Is repentance necessary for forgiveness?

[peldom10]

Baptism does not save anyone.

Wrong.
It is required for completion of sin cleansing.

 

[Radius]

Wrong.
It is required for completion of sin cleansing.

Oh, so I guess the theif on the cross is in hell because he didn't get baptized.

 

[peldom10]

The subject of this thread is "Is repentance necessary for forgiveness?"

Wow...that is self serving. You have never posted material outside of original post?

Then I ask directly...do you believe the Bible teaches baptism is required for sin cleansing...just as repentance is required?

 

[peldom10]

Oh, so I guess the theif on the cross is in hell because he didn't get baptized.

We do not know if the thief was ever baptized...do we?
In any event God can grant absolution any time he wishes to anyone he wishes...if the thief wasn't.

But, we do not have the authority to ad to scripture...do we? But, you are trying here.

...and I know why....because you have no scripture which defies requirement of baptism.
However, the Bible requires it...start with Acts 2; 38...there are more proofs.

 

[Radius]

We do not know if the thief was ever baptized...do we?
In any event God can grant absolution any time he wishes to anyone he wishes...if the thief wasn't.

But, we do not have the authority to ad to scripture...do we? But, you are trying here.

...and I know why....because you have no scripture which defies requirement of baptism.
However, the Bible requires it...start with Acts 2; 38...there are more proofs.

If baptism is necessary for salvation, why would Paul have said, “I am thankful that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius” (1 Corinthians 1:14)? Why would he have said, “For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel—not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power” (1 Corinthians 1:17)? Granted, in this passage Paul is arguing against the divisions that plagued the Corinthian church. However, how could Paul possibly say, “I am thankful that I did not baptize…” or “For Christ did not send me to baptize…” if baptism were necessary for salvation? If baptism is necessary for salvation, Paul would literally be saying, “I am thankful that you were not saved…” and “For Christ did not send me to save…” That would be an unbelievably ridiculous statement for Paul to make. Further, when Paul gives a detailed outline of what he considers the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-8), why does he neglect to mention baptism? If baptism is a requirement for salvation, how could any presentation of the gospel lack a mention of baptism?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

We know that God told us to repent, but did God tell us that if we don’t repent, we will not be forgiven?

Psalms 51: 17 The sacrifices of god are a broken spirit; a broken and contrite spirit; a broken and contrite heart, O God, you will not despise.

God hears our repentance, but is it a requirement?

It is a requirement of Salvation, for, without it, there can be no relationship with Christ. Repentance is one of the four major "Works" of Christ . . . repentance is granted by Him. The ability to Repent and Turn to Christ is granted.

 

[BillG]

John 16:7–11 (NKJV): 7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

We see that Jesus said that he had to go back to heaven.
The Holy Spirit will come and we see in verse 8 that it is to convict the world of its sin which is unbelief in him.

So if a person places their faith in Jesus then they have repented of that sin of unbelief.

This faith is not a mental faith but a life changing faith.
So if a person has this life changing faith then their sins have been forgiven.

Therefore if discipled correctly it's not only the sin of unbelief in Jesus but sin that we do but our focus changes to not want to sin and be like Jesus.

Repentance is basically a change of mind.
If we take it further as a believer repentance is a change of mind that leads to change in action.

If we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us.
The word confess does not mean to repent but to acknowledge we got it wrong.

So for me I say when we sin we say to God "I got this wrong I sinned and I acknowledge this, please help me"

So we have a change of mind. I sinned don't want to.

 

[throughfaith]

Acts 17:30 30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

It is not a suggestion for good living, or something God requests us to do, but here it is plainly stated that it is a command. That means that if you want to sin, you die!! It is treated as a prayer asking God to allow us to sin, and that prayer is answered. Sin that is not forgiven always results in death".

Why did you leap to "That means that if you want to sin, you die!!" From Acts 17 ?
And "Sin that is not forgiven always results in death" Even if we are forgiven we will still die. Well unless the Rapture happens first .

