Is it grace sanctifying or justified

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J

Jordon

Well-known member
Mar 19, 2025
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I vote just Justified


Romans 8:29-30

New International Version



29 For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters. 30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

Catholics believe grace is a sanctifying process

What do the fruits of the spirit mean
 
Is grace a substance like material that increases and decreases in a soul of a saved person.

and can it be backed up with scripture that it is.
 
Jas 4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

There is saving grace that flows to us through faith. There also seems to be what might be called sustaining grace that is available to those who mature and grow in Christ-likeness.

Sustaining grace may be that which is referred to by greetings such as "grace be unto you." I do not see it so much as that which is accumulated but which helps us.

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
 
Jordon said:
Is grace a substance like material that increases and decreases in a soul of a saved person.

and can it be backed up with scripture that it is.
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so basically if i asked is trust a substance like material material that can decrease and increase in the soul of saved person, can that be backed up with scripture.

Or what else could Grow in God's trust mean.

Could it mean it can be a kind of material that gets poured into your soul when your saved, and basically you can have more of that material poured into you, like say filling a cup with wine, as you grow in your faith you get more wine poured into you,

Untill eventually your soul becomes filled with wine that much , it's starts pouring out of your ears.
 
Jordon said:
so basically if i asked is trust a substance like material material that can decrease and increase in the soul of saved person, can that be backed up with scripture.

Or what else could Grow in God's trust mean.

Could it mean it can be a kind of material that gets poured into your soul when your saved, and basically you can have more of that material poured into you, like say filling a cup with wine, as you grow in your faith you get more wine poured into you,

Untill eventually your soul becomes filled with wine that much , it's starts pouring out of your ears.
Click to expand...
now on the other hand if I fall out of favour with Christ, he can make my wine become half empty in my soul and even more empty to the point where's I have no wine in me at all, but then if I get back in favour with Christ he will start fill me back up with more wine.

So basically the question is asked how hard is it to fill a cup that is already full ?
 
timf said:
Jas 4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

There is saving grace that flows to us through faith. There also seems to be what might be called sustaining grace that is available to those who mature and grow in Christ-likeness.

Sustaining grace may be that which is referred to by greetings such as "grace be unto you." I do not see it so much as that which is accumulated but which helps us.

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Click to expand...

2 Peter 3:18

New International Version



18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever! Amen.

So the understanding is as we grow in grace and and his knowledge of the lord, meaning his grace and knowledge,

Meaning as the lord keeps us in his saving Grace we gain knowledge over time.


But should we take that to mean that grace grows in us like a wine cup being filled in us, or should it be we grow in comprehension 🙂
 
Grace might be seen as multifaceted generosity that includes wisdom, and understanding, as well as the fruit of the Spirit. Even the air we breathe might be seen as grace from God. It is not inserted into us, but we participate in its reception.
 
timf said:
Grace might be seen as multifaceted generosity that includes wisdom, and understanding, as well as the fruit of the Spirit. Even the air we breathe might be seen as grace from God. It is not inserted into us, but we participate in its reception.
Click to expand...
I'm Trying to understand a philosophical concept, and understanding an idea put forward from a theological concept. in what could be one way bias, I want to understand the other philosophical ideas to,

Bases on scripture more so.

So if where made to fall from grace, as in let's say we stumble when we feal like giving up, which is a less overwhelming way of looking at it, and I don't feal like putting the effort in anymore, we won't fall out of grace from God, and God will keep us strong even when we are weak, I'm sure you know which scriptures I'm refering to, we see that Gods grace is always extended to us.

How ever can saved children fall out out of favour with God, is there a length of time that God will only comfort his children so much if they don't buck up, and get back to normal.
 
The biggest problem Christians have is our struggle with the flesh. God does not give up on us. Our failings simply restrict our growth.

Our indolence and laziness simply retard the growth we could be making. Christian performance in measured in front of Christ.

1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

God's grace is available to us to help us build on the foundation of Christ. If we do not build, there is nothing that could be burned up. If we are mistaken and build incorrectly, those works are burned up.

None of us are likely to be greatly rewarded because it is so hard to neglect the flesh and walk by the Spirit.
 
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timf said:
The biggest problem Christians have is our struggle with the flesh. God does not give up on us. Our failings simply restrict our growth.

Our indolence and laziness simply retard the growth we could be making. Christian performance in measured in front of Christ.

1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

God's grace is available to us to help us build on the foundation of Christ. If we do not build, there is nothing that could be burned up. If we are mistaken and build incorrectly, those works are burned up.

None of us are likely to be greatly rewarded because it is so hard to neglect the flesh and walk by the Spirit.
Click to expand...
I wonder if thats belief centred upon genuine concern for falling out of favour as to why we feel we have to regain favour, could it be I guess a reason for feeling we should seek renewal, in having our cup filled back up, but do we need to just have our cup filled up when there's something wrong, or can it be we just enjoy our cup being filled in that silent time, or knowing where loved and been reassured where loved many times

Speaking now in light of running to Gods mercy, is it different to running to a friend you know then it running to the treasures inside, either way does it matter, you can still be running to your treasure inside whilst running to a friend,
 
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