Do you understand that if you do not endure then you are lost?
1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

16 Rejoice always, 17 pray without ceasing, 18 in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.

I understand that we must always do our best to obey whatever God calls us to do. But the sad fact is, - We are instructed to do many things that we are not able to do in our own strength. God knows our frame. He knows that we are weak and unable to do as He commands. That is the very reason why we need a perfect savior to intervene on our behalf.

The question should be – In your walk with God, are you placing trust in yourself or in Christ?
 

studier

Well-known member
Apr 18, 2024
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Ok. This is from scripture and a divine view point........A disciple is not greater than their RIGHT TEACHER. When fully trained they will be like their RIGHT TEACHER.

Like a spouse, we have a RIGHT TEACHER. If we don't utilize His Grace gifts to us we could find a pink elephant and think he is our right teacher.
You're eisegeting Scripture from doctrine you've been taught.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
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Objective truth cannot be decided by observing another person's behaviour.

All scripture makes it clear that saved is saved and not probation.
Who said anything about probation?

Your trust in Jesus must be a continual trust in Jesus.

You cannot on one day trust in Jesus for your salvation and then spend the rest of your life.
Not trusting in Jesus.

You are saved as long as you remain in the state of trusting in Jesus.

Belief, faith, trust, all three are the English translation of the Greek, Pistis.
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
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I'm sticking to the language of Scripture and not adding to it while calling it divine viewpoint.
Yes. You do a very good job with that. No doubt on my part.

So you don't think that the word was talking about our RIGHT TEACHER? They can just be some willy nilly dude who "loves" Jesus?
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
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Who was Jesus addressing?
Jews before the Cross took place?

Or, to the Church?
Romans 2:7
To those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;

Romans 15:4
For whatever was written in earlier times was written for our instruction, so that through perseverance and
the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.

Revelation 14:12
Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

1 Corinthians 13:7
Bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

2 Thessalonians 1:4
Therefore, we ourselves speak proudly of you among the churches of God for your perseverance and faith in the midst of all your persecutions and afflictions which you endure.

Revelation 2:3
And you have perseverance and have endured for My name’s sake, and have not grown weary.
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
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You are saved as long as you remain in the state of trusting in Jesus.
I pray that the loss/forfeit salvation crowd could see this contradiction.

You ARE NOT trusting The Lord Jesus Christ if you think you can forfeit/lose salvation.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
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1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

16 Rejoice always, 17 pray without ceasing, 18 in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.

I understand that we must always do our best to obey whatever God calls us to do. But the sad fact is, - We are instructed to do many things that we are not able to do in our own strength. God knows our frame. He knows that we are weak and unable to do as He commands. That is the very reason why we need a perfect savior to intervene on our behalf.

The question should be – In your walk with God, are you placing trust in yourself or in Christ?
Who knows the answer to these kinds of questions.

The human heart is very deceptive.

The way it works as the scripture declares we must stay faithful at all times.

If you stop calling on the Lord for your salvation then, ultimately you have broken the new covenant.

It is not about your works or what level of love you have achieved.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
3,869
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I pray that the loss/forfeit salvation crowd could see this contradiction.

You ARE NOT trusting The Lord Jesus Christ if you think you can forfeit/lose salvation.
If you stop trusting (believing) in Jesus then of course you forfeit your salvation.

This the contract you signed.

Romans 10:9
That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him
from the dead, you will be saved.

If you stop believing in Jesus then you have breached the contract.
 

Sipsey

Well-known member
Sep 27, 2018
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And what was your response or what are your thoughts?
This was about 20-25 years ago. I recruited a couple of friends and we continued the Bible study for over two years. It laid a solid foundation for me. I taught a Sunday school class of older men and a Bible study class for a number of years. Applying Biblical principals to ones everyday life should be the ultimate goal of any Bible study. I learned that life is about relationships, and unless we get the one with God right, none of our other relationships will work as they should.
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
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If you stop trusting (believing) in Jesus then of course you forfeit your salvation.

This the contract you signed.

