Is Ultimate Release from Hell Possible?

[TheDivineWatermark]

So is antichrist destroyed by the brightness of Christ, or the lake of fire?

The word translated "destroyed" in 2Th2:8 is "G2673 - katargesei / katargeo - to annul [to render inoperative]" and is the same word used in Galatians 5:4 (translated there as "severed" in the blb, esv and others), "Whoever are being justified in the Law, you are severed [G2673] from Christ"... and isn't this the kind of thing we see in Revelation 19:20 and its parallel Isaiah 24:21-22[23]?

I mean, they do not enter the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom (as do others / the saints / the righteous, at the time of His Second Coming to the earth [whereas the SECOND "PUNISH" word in the Isaiah passage correlates with the later GWTj context, that is, separated by the very specific "time period" shown to take place after the FIRST of TWO "PUNISH" words in that passage])

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^EDIT: I mean, they do not enter the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom (as do others / the saints / the righteous, at the time of His Second Coming to the earth [whereas the SECOND "PUNISH" word in the Isaiah passage correlates with the later GWTj context, that is, separated by the very specific "time period" shown to take place after the FIRST of TWO "PUNISH" words in that passage--which Rev20:10 says the beast and false prophet are still there at that time, and then a further "time allotment" is named (which in every other usage of that phrase, "the ages [plural] of the ages [plural]," means "forever"... like in Galatians 1:5, Philippians 4:20, 1 Timothy 1:17, 2 Timothy 4:18, Hebrews 13:21, Revelation 1:6, etc])

 

[Adelia]

Does the NT allow the possibility of ultimate postmortem release from Hell? No

 

[newton3003]

Does the NT allow the possibility of ultimate postmortem release from Hell?

Nope.

Once judgement has been rendered, there's no do-overs.

 

[Journeyman]

He’s destroyed by Christ by casting him into the lake of fire.

That's what Rev.19 says, but that's not what 2Thes.2 says, is it? "consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming." Is the beast destroyed by a lake of fire, or by presence of Christ? (Or is Christs presence at that time like a destroying lake of fire to the wicked? I believe this is the truth.)

The nations of the earth will be judged. See Matthew 25. Those who oppose and persecute Israel during the time of Jacob’s trouble will be cast into fire, aka the goats.

Mt.25 says Jesus casts people into the lake fire because of their apathy, not because they only prosecuted others,

For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink. I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Mt.25:42-43

So when all nations are gathered and separated into either the sheep group or the goat group, there's no giraffe, aardvark, or other groups to fit into. It's finished.

Those who aided Israel, aka the sheep, will be ushered into the reign of Christ. The believing Jews will reign with their Messiah in Jerusalem. The returning bride of Christ, the Church, will reign over the nations of the earth. That’s my take.

My take is, believing Jews are God's sheep and so are believing gentiles.

Jesus said whoever wasn't for him was a against him. It's only theologians who invented a group is neither for or against the Lord.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

To add to what I'd put in my Posts #181 #182 (about the word used in 2Th2:8 translated as "destroy" in the kjv [annul/render inoperative]), the following post [linked below] is the part about the TWO "PUNISH" words (in Isaiah 24:21-22[23], correlating with Rev19:19,21/16:14-16/20:5 at His Second Coming to the earth followed by the MK) which TWO "PUNISH" words are separated by a specific time period between:

https://christianchat.com/threads/c...our-being-gathered-to-him.184211/post-3897214

 

[garee]

That's what Rev.19 says, but that's not what 2Thes.2 says, is it? "consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming." Is the beast destroyed by a lake of fire, or by presence of Christ? (Or is Christs presence at that time like a destroying lake of fire to the wicked? I believe this is the truth.)

