The problem I see here HTG is that Christ would not have been "sacrificed" on the Passover.
Good Thursday?
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The problem I see here HTG is that Christ would not have been "sacrificed" on the Passover.
Very correct here, there were two Sabbaths that week. The First Day of Unleavened Bread...
Joh 19:31 Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day, that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
and also the weekly Sabbath...
Luk 23:55 And the women who had come with Him from Galilee followed after, and they observed the tomb and how His body was laid.
Luk 23:56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.
Just as He was put into the tomb at/about sunset, on Wednesday. Thursday, the First Day of Unleavened Bread began at sunset and they could not go and buy the spices. It was a High Day. Then they prepared the spices on Friday. Preparing the spices was not simple it took some time. Do a little research into the subject and you will find it was fairly elaborate. Anyhoo, then they rested on the weekly Sabbath, the Sabbath which is according to the fourth Commandment, and early, while it was still dark, they went to the tomb to anoint the body with the spices but Christ was already gone.
B
BeyondET
Guest
Exactly, and Paul plainly says that Christ id the Passover...
1Co 5:7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us.
A side note here is that in the very next verse, Paul instructs us to keep the Feast of Unleavened Bread...
1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
Ishtar is not mentioned anywhere in the New Testament.
I don't quite follow that chart Mags - but Christ was our Passover lamb, sacrificed on the day of the Passover, he ate the supper with the disciples the night before.
Well, help me understand these two passages...
Mat 12:39 But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.
Mat 12:40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Joh 11:9 Jesus answered, "Are there not twelve hours in the day? If anyone walks in the day, he does not stumble, because he sees the light of this world.
Joh 11:10 But if one walks in the night, he stumbles, because the light is not in him."
Jesus pretty well spells out there are twelve hours of daylight in the day and then there are 1 hours of night.
Correct, and during that evening, He instituted the New Testament Passover service...
Luk 22:15 Then He said to them, "With fervent desire I have desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer;
Luk 22:16 for I say to you, I will no longer eat of it until it is fulfilled in the kingdom of God."
Luk 22:17 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, "Take this and divide it among yourselves;
Luk 22:18 for I say to you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until the kingdom of God comes."
Luk 22:19 And He took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, "This is My body which is given for you; do this in remembrance of Me."
Luk 22:20 Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.
Another very important part of the Passover service is foot washing...
Joh 13:3 Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, and that He had come from God and was going to God,
Joh 13:4 rose from supper and laid aside His garments, took a towel and girded Himself.
Joh 13:5 After that, He poured water into a basin and began to wash the disciples' feet, and to wipe them with the towel with which He was girded.
Joh 13:6 Then He came to Simon Peter. And Peter said to Him, "Lord, are You washing my feet?"
Joh 13:7 Jesus answered and said to him, "What I am doing you do not understand now, but you will know after this."
Joh 13:8 Peter said to Him, "You shall never wash my feet!" Jesus answered him, "If I do not wash you, you have no part with Me."
Joh 13:9 Simon Peter said to Him, "Lord, not my feet only, but also my hands and my head!"
Joh 13:10 Jesus said to him, "He who is bathed needs only to wash his feet, but is completely clean; and you are clean, but not all of you."
Joh 13:11 For He knew who would betray Him; therefore He said, "You are not all clean."
Joh 13:12 So when He had washed their feet, taken His garments, and sat down again, He said to them, "Do you know what I have done to you?
Joh 13:13 You call Me Teacher and Lord, and you say well, for so I am.
Joh 13:14 If I then, your Lord and Teacher, have washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another's feet.
Joh 13:15 For I have given you an example, that you should do as I have done to you.
Joh 13:16 Most assuredly, I say to you, a servant is not greater than his master; nor is he who is sent greater than he who sent him.
Joh 13:17 If you know these things, blessed are you if you do them.
John gives a clearer picture of the events:
John 18:28 Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: and it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the passover.
John 18:39 But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the passover: will ye therefore that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
This seems to be saying that they brought Jesus before Pilate early in the morning of the Passover day.
John 18:28 Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: and it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the passover.
John 18:39 But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the passover: will ye therefore that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
This seems to be saying that they brought Jesus before Pilate early in the morning of the Passover day.
Yeah but, yeah but, the sunset on the Passover day was the start of the preparation day which was a sabbath.
