Israel.

[TMS]

I believe that there will be a new heaven and a new earth after the sky rolls like a scroll and those who are in Christ there will be no more death,either sorrow,nor crying.

Agree..

But many argue about what will happen for the millenium

Most agree that Jesus returns and the 1000 years begin.

But what happens is greatly debated

If the judgment has finished then it is clear that probation has closed.

If the saved are with Jesus and the Devil is chained up then there is no second chances, all has been decided.

Rev 20:3-7
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. 4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. 7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

John makes it clear that there are 2 resurrections. All will come out of the grave.. before the 1000 years and after.

Joh 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

ISRAEL saved (Spiritual Israel) will be with Jesus and the unsaved will be in the grave, dead.

 

[Shoshie]

So you just "want to reach those who will be reached for the Lord" but haven't already been doing that. Okay.

That still doesn't mean that the US is the Babylon in the book of Revelation. Babylon is not a nation. It might not even be city from what I'm reading right now.

Since you're in the "want to reach those..." stage and haven't actually started that yet, you can pray for this nation in the meantime. If you see it straying away from God then pray that God turns the nation back to Himself instead of complaining about it on a Christian forum.

I didn't say I hadn't done that. You dont know me . You are judging without knowing.

 

[Shoshie]

I feel you play gotcha whenever someone disagrees with you. The Scriptures aren't open to private interpretation. All of us can miss it at times even with seeking the Lord. We are works in progress but being hurtful and making fun of people because you disagree is very wrong. Im glad Jesus doesn't treat us that way.
Again, you dont know me nor my heart. Ive been in a very hard place. I lost 2 parents within a 5 1/2 month period. I thought by coming on this forum, Id have a chance to refresh myself on things I had studied for years and to have an outlet through the most difficult period of my life Instead, Ive been judged, and you know what the Lord says about judging.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

This re-gathering is from every corner of the world, where they will never be uprooted again. That has not happened, but it will.

sister I think I ran across something of your willing to read just two sections of scripture . Something you have been saying , and something I have been saying .

some of your point …..
“Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts. Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.

And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves, and shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: and I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.

And David ( son of David see Matthew 1:1) my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭37:11-14, 21-28‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Then some of what I’m saying

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, and had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it. And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21:1-5, 10, 12, 14, 22-27‬ ‭

i hope you see how these reconcile prophecy and then fulfilment ot and then nt

 

[Melach]

*Shrug* I'm just gonna go with God concerning Israel. He would know more than anyone else.

God is not powerless or blind. Modern Israel is 77 years old - I would think God would have gotten rid of the current Jews living in Israel by now if He thought they were not descended from ancient Israel. But nope - they're stilling living there in Israel.

You can try telling God He's wrong about the current Jews in Israel, that they don't belong there. See what He says and will do about that.

the land of israel was under islamic rule for 1400 years? why didnt God kick them out during that 1400 years?
were they also real jews?

that line of argumentation just doesnt work. the kingdom of God was taken from the jews. they are under no covenant right now. they rejected Jesus and were cut off from the people of israel, but they can be grafted back in if they dont remain in unbelief:

st.peter quoting from deuteronomy in acts 3:22-23
For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

 

[God-fearing]

sister I think I ran across something of your willing to read just two sections of scripture . Something you have been saying , and something I have been saying .

some of your point …..
“Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts. Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.

And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves, and shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: and I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.

And David ( son of David see Matthew 1:1) my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭37:11-14, 21-28‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Then some of what I’m saying

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, and had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it. And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21:1-5, 10, 12, 14, 22-27‬ ‭

i hope you see how these reconcile prophecy and then fulfilment ot and then nt

Great scriptures you posted here and yes old testament to the new.
But let's also agree that the old has to be fulfilled entirely before the new can come in.

It seems that you and others jump over into the new before the old is finished. What happens when Satan is loosed? Is there another war? Where does that battle take place. Let's take these into account also.

 

[HeIsHere]

they are under no covenant right now. they rejected Jesus and were cut off from the people of israel, but they can be grafted back in if they dont remain in unbelief:

Key point for sure, and grafted in as individuals.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Great scriptures you posted here and yes old testament to the new.
But let's also agree that the old has to be fulfilled entirely before the new can come in.

It seems that you and others jump over into the new before the old is finished. What happens when Satan is loosed? Is there another war? Where does that battle take place. Let's take these into account also.

“But let's also agree that the old has to be fulfilled entirely before the new can come in.”

yeah that’s why Jerusalem was destroyed and left desolate they chose the curse when he offered the blessing and curse. That’s I believe what some of you guys won’t acknowledge, is that he said of you obey you’ll be blessed and this good things will all be fulfilled but if you don’t o ey ot and serve and worship other gods then all these terrible curses shall surely come upon you .

ive shown this many times but then it sort of gets rejected by some of you. Others also have shown the same thing and also it’s rejected by some . Thier cofenant made at Sinai matters what’s written in it that’s the covenant made with the children of Israel . Not all nations . They broke thiers and it was fulfilled as the curse when he said “ “blessing if you obey and a curse of you don’t “

the promises in the ot are all about christ

 

[HeIsHere]

the promises in the ot are all about christ

Amen and Amen!

 

[Aaron56]

Key point for sure, and grafted in as individuals.

Yeah, covenants require a priesthood. There are no Levitical priests today and, therefore, there is no covenant that is exclusive to the Hebrews.

11Therefore, if perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron? 12For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. 13For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has officiated at the altar.

14For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood. 15And it is yet far more evident if, in the likeness of Melchizedek, there arises another priest 16who has come, not according to the law of a fleshly commandment, but according to the power of an endless life.