 

[throughfaith]

On the day of Pentecost Peter said to repent and be baptised for the forgiveness of sins. Repentance...forgiveness of sins. No repentance, no forgiveness of sins. If it wasn't necessary he would not have said it.

So water baptism is necessary for forgiveness of sins then today?
Or could it be that acts 2.38 is not a prescription for how a person receives the Holy Spirit ? Given the fact we don't see this pattern apart this verse and to Israel.

 

[throughfaith]

'Believing' is necessary to receive the Holy Spirit Eph 1.13 . From the heart ,Rom 10 .9 -15. To please God and be saved. 1 cor 1.21

 

[Blik]

This one: "If you repent of sins you do not want to sin. If you want sin in your life you are not repenting of sin."

Not only are you employing a logical fallacy, but your statements are inconsistent with Scripture.

If it is inconsistent with scripture not to want to sin, then in your opinion scripture would say repentance is wanting to sin. I am sure you are managing to turn the Lord's words around in some technological way to say it is fine to want sin in our life, but the truth is that it is not fine. If we repent, we want to not sin.

Just as you always find ways to turn my posts around into something to make them something to accuse me of not following scripture, I find your thoughts result in distorting scripture. I think it is because you have studied scripture by trying to justify man made interpretations rather than a straight forward wish to know scripture. My studies are the opposite----I want to know exactly what scripture says with no apologies of man made opinions.

As a result of your twisting scripture so it follows your way of reasoning, you have made statements that are contrary to spiritual Israel as an example, and by twisting and turning scripture, you make it sound as if you are using scripture to back up your denial. Your defense is that, technically you have never done what you have done and it is wrong to accuse of you doing this. Slick!!

 

[Blik]

We do not know if the thief was ever baptized...do we?
In any event God can grant absolution any time he wishes to anyone he wishes...if the thief wasn't.

But, we do not have the authority to ad to scripture...do we? But, you are trying here.

...and I know why....because you have no scripture which defies requirement of baptism.
However, the Bible requires it...start with Acts 2; 38...there are more proofs.

I think deciding what is absolutely necessary for forgiveness to happen to us is something we should do. It is true that there is no mention of baptism for every saved person. There is a difference between refusing to do as the Lord asks us to do, and having no opportunity to do it. The man on the cross who was saved never told the Lord he refused the baptism offered him.

 

[Dino246]

If it is inconsistent with scripture not to want to sin, then in your opinion scripture would say repentance is wanting to sin.

This is a perfect example of you misreading what I wrote (or deliberately changing it), and responding to your misinterpretation.

I am sure you are managing to turn the Lord's words around in some technological way to say it is fine to want sin in our life, but the truth is that it is not fine.

No, Blik, it's you demonstrating either your inability to read carefully, or your willful corruption of my words. It's what you have been doing for a long time.

Just as you always find ways to turn my posts around into something to make them something to accuse me of not following scripture, I find your thoughts result in distorting scripture. I think it is because you have studied scripture by trying to justify man made interpretations rather than a straight forward wish to know scripture. My studies are the opposite----I want to know exactly what scripture says with no apologies of man made opinions.

As a result of your twisting scripture so it follows your way of reasoning, you have made statements that are contrary to spiritual Israel as an example, and by twisting and turning scripture, you make it sound as if you are using scripture to back up your denial. Your defense is that, technically you have never done what you have done and it is wrong to accuse of you doing this. Slick!!

You are such a hypocrite. That's why it's impossible to discuss anything with you.

 

[Blik]

This is a perfect example of you misreading what I wrote (or deliberately changing it), and responding to your misinterpretation.


No, Blik, it's you demonstrating either your inability to read carefully, or your willful corruption of my words. It's what you have been doing for a long time.


You are such a hypocrite. That's why it's impossible to discuss anything with you.

 

[Blik]

You are such a hypocrite. That's why it's impossible to discuss anything with you.

