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posthuman said:
why should i answer for something i never said?
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Yet you have. In almost every post you make a not so veiled attempt to show the has been removed. In fact you have even tried to belittle me with it. However until you do explain how Yeshua can say He didn't come to remove the law, and adds that the law will not pass away until Heaven and earth pass away, yet it was removed, acording to Paul, am simply going to say I have answered all your questions many times. Even though I have tried, it has not been to your liking, and you seem to have missed it, oh well.
 
Inquisitor said:
You may want to read that verse below again.

Matthew 5:18
For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke of a letter shall pass from the Law, until all is accomplished!

'Until all is accomplished' is the key condition which can occur before or after, heaven and earth pass away.

To understand when the law will become redundant is based on when you think, Jesus accomplished all things.

On the cross?

After the resurrection?

When Jesus returns?
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When all is accomplished. As both the Law and the prophets are included, it is self explanatory. When we see the New Heaaven and new earth, then it will ALL be accomplished.
 
posthuman said:
The Law is one law; not parts with various jots and tittles deleted. see James 2:10
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You are right there is one set of laws. However, there are parts that aply to ONLY weman, parts the apply to ONLY the priesthood, and so on down the line. Maybe you should take an honest look at the Laws so you know what they are, and what does or doesn't apply to you. I have never removed any part of the Law, and yet I know that some simply are not for Gentiles, some are not for the common Hebrew people, and some are not for men. Still one set of Laws, just seen for what they are, and for whom they they do apply.
 
Rainrider said:
When all is accomplished. As both the Law and the prophets are included, it is self explanatory. When we see the New Heaaven and new earth, then it will ALL be accomplished.
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So then, how do you understand the following verses?

Luke 21:22
Because these are days of punishment, so that all things which have been written will be fulfilled.

Luke 21:32
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.
 
As there is nothing to say about the law for now, I am going to start looking at the prophetic aspects of the sacrificial system. The bast place to start will be with the first one.

Gen 3:21¶Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.

Now I know there are a lot of thoughts on what animal was used here. Some say it was a goat, others a lamb. Just as some say thins was the first day atonement, and others say it wasn't.
However if we look at this from a prophetic point of view, what do we see?
This in our mind is the first indication of Yeshua being slain for the remission of sin. Gen. 3:14-15. It is for this reason that many say it was a lamb, and the it was the first Day of Atonement. Giving us a look at both, and showing us what His son is going to do.
 
Inquisitor said:
So then, how do you understand the following verses?

Luke 21:22
Because these are days of punishment, so that all things which have been written will be fulfilled.

Luke 21:32
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.
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They are prophetic. Speaking to the end of days, when as said in Rev. the beast will do his work. Although as some of the chapter does say, it will be when the City and Temple will be thrown down, that has been fulfilled. Yet we find that Yeshua in 27 all will see Yeshua return. So by simply looking at the full chapter, one can see that there are 2 prophecies in this chapter. One took place in 70 AD, the other is yet to come.
 
Rainrider said:
They are prophetic. Speaking to the end of days, when as said in Rev. the beast will do his work. Although as some of the chapter does say, it will be when the City and Temple will be thrown down, that has been fulfilled. Yet we find that Yeshua in 27 all will see Yeshua return. So by simply looking at the full chapter, one can see that there are 2 prophecies in this chapter. One took place in 70 AD, the other is yet to come.
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Once again, this verse is specific in the timing of "all things take place".

Luke 21:32
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.

You can't brush aside what Jesus said.
 
Rainrider said:
Though you are 100% right in that wisdom comes The Spirit, we are to fellowship, and also learn from one another. Test all things, and seek truth. One can in no way see truth if they sit back and think they they know something, yet never look past their own understanding. I do now that from past and present experience on here, that straight answers are never forth coming. However it does help in some ways.
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John 16:13-15
Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come,"he will guide you into all truth", for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come
1 Thessalonians 5:12
12 And we beseech you, brethren, that you "come to know those who labor among you", and are over you in the Lord and admonish you,
13 and to esteem them very highly in love for their work’s sake. And be at peace among yourselves.
Proverbs 3:5,6,
Trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not unto thy own understanding, in all thy ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your path.
I James 1:5, If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

I John 2:27, These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. 27But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. (Fellowship with those you know, but learn from God.)
 
Inquisitor said:
Once again, this verse is specific in the timing of "all things take place".

Luke 21:32
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.

You can't brush aside what Jesus said.
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Nor do I try.
 
