IS SIN A CHOICE?

[Adstar]

If a Christian can have the choice to sin or not to sin as you preach.. Then a christian choosing to sin when they have the ability not to is Willfully sinning and the Bible states..

Hebrews 10: KJV
26 "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins," 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

BUT!!

If we sin because we are still in sinful flesh and do not have the ability to resist sin to a 100% perfect level ( as you preach) Then we are not sinning willfully but a sinning because of our inherent human flesh weakness to sin..

 

[ForestGreenCook]

I have heard people say for years that Christians HAVE to sin everyday.

Do we not choose to give into temptation when we do?

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
1 Corinthians 10:13 KJV

If God provides a way of escape when we are tempted then we must make a choice to sin.

If we choose to sin, can we not also choose not to?

Yes the choice is there, but no man/woman has been able to totally resist their temptation to sin, except the man Jesus.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

That should be as plain as day to any sane person. However, the movement to make victims out of everyone was a fundamental fallacy of Liberalism. Thus people began to blame everyone else, and everything else, for their own misdeeds.

But James explains the progression of sin in his epistle (James 1:13-15; 4:1-3):

TEMPTATION--->YOUR OWN LUST---->ENTICEMENT----> SIN--->DEATH

Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death...

From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members? Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not. Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts. Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

Lusts are unlawful desires. But Christians can resist temptations by the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit.

The three primary lusts were evident in the temptation of Eve. While Satan was trying to deceive her, she was yielding to her own lusts. But when it came to taking responsibility, Adam blamed Eve, Eve blamed the Serpent, and the Serpent blamed God.

When we read the passage in James, we must remember that death is a separation, and in the case of the regenerated man/woman sinning, it will result in a separation from their fellowship with God, temporary, until they repent.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

I have heard people say for years that Christians HAVE to sin everyday.

Do we not choose to give into temptation when we do?

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
1 Corinthians 10:13 KJV

If God provides a way of escape when we are tempted then we must make a choice to sin.

If we choose to sin, can we not also choose not to?

In one consideration, the born again christian cannot sin. 1 John 3:9, Whosoever is born of God do, because he is born of doth not commit sin, for his seed (Christ) remaineth in him, and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. Even though the born again person does, at times, commit sins, the sins are not accounted, to him, in an eternal sense, because Christ paid for all of his sins.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Not so. God has given every human being a conscience, and the conscience in fact has the Law (the Ten Commandments) embedded in it. See Romans 2.

Only those who have had their stony heart replaced with a fleshy heart have a spiritual conscience that can be pricked to feel guilty of breaking a spiritual law. That does not include every human being.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:16 KJV

The question would be; Do you always walk in the Spirit?

 

[Tararose]

Problem with that is when a person is preaching sinlessness in the flesh and that ones salvation is dependent on them achieving a sinless life then just leaving them to believe and preach that to others is to stand by watching them heading to the eternal lake of fire and watch other babes in Christ get deceived and wind up in the same eternal place of damnation..

So ones conscience and love for their fellow human beings forces them to at lest try to oppose such preaching and make an attempt to save if not the preacher then at lest the babes in Christ who are being lead into eternal destruction..

I really do hear you, but 2 timothy 2 is very clear on how we do it. We cannot stand for truth whilst ignoring the scriptural way we are to present it. Anyway, as it’s a forum it really isn’t hard. Because you can still make your case without playing a seesaw game that no one wins. You can clearly state what you believe and why and not even have to address the person you disagree with Directly or mention their post at all.

You can put a nice red x on their post too which is a clear sign you disagree. It’s not like one person is preaching. Message on here. Everyone is giving their views and yours will be right there for the poster and the world to read.

The trouble is (from what I have seen on these threads) a couple of people battle out their views and don’t stop after they both said their piece. They inevitably end up going in circles and then it ends up with frustration, that leads to insults and gets personal. (I have taken the bait myself and am trying not to anymore.)

This happens instead of the individuals simply stating What they feel to be the truth and leaving the spirit to convict. Everyone can see you disagree with a red cross including the poster. and anyone can read your view so it does address error by speaking truth. I don’t mean not to ever directly correct error in a direct reply, but to keep it going once you both said your piece is just taking the bait and we go begin to fight the person in the flesh out of frustration.