I think it is two different metaphors used to represent the same spiritual principle. At the brightness of His coming that glory of God will destroy the corrupted creation . It will go up in smoke never having any new spirit life to rise and receive the promise of our new bodies. The last day all in the twinkling of the eye

 

[crossnote]

Yes it is. The ungodly suffer "forever and ever" (that is, from the beginning of the old creation until the end of it), in the presence of the Lord, the holy angels and the redeemed as their sins are exposed at the judgment seat of Christ. This torment in the presence of Jesus doesn't go on eternally as you are interpreting Rev.14.

I'm sorry but you are adding to the words of Revelation, something warned against in Rev 22:18-19. It never says anything about 'until the end of the old creation'...just more of the old intellect getting in the way of God's Word.

The antichrist doesn't die a "first death" as you're claiming. He's "captured" and cast "alive" into the lake of fire. And the lake of fire is for the purpose of destroying. But Paul says antichrist is destroyed by the brightness of the presence of Jesus himself and by the Spirit of his mouth. You have a contradiction. I don't.

The antichrist is a person possessed by satan and dies a physical death like anyone else (destroyed by Christ at His coming) and then is cast into the Lake of Fire (Rev 19:20).

 

[MadHermit]

There will be no release from Sheol/Hades (except when the wicked are resurrected in order to be judged) and no release from the Lake of fire. Once an unbeliever dies in their sins, that's it! They will have died in their sins and salvation is no longer on the table. Today (while you're alive) is the day of salvation. After the death of the unbeliever, the offer of salvation is off the table. .

I have provided several examples from God's Word that decisively refute your claim. Before you pontificate like this, you need to address those examples. Start with my case from 1 Corinthians 15:28-29, 1 Peter 3:19; 4:6, and Revelation 21:25. I mean, actually read what I say and don't just jump to texts that you wrongly imagine support your dogmatic agenda!

 

[Budman]

I have provided several examples from God's Word that decisively refute your claim. Before you pontificate like this, you need to address those examples. Start with my case from 1 Corinthians 15:28-29, 1 Peter 3:19; 4:6, and Revelation 21:25. I mean, actually read what I say and don't just jump to texts that you wrongly imagine support your dogmatic agenda!

If those passages mean what you think they mean, then Jesus contradicted Himself in Luke 16:26 when He quoted Abraham saying: "And beside all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us."

 

[Endure]

I've even heard false teaching that the devil will get a second chance. Of coarse, this is utter nonsense! There is no second chance for the devil and his minions, or for those who die in their sins. No one gets out of hell period. Not until the "great white thrown Judgment."
Hell is the county jail where the lost are waiting to go to their final destination. The lake of fire is the penitentiary where the lost and the devil will spend eternity in torment.

 

[oldethennew]

there are (3) definitions of 'HELL', in scripture'...

 

[MadHermit]

If those passages mean what you think they mean, then Jesus contradicted Himself in Luke 16:26 when He quoted Abraham saying: "And beside all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us."

I've refuted your claim before and you haven't bothered to read my retort. No, there is no contradiction at all. Souls in Hades are not allowed a jailbreak out of Hades, while still remaining wicked! But if they respond to God's offer of mercy and repent, then they can be released from Hades. You people will do practically anything to avoid confronting the biblically sound explanations for why several texts imply the possibility of release from Hell. In Jesus' words, "Having ears to hear, they do not hear." I repeat evangelical author, C. S. Lewis's famous dictum: "The gates of Hell are locked from the inside."

 

[Budman]

I've refuted your claim before and you haven't bothered to read my retort. No, there is no contradiction at all. Souls in Hades are not allowed a jailbreak out of Hades, while still remaining wicked! But if they respond to God's offer of mercy and repent, then they can be released from Hades. You people will do practically anything to avoid confronting the biblically sound explanations for why several texts imply the possibility of release from Hell. In Jesus' words, "Having ears to hear, they do not hear." I repeat evangelical author, C. S. Lewis's famous dictum: "The gates of Hell are locked from the inside."

Ridiculous.

Twisting scripture is not a refutation. You are teaching nothing but bargain basement universalism.

 

[MadHermit]

Ridiculous.