Paul wrote this in Galatians:

Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,” who is Christ. 17And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. 18For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Let's actually go look at the Old Testament where these promises are given to Abraham. Here is one section:

17 When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. 2 And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” 3 Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: 4 “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. 5 No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. 6 I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. 7 And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

Let's take out these verses:

"And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

The underlined "your descendants" is actually "seed" in the King James Version. The Hebrew word is zera' which is literally "seed".

No mental gymnastics are needed to understand that "your descendants" actually means the singular "seed" because Paul told us as much (see above". And that singular Seed is Christ.

Here are some other verses where the singular "seed" is used:

"And I will put enmity, Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel.”

“And as for Me, behold, I establish My covenant with you and with your descendants after you..."

"Then the LORD appeared to Abram and said, “To your descendants I will give this land.” And there he built an altar to the LORD, who had appeared to him."

“for all the land which you see I give to you and your descendants forever."

“And I will make your descendants as the dust of the earth; so that if a man could number the dust of the earth, then your descendants also could be numbered."

“...blessing I will bless you, and multiplying I will multiply your descendants as the stars of the heaven and as the sand which is on the seashore; and your descendants shall possess the gate of their enemies."

And many many more.

Here's one last one to tie it into Revelation 7:

Jacob was restating the covenant God gave to him:
“For You said, ‘I will surely treat you well, and make your descendants as the sand of the sea, which cannot be numbered for multitude.’ ”

And so we see in Revelation 7 this same multitude after the angel pronounces "144,000 from all the tribes of Israel" (which we know is symbolic):
"After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands..."

This is the many-membered Christ, God's temple, of which the multitude are its living stones.

The Living God has One Seed, Christ, to Whom all His blessing flow. Man may receive the promises of God only by being in Christ. There is no other way.

 

[HeIsHere]

The underlined "your descendants" is actually "seed" in the King James Version. The Hebrew word is zera' which is literally "seed".

No mental gymnastics are needed to understand that "your descendants" actually means the singular "seed" because Paul told us as much (see above". And that singular Seed is Christ.

Very, very helpful, thank you.
It is such a shame how people deny this truth.

 

[Aaron56]

Very, very helpful, thank you.
It is such a shame how people deny this truth.

Yeah, it's so elementary only the presence of a delusion can explain why some cannot see it.

 

[Mikael156]

There is no doubt Israel which is written throughout the bible is G-d's chosen people, but one fact one must remember is that the State of Israel is built by Zionist Jews who are completely Atheists/Anti G-d. The State is what is causing all the Jewish people so many problems and unfortunately the righteous Jews and all Jews are being tossed under a small group of leaders that are misrepresenting them. Christian Zionist should be very careful to separate Jews from the State of Israel which has nothing to do with the Jews in the Bible or how G-d wants to bring redemption. This of course is a very thorough topic and I would be more than glad to discuss this with anyone.

May Jesus come soon and save us all!

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

the land of israel was under islamic rule for 1400 years? why didnt God kick them out during that 1400 years?
were they also real jews?

that line of argumentation just doesnt work. the kingdom of God was taken from the jews. they are under no covenant right now. they rejected Jesus and were cut off from the people of israel, but they can be grafted back in if they dont remain in unbelief:

st.peter quoting from deuteronomy in acts 3:22-23
For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

God didn't kick the palestinians out because until 1948 to move the Jews in as He promised in the book of Ezekiel.

You might not be able to distinguish between Jews and palestinians, but God can. If you don't agree with Him, go ahead and tell Him He's wrong.

The Bible does say that God will bring the Jews back into their own land and never uproot them again, and He did, but I know you don't want believe that.

And that's fine, you don't have to believe it. Most people in the world either don't believe it or are oblivious to what God says He will or has already done in the Bible.

Disbelief doesn't stop Him.

 

[HeIsHere]

God didn't kick the palestinians out because until 1948 to move the Jews in as He promised in the book of Ezekiel.

Funny I did not see "1948" written anywhere in the Book of Ezekiel. Hmm.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I didn't say I hadn't done that. You dont know me . You are judging without knowing.

I feel you play gotcha whenever someone disagrees with you. The Scriptures aren't open to private interpretation. All of us can miss it at times even with seeking the Lord. We are works in progress but being hurtful and making fun of people because you disagree is very wrong. Im glad Jesus doesn't treat us that way.
Again, you dont know me nor my heart. Ive been in a very hard place. I lost 2 parents within a 5 1/2 month period. I thought by coming on this forum, Id have a chance to refresh myself on things I had studied for years and to have an outlet through the most difficult period of my life Instead, Ive been judged, and you know what the Lord says about judging.

Talk about judging! You're the one declaring that the US is the worst sinner among that nations and will be judged.

You don't even know how bad the rest of the nations are, but the US will be singled out for special destruction? The Bible doesn't say or even imply that anywhere in the Bible.

Oh, and I play violin. Should I play "Sad Romance" while you have your pity party to try to shame me?

Sad Romance

 

[Aaron56]

Funny I did not see "1948" written anywhere in the Book of Ezekiel. Hmm.

Right? And what is the "land" of the current King from Judah?

 

[HeIsHere]

Right? And what is the "land" of the current King from Judah?

Is interested in people not land, imho

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Funny I did not see "1948" written anywhere in the Book of Ezekiel. Hmm.

Does it have to say 1948?

I guess the Bible has to spell things out for you. No wonder you don't understand most of it, lol!

 

[Aaron56]

Is interested in people not land, imho

You mean, He has no stake in land that will be replaced with an eternal earth?!

Makes sense for someone Who is wise.