This isn’t aimed at you but just explaining generally how sowing good seed can become a bad witness. Onlookers can see those who get offended and take it personally and then get personal or switch to sarcastic or snide remarks and comments. Even in here we battle the enemy. It isn’t other people though, it’s antagonising spirits and it’s the old man in us.

 

[AlmondJoy]

I really do hear you, but 2 timothy 2 is very clear on how we do it. We cannot stand for truth whilst ignoring the scriptural way we are to present it. Anyway, as it’s a forum it really isn’t hard. Because you can still make your case without playing a seesaw game that no one wins. You can clearly state what you believe and why and not even have to address the person you disagree with Directly or mention their post at all.

You can put a nice red x on their post too which is a clear sign you disagree. It’s not like one person is preaching. Message on here. Everyone is giving their views and yours will be right there for the poster and the world to read.

The trouble is (from what I have seen on these threads) a couple of people battle out their views and don’t stop after they both said their piece. They inevitably end up going in circles and then it ends up with frustration, that leads to insults and gets personal. (I have taken the bait myself and am trying not to anymore.)

This happens instead of the individuals simply stating What they feel to be the truth and leaving the spirit to convict. Everyone can see you disagree with a red cross including the poster. and anyone can read your view so it does address error by speaking truth. I don’t mean not to ever directly correct error in a direct reply, but to keep it going once you both said your piece is just taking the bait and we go begin to fight the person in the flesh out of frustration.

This isn’t aimed at you but just explaining generally how sowing good seed can become a bad witness. Onlookers can see those who get offended and take it personally and then get personal or switch to sarcastic or snide remarks and comments. Even in here we battle the enemy. It isn’t other people though, it’s antagonising spirits and it’s the old man in us.

Wow!!! Very well said. I have certainly been guilty of this myself.....thanks for the reminder

 

[AlmondJoy]

In one consideration, the born again christian cannot sin. 1 John 3:9, Whosoever is born of God do, because he is born of doth not commit sin, for his seed (Christ) remaineth in him, and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. Even though the born again person does, at times, commit sins, the sins are not accounted, to him, in an eternal sense, because Christ paid for all of his sins.

Wow you have really taken 1 John out of contexted.....if John was saying we cannot sin why did he start chapter 2 like this:

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1 John 2:1 KJV

Notice he said IF and WE

I am assuming you believe that all of your future sins are forgiven before you ever commit them? No?

QUESTION: why would Satan waste his time tempted us christians to sin if this doctrine were true?

No need to repent and confess your sins to God....before you sin its forgiven ??

 

[Tararose]

Wow you have really taken 1 John out of contexted.....if John was saying we cannot sin why did he start chapter 2 like this:

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1 John 2:1 KJV

Notice he said IF and WE

I am assuming you believe that all of your future sins are forgiven before you ever commit them? No?

QUESTION: why would Satan waste his time tempted us christians to sin if this doctrine were true?

No need to repent and confess your sins to God....before you sin its forgiven ??

I get what you are saying, this is a really hard one though because in a sense I guess there is a balance needed between these doctrines. The reason is because this a place is where such as the Catholic’s err greatly. They believe if when a person dies there is a sin they have not confessed and repented of then they must pay for it because they cannot be forgiven for it as it remains “un-confessed” sin.


But to say a believer never sins is perfectly unbiblical as you have clearly shown - through the necessity shown in scripture for the born again believer to confess and make repentance whenever they sin.

 

[AlmondJoy]

I get what you are saying, this is a really hard one though because in a sense I guess there is a balance needed between these doctrines. The reason is because this a place is where such as the Catholic’s err greatly. They believe if when a person dies there is a sin they have not confessed and repented of then they must pay for it because they cannot be forgiven for it as it remains “un-confessed” sin.

But to say a believer never sins is perfectly unbiblical as you have clearly shown - through the necessity shown in scripture for the born again believer to confess and make repentance whenever they sin.

Not sure if I'm bunching words together when I read this....could you clarify??

 

[Tararose]

I do apologise, it wasn’t well worded.

I was simply saying you clearly showed from scripture that a born-again believer can sin.

(It was two separate thoughts between two paragraphs if that helps )

 

[AlmondJoy]

I do apologise, it wasn’t well worded.

I was simply saying you clearly showed from scripture that a born-again believer can sin.