​
Hebrews 8:13​
In that He says, "a new" He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.​
​
​
from this it is clear that the Law wasn't completely passed away yet by the time of the writing of Hebrews, which is before 70AD, around 50-60
 
If we were to look at every sacrifice seen in the Word, we would be some time doing so. A dear friend has suggested rather than doing that, it may be better to simply look at the ordinances. After some debate, and thinking on that, they may well be right. After all, every sacrifice fits into one of the given sacrifices. We must however keep in mind that an offering can be a burnt offering, and that would make it a sacrifice in the minds of some. So we will look at them as well.
starting with the Guilt offering.
Though to some this may seem to be a sin offering as they are both for sin, however the guilt offering is for unintended sin. It gives a look into Yeshua, and how it is that we turn to His blood to wash away our sin. As most would say we don't need that anymore, and they would be right to a point.
You see, for the Orthodox Jew, They do still hold meaning, and serve to bring them peace of mind, and rest for the soul. Just as we find when we confess our sin to Yeshua. Even an unintentional sin is sin, and must be atoned for. As we should know, Yeshua stands ready to forgive our sins, just as He has done from the beginning of time.
This offering, stands a light into a time when unintentional sin can be forgiven by the one Who has given His life for all of man kind.
Now to answer that same old question, Do I think we should give an offering today? In all truth, I see it as something that is intended for the Hebrew people. Had it not been, then a gentile would be allowed into the inner court. Rather than having to stay out side. However, we must also look at this from the other side of the coin.
When the Temple service is restored, all sacrifices will begin anew. Should we try and stop them? NO. After all, for a people that have not opened their eyes to Yeshua, it is what they have, and if they hold in their hearts a pure faith, and trust in HaShem to forgive, who are we to say He won't forgive them?
 
posthuman said:
​
Hebrews 8:13​
In that He says, "a new" He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.​
​
​
from this it is clear that the Law wasn't completely passed away yet by the time of the writing of Hebrews, which is before 70AD, around 50-60
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And still isn't, according to Mat. 5:17-18
 
Rainrider said:
And still isn't, according to Mat. 5:17-18
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and is not our husband or master, but only remains to curse those who reject the Messiah, according to Romans 1-8 & Galatians 1-6

“obsolete and ready to pass away" per Hebrews 8

"taken away" and "nailed to the cross" per Colossians

is a mere shadow of and testifies of Christ - Who has come - per more scripture than i care to look up and list, but trust you are not ignorant of

so what is our appropriate approach to it?

that's what remains.
 
Should I wear a head covering to validate my earnest in seeking Him if it is impossible to please God without faith, and anyone who approaches Him must believe, not just that He exists, but also that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him?

Martha grieved Jesus more than once, and even to the point of tears. What's interesting is that, although her name means "lady or mistress of the house," it's derived from the verb marar which means "to be bitter", and indeed she expressed her bitterness toward Mary for not helping her and even toward Jesus for not coming before Lazarus died. But her hair was likely always covered so, there's that.
 
posthuman said:
and is not our husband or master, but only remains to curse those who reject the Messiah, according to Romans 1-8 & Galatians 1-6

“obsolete and ready to pass away" per Hebrews 8

"taken away" and "nailed to the cross" per Colossians

is a mere shadow of and testifies of Christ - Who has come - per more scripture than i care to look up and list, but trust you are not ignorant of

so what is our appropriate approach to it?

that's what remains.
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Thank you for not saying the Law has been removed. After alll you did say you didn't say that.
 
The use of a head cover isn't something we have to do.
Mem said:
Should I wear a head covering to validate my earnest in seeking Him if it is impossible to please God without faith, and anyone who approaches Him must believe, not just that He exists, but also that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him?

Martha grieved Jesus more than once, and even to the point of tears. What's interesting is that, although her name means "lady or mistress of the house," it's derived from the verb marar which means "to be bitter", and indeed she expressed her bitterness toward Mary for not helping her and even toward Jesus for not coming before Lazarus died. But her hair was likely always covered so, there's that.
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As we find in 1Cor. 11:2-6 men shouldn't cover their heads, and women should. However, as can be seen in the lives of many women that are true belivers, their prayer is answered even if they don't.
 
posthuman said:
@Rainrider

why did God remove the temple from Jerusalem?
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First it wasn't HaShem that did this. Next it had to be done in fulfillment of prophecy. Deut. 28:64-68. If read with history in mind, you will find many things the Hebrew people have faced. From them being removed from The Land, to the Holocaust, and the antisemitism they face today.
I am sure that some will say it was due to sin, and that may well be a part of it, however, as it stands it did fulfill the prophecy given in Deut. 28.
 
posthuman said:
and is not our husband or master, but only remains to curse those who reject the Messiah, according to Romans 1-8 & Galatians 1-6

“obsolete and ready to pass away" per Hebrews 8

"taken away" and "nailed to the cross" per Colossians

is a mere shadow of and testifies of Christ - Who has come - per more scripture than i care to look up and list, but trust you are not ignorant of

so what is our appropriate approach to it?

that's what remains.
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As you know full well, we don't see this in the same way. When I look at it I find that it must be in line with the whole of The Word. Meaning that we need to look at only Biblical definitions of all that is said. Knowing this, and having read my post, (that is if you have) you have the answer to this at hand.
 
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