Romans 10:9
That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him
from the dead, you will be saved.

If you stop believing in Jesus then you have breached the contract.
And I pray that you see you have stopped believing/trusting in Him. Anyone who trusts in Christ will never perish. We are His Sheep. His sheep never perish.

We cannot call ourselves His sheep if we think we can perish. His sheep never perish.

Are You one of His sheep? If Yes, stop thinking you can perish. His sheep never perish.
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
4,474
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Mark 16:9-20 is a problematic passage requiring discernment between what agrees or disagrees with the rest of the NT context. I think WB as necessary rather than as optional and recommended disagrees as I just posted to Rufus.
(Baptist vice Baptism)
Mark 16 says Jesus commanded his disciples to baptise and then commanded his disciples to teach others to do everything He had commanded them, which would logically include baptising converts. And the book of Acts chronicles those disciples baptising new believers. Where do you see a contradiction between Mark 16 and the rest of scripture?
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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A coworker ask me to join his Bible study. He was seminary trained in Greek & Hebrew, I asked him why he wanted me to join this study. He replied, “So you can learn to study for yourself, and you won’t need me.“
I am not sure what he was getting at...

That would only be true up to a point, as long as you yourself have the spiritual gift of pastor-teacher awaiting to be developed.
Then you could reach a point of not needing him to understand the Bible.
Even my pastor, who was considered a pastor's pastor and an excellent scholar, still studied the works of other men.

There are etymologists. They can teach others how to determine the meaning of certain words. But, that does
not make someone into a pastor-teacher who can teach the Bible. And, as a must, one also must become an avid student
of history. For, good Bible study requires being able to master isagogics. Isagogics is the discipline used to determine the
meaning of a word, or expression, found in the Bible to know how it was used at the time the Bible was written.

Just learning Hebrew and Greek [accurately] is a great accomplishment in itself. But it can leave one not knowing why the Greek said what it was saying... which in turn can open a pandora's box of speculations.

In the days of the formation of the church, people did not at one point leave a pastor to stay home to study for themselves.
Because a true pastor should always be growing, and his flock that follows will also continue to grow as he grows in grace and knowledge.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
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And I pray that you see you have stopped believing/trusting in Him. Anyone who trusts in Christ will never perish. We are His Sheep. His sheep never perish.

We cannot call ourselves His sheep if we think we can perish. His sheep never perish.

Are You one of His sheep? If Yes, stop thinking you can perish. His sheep never perish.
I am not talking about sheep.

I am talking about a sheep that turns into a goat.
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
4,500
776
113
Ok. This is from scripture and a divine view point........A disciple is not greater than their RIGHT TEACHER. When fully trained they will be like their RIGHT TEACHER.

Like a spouse, we have a RIGHT TEACHER. If we don't utilize His Grace gifts to us we could find a pink elephant and think he is our right teacher.
A student can be no greater than any teacher he submits to. Be it either a good one, or bad one.
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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776
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I am not talking about sheep.

I am talking about a sheep that turns into a goat.
Sheep do not turn into goats.

There are goats in sheep's clothing who might tag along with the sheep to see what is happening.
But will, eventually, remove himself from the sheep... never having been one.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
3,869
1,096
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Sheep do not turn into goats.

There are goats in sheep's clothing who might tag along with the sheep to see what is happening.
But will, eventually, remove himself from the sheep... never having been one.
Unbelievers can become believers.

Believers can become unbelievers.

Therefore, sheep can become goats.
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
4,500
776
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Some big assumptions here. Everybody seems to think they're working with God's approval or the Spirit's leading. If they are, then He has a lot of human beings being taught a lot of different and conflicting things. The hearers seem to be learning various traditions well, yet I frequently notice how they will walk away from serious focused discussion on Scripture.
The Holy Spirit is to be our guide to lead us into all the truth that God requires for our life.
Only the humble will eventually find what will satisfy.
Others, led by their emotions and human curiosity, will never find what it is they thought they were looking for.

When someone is led of the Spirit, he may at some point find himself having found what he may have not known to look for.