I'm sorry. I'm using my phone and stuff starts running together. Lol And I don't have my reading glasses......doctor called it 40ituce

 

[AlmondJoy]

So do you think you will still face that choice to sin, even after you are raptured and get a new body without the flesh?

No, when the Lord returns the bible says "this corruptible will put on incorruption....this mortal will put on immortaility"

I am excited over what will be in heaven, but I am also excited about what will not be in heaven!

sin won't be there, the devil won't be there, temptation won't be there, etc...

The bible (word of God) does a good job of getting rid of the devil

In the first 2 chapters of the bible, there is no mention of the devil
In the last 2 chapters of the bible, there is no mention of the devil

so somewhere between genesis 3 and revelation 20, the devil is taken care of!!!!

 

[Guojing]

No, when the Lord returns the bible says "this corruptible will put on incorruption....this mortal will put on immortaility"

I am excited over what will be in heaven, but I am also excited about what will not be in heaven!

sin won't be there, the devil won't be there, temptation won't be there, etc...

The bible (word of God) does a good job of getting rid of the devil

In the first 2 chapters of the bible, there is no mention of the devil
In the last 2 chapters of the bible, there is no mention of the devil

so somewhere between genesis 3 and revelation 20, the devil is taken care of!!!!

Yep, so you can agree that temptation and sin won't be an issue for you after you are raptured, because you will no longer have the flesh.

That was the same with Jesus in his first coming on Earth.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Wow you have really taken 1 John out of contexted.....if John was saying we cannot sin why did he start chapter 2 like this:

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1 John 2:1 KJV

Notice he said IF and WE

I am assuming you believe that all of your future sins are forgiven before you ever commit them? No?

QUESTION: why would Satan waste his time tempted us christians to sin if this doctrine were true?

No need to repent and confess your sins to God....before you sin its forgiven ??

You must have read my post too fast, and overlooked where I said that the born again child of God does, at times. commit sins, and he loses his fellowship with God, temporary, until he repents, but he never loses his eternal inheritance.

Yes, Jesus said that he paid for all of the sins of those that his father gave him, and he would not lose any., but raise them up at the last day. No sin will keep those that Christ died for from heaven.

 

[AlmondJoy]

Yep, so you can agree that temptation and sin won't be an issue for you after you are raptured, because you will no longer have the flesh.

That was the same with Jesus in his first coming on Earth.

Does anybody believe we will be tempted to sin after the rapture?

Not sure I am following what your trying to say???

 

[Guojing]

Does anybody believe we will be tempted to sin after the rapture?

Not sure I am following what your trying to say???

There are a number of Christians, in this forum, who apparently believe that Jesus could actually be tempted to sin in his first coming on Earth.

Instead, my point was that the impeccability of Jesus is the correct doctrine to hold, otherwise you would have to conclude that, even after we get our new bodies, we might actually be tempted to sin too.

 

[AlmondJoy]

You must have read my post too fast, and overlooked where I said that the born again child of God does, at times. commit sins, and he loses his fellowship with God, temporary, until he repents, but he never loses his eternal inheritance.

A man may not LOSE his inheritance but he most certainly can LEAVE it and walk away. I had free will before salvation and I still have it.

The story of the prodigal son disproves your argument.

It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
2 Timothy 2:11‭-‬12 KJV

No sin will keep those that Christ died for from heaven.

Christ died for the world....for every man......John said "behold the lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world"

If no sin will keep those that Christ died for from heaven then everybody will be saved

You never answered my question about the devil???

The devil doesn't believe sin can't keep you from heaven. If so Why would he waste his time???

 

[AlmondJoy]

There are a number of Christians, in this forum, who apparently believe that Jesus could actually be tempted to sin in his first coming on Earth.

Instead, my point was that the impeccability of Jesus is the correct doctrine to hold, otherwise you would have to conclude that, even after we get our new bodies, we might actually be tempted to sin too.

Okay, I understand you are saying.

Great Men have debated this question for years.

But I think it just boils down to how you explain the relationship between the two natures of Christ. I personally believe Christ was impeccable.

I also can understand how people might ask how could Christ truly sympathize with us in our temptation if he couldn't really sin. M R DeHann taught this

To be honest this is a question that I love sitting with a cup of coffee and talking about but when its all said and done.....

IM JUST GLAD HE HAD NO SIN!!!
GREAT IS THE MYSTERY OF GODLINESS