Has anyone found secret messages in the bible?
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Lets look at the word "inspired" in regard to the spiritual concept that is being depicted, as words depict ideas similar to drawings attempt to depict reality. Are the drawing actual photocopies of reality? No, they've only been 'inspired' by the reality, and they can never fully capture that reality. And not even an actual photo can completely express the entire fullness of reality. If you presented me with an actual photograph of Jesus and tried to tell me that it was actually Jesus, I'd think you to be a looney toon. (see what I did there?)
Moot point. Different manuscripts and translations contradict each other and nobody knows the true one.
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable for doctrine and instruction in righteousness (2 Timothy 3:16). So this would include the numbers in the Bible because they are a part of ALL Scripture.
The Bible also says man shall not live by bread alone but by EVERY Word of God. This would include the numbers in the Bible that you think are insignificant.
Only those who want to see errors in it will see them. I have been able to reconcile all the supposed popular contradictions over the years made by Anti-KJB believers.
You said:
If one believes in Textual Criticism, then they are going to buy into claims by Textual Critics and their assumptions. I don’t. I believe the Bible over the wisdom of men. God’s word teaches that His words would not pass away, and that His words are perfect. So one is either a Bible agnostic, or a Bible believer. One cannot be both. Please keep in mind that I am not saying one is Agnostic in regards to God. A Bible agnostic would be a person who does not know which Bible is the Word of God.
You said:
I don’t remember you correcting me on it by any means. Perhaps I missed the post. In either case, did you watch the video by Brandon Peterson that brings up the verses from Revelation in Isaiah 34:16?
It would be a good start to at least watch that video before trying to correct me on Isaiah 34:16.
Uh, no you cannot show the level of false doctrines that I have shown in Modern Bibles by way of comparison to the KJB by simply doing so with another existing Modern Translation. You would not be able to do so on the same level. You simply argued against the doctrinal changes I presented because you do not want to see the truth of the KJB in that it is superior by leaps and bounds.
I only presented 19 doctrinal changes in this thread. I have a lot more and they are serious. So you would not be able to replicate this with doing so by comparing two reputable Modern Bibles like say the ESV and the NASB1995.
You said:
But its not circular reasoning like Originals Onlyism because we actually have tons of good reasons to believe that the KJB is the Pure Word of God for today. Originals Onlyism is not even a biblical concept found in the Bible. But I can read about how the Bible teaches that God’s words would not pass away, and how His words are pure (Which aligns with the KJB belief held for many decades by the church). Modern Textual Criticism came at a time of apostasy and many of its creators who pushed that movement were heretical themselves. For example: Westcott and Hort’s Revised Version team had Unitarians on it. Hmmm, I wonder why those Modern Bibles attack the deity of Jesus Christ? It doesn’t take a detective to figure it out.
You said:
Again, atheists can lay claim that our using the Bible is circular reasoning for our defending the faith. But we can show a pattern of evidence that backs up the Bible. The difference between us is that you believe the facts or evidence supports you but you have not given much in way of that department. I have done so for my position. I have shown the superiority of doctrine in the KJB over Modern Bibles. I have shown how the Vatican has influenced Modern Translations. In the Nestle and Aland 27th Edition, the beginning, it lays claim that it was supervised by the Vatican. 14 changes can be found in the NIV that favor the Catholic Church. Just Google Kieth Piper NIV and check out page 21-22 of his PDF. I have also provided unexplainable mathematical phenomena in the KJB that is not present in Modern Bibles, as well.
But the chapter and verse numbers are not Scripture. They are man-made references only.
… and plenty of reasons to believe it isn’t, leaving your reasoning on its merry-go-round.
Why would I when I know heretics and liberals are associated with the birth of the Modern Translation Movement, and we can actually see changes of doctrine for the worse and not for the better in Modern Bibles? There is so much more of course. This is where you fail to employ your basic detective skills, and you are just latching on to Originals Onlyism blindly because it is more appealing to you for some odd ball reason. Besides, there are Christians who actually believe Scripture about its own purity and preservation as taught within its own pages. But Textual Criticism? Nowhere to be found or taught in the Bible at all. So your belief cannot hold a candle to the truth, my friend.
the KJV was not even completely translated from Greek and hebrew alot of it from Latin. which means it went through two interpretations before it was even created
Great claims require great evidence. Show your evidence to support your claim.