John 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
Thursday of the chart is the Passover Sabbath. The Passover meal was eaten the evening before Jesus' crucifixion. Jesus’ Last Supper with His disciples is recorded in all three of the Synoptic Gospels (Matt 26:17–30; Mark 14:12–26; Luke 22:7–38) where it is clearly portrayed as a Passover meal:
Mark 14:12: “On the first day of Unleavened Bread, when they sacrifice the Passover lamb, His disciples asked Him, ‘Where do You want us to go and prepare the Passover so You may eat it?’”;
Luke 22:7–8: “Then the Day of Unleavened Bread came when the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed. Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, ‘Go and prepare the Passover meal for us, so we can eat it.’”
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Defining Days and Nights
● Jonah 1:17 . .The Lord appointed a great fish to swallow Jonah, and Jonah
was in the stomach of the fish three days and three nights.
● Matt 12:40 . . As Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a
huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart
of the earth.
● John 2:19 . . Jesus answered and said to them: Destroy this temple and in
three days I will raise it up.
Biblical days are somewhat ambiguous.
For example according to Gen 1:4-5, God decreed that night and day be
kept distinctly separate and be called by their own names in order to clearly
distinguish between the two conditions. And according to Gen 1:14-18, He
decreed that day is when the sun is up, and night is when the sun is down.
But then at Gen 2:5, the entire creation endeavor is labeled day.
I recommend we narrow the meaning of day down to just one relative to
Easter by falling in line with Jesus Christ who, better than anyone else, is
undeniably qualified to tell us how to understand a day as it was understood
during the years when he himself was living in Israel.
● John 11:9 . . Jesus answered: are there not twelve hours in the day? A
man who walks by day will not stumble, for he sees by this world's light.
This world's days are of course illuminated by the sun as per Gen 1:14-18.
Days divided into twelve equal periods of sunlight were regulated by what's
known as temporal hours; which vary in length in accordance with the time
of year. There are times of the year at Jerusalem's latitude when days on
earth consist of less than 12 normal hours of daylight, and sometimes more;
but when Jesus was here; the official number of hours was always twelve
regardless.
I don't exactly know why the Jews of that era divided their days into twelve
equal periods of sunlight regardless of the seasons, but I suspect it was just
a convenient way to operate the government and conduct civil affairs;
including the Temple's activities (e.g. the daily morning and evening
sacrifices)
In order to avoid confusion; I highly recommend working with the 12-hour
day that Jesus Christ gave us in his statement at John 11:9, i.e. let Day be
daytime and let Night be nighttime; viz: the three days and three nights of
Jonah 1:17, Matt 12:40, John 2:19-22 indicate three times when the sun
was up, and three times when the sun was down.
NOTE: Even little children know the difference between night and day;
especially those afraid of the dark, and they know that night begins when
the sun goes down and day begins with the sun comes up. When a supposed
adult can't even understand things as elementary as those, then I have to
seriously question their understanding of things that are beyond a child's
ability to grasp.
● Matt 11:25-26 . . Jesus said: I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and
earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and
revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this was your good pleasure.
/
Defining Days and Nights
● Jonah 1:17 . .The Lord appointed a great fish to swallow Jonah, and Jonah
was in the stomach of the fish three days and three nights.
● Matt 12:40 . . As Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a
huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart
of the earth.
● John 2:19 . . Jesus answered and said to them: Destroy this temple and in
three days I will raise it up.
Biblical days are somewhat ambiguous.
For example according to Gen 1:4-5, God decreed that night and day be
kept distinctly separate and be called by their own names in order to clearly
distinguish between the two conditions. And according to Gen 1:14-18, He
decreed that day is when the sun is up, and night is when the sun is down.
But then at Gen 2:5, the entire creation endeavor is labeled day.
I recommend we narrow the meaning of day down to just one relative to
Easter by falling in line with Jesus Christ who, better than anyone else, is
undeniably qualified to tell us how to understand a day as it was understood
during the years when he himself was living in Israel.
● John 11:9 . . Jesus answered: are there not twelve hours in the day? A
man who walks by day will not stumble, for he sees by this world's light.
This world's days are of course illuminated by the sun as per Gen 1:14-18.
Days divided into twelve equal periods of sunlight were regulated by what's
known as temporal hours; which vary in length in accordance with the time
of year. There are times of the year at Jerusalem's latitude when days on
earth consist of less than 12 normal hours of daylight, and sometimes more;
but when Jesus was here; the official number of hours was always twelve
regardless.
I don't exactly know why the Jews of that era divided their days into twelve
equal periods of sunlight regardless of the seasons, but I suspect it was just
a convenient way to operate the government and conduct civil affairs;
including the Temple's activities (e.g. the daily morning and evening
sacrifices)
In order to avoid confusion; I highly recommend working with the 12-hour
day that Jesus Christ gave us in his statement at John 11:9, i.e. let Day be
daytime and let Night be nighttime; viz: the three days and three nights of
Jonah 1:17, Matt 12:40, John 2:19-22 indicate three times when the sun
was up, and three times when the sun was down.