Matthew 5:22 But I say unto you, that whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment; and whosoever shall say to his brother, ‘Raca,’ shall be in danger of the council; but whosoever shall say, ‘Thou fool,’ shall be in danger of hell fire.

 

[peldom10]

M

My point is that, after coming to Christ, people still live according to their sinful nature, even if they are too blinded by self-righteousness to see it. Happens all the time.

Repentance is more for your benefit so that you have a good conscience about what you do. You'll never stop sinning or be able to earn forgiveness by your works of repentance. That's my point. The Bible says to repent while going into exhaustive detail about how we're sinners and aren't good enough without Jesus.

The big take away is that repentance is just your effort to try to stop sinning and that's great, God wants that.

I can't find a verse that says repentance is necessary for forgiveness of sins though, just to be clear, but repentance is necessary to actually believe Jesus died for our sins. Without changing our mind about ourselves and who Jesus is then there is no repentance.

I can't find a verse that says repentance is necessary for forgiveness of sins though, just to be clear, but repentance is necessary to actually believe Jesus died for our sins. Without changing our mind about ourselves and who Jesus is then there is no repentance.

......
I can't find a verse that says repentance is necessary for forgiveness of sins though, just to be clear, but repentance is necessary to actually believe Jesus died for our sins. Without changing our mind about ourselves and who Jesus is then there is no repentance.

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eternally-gratefull
Senior Member
Mar 14, 201173,91016,565113




Today at 6:13 AM
#27
Runningman said:

If baptism is necessary for salvation, why would Paul have said, “I am thankful that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius” (1 Corinthians 1:14)? Why would he have said, “For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel—not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power” (1 Corinthians 1:17)? Granted, in this passage Paul is arguing against the divisions that plagued the Corinthian church. However, how could Paul possibly say, “I am thankful that I did not baptize…” or “For Christ did not send me to baptize…” if baptism were necessary for salvation? If baptism is necessary for salvation, Paul would literally be saying, “I am thankful that you were not saved…” and “For Christ did not send me to save…” That would be an unbelievably ridiculous statement for Paul to make. Further, when Paul gives a detailed outline of what he considers the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-8), why does he neglect to mention baptism? If baptism is a requirement for salvation, how could any presentation of the gospel lack a mention of baptism?

That has no support of your position...of course that's all you can find so use it......not valid though.
....answer the clear language don't pose another question.

 

[peldom10]

That unusual weird post above...was not mine.

Someone game playing?

 

[peldom10]

I think deciding what is absolutely necessary for forgiveness to happen to us is something we should do. It is true that there is no mention of baptism for every saved person. There is a difference between refusing to do as the Lord asks us to do, and having no opportunity to do it. The man on the cross who was saved never told the Lord he refused the baptism offered him.

None of that post is supported by the Bible..KJV 1611 edition.

 

[peldom10]

If baptism is necessary for salvation, why would Paul have said, “I am thankful that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius” (1 Corinthians 1:14)? Why would he have said, “For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel—not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power” (1 Corinthians 1:17)? Granted, in this passage Paul is arguing against the divisions that plagued the Corinthian church. However, how could Paul possibly say, “I am thankful that I did not baptize…” or “For Christ did not send me to baptize…” if baptism were necessary for salvation? If baptism is necessary for salvation, Paul would literally be saying, “I am thankful that you were not saved…” and “For Christ did not send me to save…” That would be an unbelievably ridiculous statement for Paul to make. Further, when Paul gives a detailed outline of what he considers the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-8), why does he neglect to mention baptism? If baptism is a requirement for salvation, how could any presentation of the gospel lack a mention of baptism?

Please study these and then comment.

Baptism is Required


Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.


Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins....

Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Roman 6;3.... Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Mark16;16.... He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved.....




Many others

 

[peldom10]

also note....show me any teaching prior to the 1960's that even questioned the requirement of baptism ......???

So far I have not found any .