Look at the way you worship your bible..
I read the bible because I trust it. and because I know how to verify what it says
I do not worship a translation..
But if you don’t have a perfect Word of God then how do you know it is false?
You have nothing to compare it to that is better.
You have given no evidence historically, biblically, textually, doctrinally, etcetera that your position on Originals Onlyism is better.
But I have briefly demonstrated the people attached to each Bible line. I have shown the superiority of the KJB by way of doctrine. I have shown the divine nature of the text by Biblical Numerics. I even pointed out the flaws or deceptions in the Modern Bible movement. They use methods that are deceptive. For example: The NIV is one of the most butchered Bibles out there. Whole giant sections of Scripture are missing. So what did they do? Did they tell you how they butchered the NIV? No. They hide it from the reader in that they disperse the verse numbers and they pad the text with extra unnecessary spaces to make it look like the Bible is bigger than it actually is. They also do not tell you of any changes they make either. NIV use to say that the leper was healed with kindness by Jesus in Mark 4:1, and now it says Jesus healed the leper with indignation (anger). The update was even worse. The NKJV even makes changes for the worse later on. No authority. No standard but oneself or the Modern Scholar who does not really know the languages intimately. I say this because 99.9% of your Modern Scholars reject 1 John 5:7. Yet, a guy in Greece who is a Greek grammarian and who has no agenda on the matter says there is a solecism in the text if 1 John 5:7 is not there. Even a reading in English will tell you there is a problem contextually. There are three that bear record in Heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost (1 John 5:7). 1 John 5:8 talks about the witness on the Earth, water, blood, and spirit (Which is the witness of man). 1 John 5:7 is the witness of God. 1 John 5:9 says the witness of God is greater. There are earlier Latin witnesses and early church fathers testifying to the Comma early on. But these things are ignored by Textual Critics because it simply does not follow their narrative or circular reasoning.
And how would you define worship? I see worship as bowing down to something as if it was the totality of God Himself.
God is a spirit being and He should be worshiped.
But the Bible is the very thoughts and mind of God for us today.
If you attack our reverence of the the mind of God, you are attacking the very mind of God.
I see the Bible (KJB) as a love letter that was perfectly preserved for me.
But what do you do with Psalms 119:140?
It says, "Thy word is very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it.”
So do you not love God’s Word?
Also, if you are going to accuse believers of worshiping a Bible because they believe the words are pure words as its very own pages teach, then you must also accuse Moses of worshiping God’s words because he carried the perfect set of God’s words on tablets of stone written by the very finger of God. That is why we cannot take your false claims that we worship the Bible seriously. It’s just false slander with no real biblical substance or merit.
You said:
So you are not aware that Modern Bibles teach false doctrines? I have shown 19 false doctrines in Modern Bibles in this very thread.
You said:
You have to demonstrate that your claim is true with the Bible. Most KJB believers I have run into do not claim to bow down to the KJB as if it was God Himself. It is merely a love letter conveying His thoughts to us so we can have faith in Him and His Words.
How do you see my quote of 2 Timothy 3:16 and Luke 4:4 as veering off track from how we are not to regard all things in the Bible like even the numbers that are a part of Scripture? Are you suggesting that the numbers in the Bible have no meaning?
But 1 Corinthians 14:10 says,
“There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them is without signification.”
Scripture is God’s voice or words for us today, and it is not without significance. Meaning, even his words in regards to the mention of certain numbers must have meaning of some kind. We actually do see this in Revelation 13:18. Coincidentally, we see a pattern with other numbers in the Bible, as well. Of course, one can bury their head in the sand to such things out of fear of occult numerology (Which is the study of numbers to guide one’s life by them, like say help with your finances, love life, etcetera). No such thing applies to the teaching found in Revelation 13:18, which naturally apply to our understanding on the meaning of other numbers. Counting to find out the account is what Revelation 13:18 tells you to do. It would be useless to tell you to do this and yet give you the answer. So it is implying that you can do so with other numbers.
Nothing is impossible for God. What some people see is all things done on a carnal or outward level, looking only for imperfections or error. But they are not taking a step back and looking at the bigger picture on how God is operating to preserve His words. They are not looking at the good fruit that the KJB produced and its great and positive influence throughout history. They do not recognize the dark origins of the Modern Bible movement. They are not looking for answers on this topic with the Bible, either. They are just trying to discern things with what they believe is Science.