NOTE: Even little children know the difference between night and day;
especially those afraid of the dark, and they know that night begins when
the sun goes down and day begins with the sun comes up. When a supposed
adult can't even understand things as elementary as those, then I have to
seriously question their understanding of things that are beyond a child's
ability to grasp.
● Matt 11:25-26 . . Jesus said: I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and
earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and
revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this was your good pleasure.
/
I thought the preparation day was the day before a Sabbath.... to prepare for the Sabbath
B
BeyondET
Guest
Well John 11:9 doesn't say there is 12 hours in a day but says there is 12 hours of daylight. And that happens on a Equinox did the crucification happen on a Equinox?
What scripture speaks of this 1 hour of night?
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No work was allowed on Sabbaths, so the lamb would be prepared prior to the actual day... would it not? Here is another interesting article on it. Really we should get Prove-All in here, as he gives the best explanations and breakdowns on this topic
Many people have wondered whether Jesus ate what is called the "Last Supper" on the evening when the Jews ate the Passover lambs, or if he ate his "Passover" meal on the evening before. The question arises because there seems to be a contradiction between what Matthew, Mark and Luke say, and what the Gospel of John tells us.
For example, Matthew 26:17 says: "On the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the disciples came to Jesus and asked, ‘Where do you want us to make preparations for you to eat the Passover?’ " The first three Gospels seem to indicate that Jesus and his disciples ate the "Last Supper" meal on the evening beginning Nisan 15. That is when the Jews would have been eating their Passover meal—on the beginning of the first day of Unleavened Bread. (See also Mark 14:12-16 and Luke 22:1, 7-8.)
However, John clearly states that the Jews had not eaten the Passover meal, even though it was the morning after Jesus’ arrest. John 18:28 says: "Then the Jews led Jesus from Caiaphas to the palace of the Roman governor. By now it was early morning, and to avoid ceremonial uncleanness the Jews did not enter the palace; they wanted to be able to eat the Passover." John 19:14 says that the day during which Jesus was crucified was only the "Preparation [day] of Passover Week." By John’s reckoning, Jesus ate the Last Supper meal one day earlier than the Jews ate the Passover meal.
Because of this seeming contradiction between the first three Gospels and John, scholars continue to wrestle with the issue of when Jesus actually ate his final meal. Of course, the term "Passover" was often applied to the entire Festival of Unleavened Bread, not just Passover day, so Jesus’ eating of a "Passover meal" could have occurred at any time during the festival season. However, it does seem that the time of the traditional eating of the Jewish Passover—on the evening of the beginning of the first day of Unleavened Bread—occurred just as Jesus was being put in the tomb. Hence, the chronological question about Jesus’ eating the Last Supper remains.
Various explanations have been offered to solve the puzzle, which are beyond the scope of this article to consider. The interested reader can peruse several commentaries, such as the Expositor’s Bible Commentary on Matthew, for a discussion of the strengths and weaknesses of the various solutions that have been put forth. The author of one such commentary on Matthew in the Tyndale New Testament series, R. T. France, presents a practical approach to the problem:
The simplest solution, and the one assumed in this commentary, is that Jesus, knowing that he would be dead before the regular time for the meal, deliberately held it in secret one day early. . . .Of course it was strictly incorrect to hold a "Passover" at any time other than the evening of Nisan 14/15 [that is, at the end of the 14th and beginning of the 15th], but Jesus was not one to be bound by formal regulations in an emergency situation! . . . .It was therefore a Passover meal in intention, but without a lamb [page 365].
This would mean that Jesus and the disciples, strictly speaking, did not eat the Passover meal at the Last Supper. It’s interesting that lamb is not mentioned as being part of the meal. If Jesus ate the "Passover meal" one day earlier than the Jews did, he simply disregarded tradition. That in itself would be instructive, indicating that his meal represented a break with old covenant institutions.
Such a reconstruction takes into account the Scriptures in all four Gospels. If what France says happened as he says it did, then Jesus died about the time when the lambs were being sacrificed for the Jewish Passover meal at the beginning of Nisan 15. What we have, then, is an interesting parallel between Jesus’ crucifixion and the killing of the lambs. The reality of Christ’s sacrificial death was "shadowed" in the simultaneous slaughter of the Passover lambs. https://www.gci.org/Jesus/wheneat
I think that was a typo. Yes the Passover is on the first full moon following the vernal equinox.