Twisting scripture is not a refutation. You are teaching nothing but bargain basement universalism.

You haven't bothered to directly engage my exegesis of the relevant texts; so your accusation of "twisting" merits the challenge, "Season your penchant for bluster with a modicum of intellectual rigor and let's get into the Word!" Meanwhile, I will provide even more than the many Scriptures offered so far in favor of my position.

 

[Budman]

You haven't bothered to directly engage my exegesis of the relevant texts; so your accusation of "twisting" merits the challenge, "Season your penchant for bluster with a modicum of intellectual rigor and let's get into the Word!" Meanwhile, I will provide even more than the many Scriptures offered so far in favor of my position.

If what you claim is true, there would be no point in sharing the gospel with the world. Let the Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Mormon, even Atheist remain as such, since all will have the opportunity to get out of hell no matter what they believe.

You a teaching a doctrine of devils.

 

[Budman]

*are* teaching a doctrine of devils.

 

[Journeyman]

The word translated "destroyed" in 2Th2:8 is "G2673 - katargesei / katargeo - to annul [to render inoperative]" and is the same word used in Galatians 5:4 (translated there as "severed" in the blb, esv and others), "Whoever are being justified in the Law, you are severed [G2673] from Christ"... and isn't this the kind of thing we see in Revelation 19:20 and its parallel Isaiah 24:21-22[23]?

In one sense, but not exactly, because (as you just pointed out from Gal.5:4), we were separated from God once (Eph.4:18), but aren't anymore. We were in prison once (Lk.4:18), but aren't anymore. Dead once (Col.2:13), condemned once (Jn.3:18) and so on.

I mean, they do not enter the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom (as do others / the saints / the righteous, at the time of His Second Coming to the earth

The "millennial reign" is now. We've already been given eternal life. We're part of his Kingdom now. Unfortunately somewhere along the line, Christian theologians adopted a Pharisaic view of the Messiah's reign on earth, where the Jews would reign over their earthly enemies. The only difference now is, "Christians" will reign (still in the Judaic sense, not as Jesus did) over their earthly enemies, but heresy is heresy, whether its Jewish or Christian theology. There's a difference between, "Messiah will defeat the Taliban" and, "Messiah will defeat death."

[whereas the SECOND "PUNISH" word in the Isaiah passage correlates with the later GWTj context, that is, separated by the very specific "time period" shown to take place after the FIRST of TWO "PUNISH" words in that passage which Rev20:10 says the beast and false prophet are still there at that time, and then a further "time allotment" is named (which in every other usage of that phrase, "the ages [plural] of the ages [plural]," means "forever"... like in Galatians 1:5, Philippians 4:20, 1 Timothy 1:17, 2 Timothy 4:18, Hebrews 13:21, Revelation 1:6, etc)

It's understood that forever means eternally when referring to God's Kingdom. And it's a good thing when reading such verses as Isa.24:3 that it doesn't mean only going forward, but backward as well. The beast doesn't go into the lake of fire "one thousand" years before everyone else.

 

[Journeyman]

I'm sorry but you are adding to the words of Revelation, something warned against in Rev 22:18-19. It never says anything about 'until the end of the old creation'...just more of the old intellect getting in the way of God's Word.

Actually, the old intellect is, "Someday Jesus will come and reign over me, but not now."

The antichrist is a person possessed by satan and dies a physical death like anyone else (destroyed by Christ at His coming) and then is cast into the Lake of Fire (Rev 19:20).

And when you see someone with seven heads and ten horns, let me know so I don't get deceived.

 

[Journeyman]

I think it is two different metaphors used to represent the same spiritual principle. At the brightness of His coming that glory of God will destroy the corrupted creation . It will go up in smoke never having any new spirit life to rise and receive the promise of our new bodies. The last day all in the twinkling of the eye

Yeah and not only that, but the annihilation of the corrupted body, soul and spirit,

A fire goeth before him, and burneth up his enemies round about. Psa.97:3