getting dates about a young earth

[Bowman]

You completely fail to grasp the context to which the verse speaks. This is a comparative example of how when Adam was created he went from a lump of dirt to a living being the instant God breathed into him life and Spirit.

Nope.

Scripture states that Adam was more than the 'lump of dirt' that you claim.

God breathed life into Adam's nostrils - thus, Adam was much more than just 'dirt'...he was taking shape as a human being.

Study up...

In like fashion Christ came that when a sinner seeks forgiveness of sin goes from dead in trespass and sin to alive unto God and inherits eternal life.

2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

The body of Christ was formed in the same way that Adam was....and Jesus did not burst onto the scene in 24hrs, as a fully formed adult.

Evolution and old earth theory are essential parts of secular humanism which is far more religious than Christianity. God did exactly what He said He did and exactly the way He said He did it.

An old earth does not mean evolution.

You have bought into the propaganda machine of the evolutionists....and they love you for that...

 

[kodiak]

It most certainly does..


So also it has been written, "The" first "man", Adam, "became a living soul;" the last Adam a life-giving Spirit. (1 Cor 15.45)

1096 gínomai – properly, to emerge,become, transitioning from one point (realm, condition) to another. 1096 (gínomai) fundamentally means "become" (becoming, became) so it is notan exact equivalent to the ordinary equative verb "to be" (is, was, will be) as with 1510 /eimí (1511 /eínai, 2258 /ēn).

The lexical defection proves to the reader that it was a process...a transitioning from one point to another.

It was NOT an instant 'to be' event....like YEC's want to force it to be.


A simple study of the original languages can clear-up many of your mis-conceptions...

You just restated what I have been saying... "Adam transitioned into a living soul" It does not say how he transitioned from non life into life....so it still doesn't say how. Transition is change from one state to another. So Adam changed from being not alive to being alive....change can even happen instantly...some people can change their mind instantly...that would still count as transitioning.
To be basically just means exist, which I never said that it was.
Process- set of steps
Step 1) Jesus spoke
Step 2) dust formed into the body of a man
Step 3) God breathed life into his nostrils
Where has it said that the process took a certain amount of time? He created Man on the 6th day....

 

[kodiak]

Apostle Peter revealed it, for those who were paying attention:

2 Peter 3:5-6
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
KJV

"by the word of God the heavens were of old," - a reference to Genesis 1:1

"and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:" - a reference to Genesis 1:2-9

"Whereby the world that then was," - a reference to that old world created at Genesis 1:1

"being overflowed with water, perished:" - a reference to the resultant condition of the earth at Genesis 1:2.

And the earth that is left from that flood is saved for fire, not another flood....

 

[Bowman]

You just restated what I have been saying... "Adam transitioned into a living soul" It does not say how he transitioned from non life into life....so it still doesn't say how. Transition is change from one state to another. So Adam changed from being not alive to being alive....change can even happen instantly...some people can change their mind instantly...that would still count as transitioning.
To be basically just means exist, which I never said that it was.
Process- set of steps
Step 1) Jesus spoke
Step 2) dust formed into the body of a man
Step 3) God breathed life into his nostrils
Where has it said that the process took a certain amount of time? He created Man on the 6th day....

If the transition were instant, to fit the YEC worldview, then a different verb would have been employed in the comparison.

After all, YEC's must force a massive amount of events into their self-imposed 24hr goal posts...

 

[valiant]

The was only one global Flood, the Flood of Noah's time. That one Flood was the catalyst for the one and only Ice Age, which lasted all of 700 or so years.

and you've agreed the flood was c 2400 bc. I'm waiting for you to tell me how the people who wrote before 2400 bc didn't know about ft except as a long past event>

 

[kodiak]

If the transition were instant, then a different verb would have been employed in the comparison.

Then why does it still work? It just means a process/ transitioning or set of steps....A set of steps can be performed in different amounts of time

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

I thought the Earth was only about 10,000 years old.
Fossil find is oldest European yet : Nature News

 

[notuptome]

Nope.

Scripture states that Adam was more than the 'lump of dirt' that you claim.

God breathed life into Adam's nostrils - thus, Adam was much more than just 'dirt'...he was taking shape as a human being.

Study up...

Take your own advice. Adam was not alive until God breathed into him the breath of life. A lump of dirt can most certainly have nostrils in fact most sculptures have nostrils just not functioning ones.

The body of Christ was formed in the same way that Adam was....and Jesus did not burst onto the scene in 24hrs, as a fully formed adult.

Actually Jesus was preexistent to Adam. Preexistent to all of creation.

An old earth does not mean evolution.

You have bought into the propaganda machine of the evolutionists....and they love you for that...

You are still closer to the secular humanists than to Christianity.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

I thought the Earth was only about 10,000 years old.
Fossil find is oldest European yet : Nature News

Testing methods for dating fossils are unreliable and given to wild fluctuations.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yeah, of course I'm doing some speculating, but based on God's Word and the evidence He left us in the fossil record. Evolutionists are totally against what I've been saying.

And yet, you're doing the same thing with the dinosaur egg thing on Noah's ark. And even if that was so, we'd still have huge dinosaurs walking around on the earth today, which of course, is NOT speculation, because they aren't.

That is assuming that large dinos can live in our world.

The world today is not the sae world as pre-flood. that is what peter was trying to show us.. The flood changed everything.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

That is assuming that large dinos can live in our world.

The world today is not the sae world as pre-flood. that is what peter was trying to show us.. The flood changed everything.

2 Pet 5:3-7?

 

[DP]

And the earth that is left from that flood is saved for fire, not another flood....

That's right. The time prior to Noah is part of this present world which is reserved for destruction by fire. That's why the shaking of the earth only per the end of Hebrews 12 and Jeremiah 4:23-28 was not the destruction by a flood in Noah's day.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

2 Pet 5:3-7?

you mean 3: 5-7?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

That's right. The time prior to Noah is part of this present world which is reserved for destruction by fire. That's why the shaking of the earth only per the end of Hebrews 12 and Jeremiah 4:23-28 was not the destruction by a flood in Noah's day.

You have noahs flood as being basically nothing.

Scripture says it was not nothing, It was destructive. So destructive, all flesh but what was left on the ark perished..


Noahs flood was not a small little rain storm. The fountains of the great deep burst open. And the earth was never the same again.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

you mean 3: 5-7?

Got it! Thanks

 

[Bowman]

Then why does it still work? It just means a process/ transitioning or set of steps....A set of steps can be performed in different amounts of time

God creates within the bounds of the natural laws that He established.

There are several Hebrew creation verbs employed in the birth of Adam and Eve - indicating a process of fashioning over a period of time.

You need to approach it in this light, in lieu of your 24hr time limit that you place on God.

 

[Bowman]

Take your own advice. Adam was not alive until God breathed into him the breath of life. A lump of dirt can most certainly have nostrils in fact most sculptures have nostrils just not functioning ones.

Then a step-by-step process was followed in fashioning Adam....of which, takes time.

Actually Jesus was preexistent to Adam. Preexistent to all of creation.

As God, yes.

As human flesh, no.

You are still closer to the secular humanists than to Christianity.

No.

But, the humanists most assuredly have won their case with you...

 

[kodiak]

God creates within the bounds of the natural laws that He established.

Bible verse that says this please.

There are several Hebrew creation verbs employed in the birth of Adam and Eve - indicating a process of fashioning over a period of time.

Just like the one above that just said transition and didn't indicate how long the transition was? If not, can you please share some of these?

 

[Dan_473]

(the following stuff is all my opinion)
this came to my mind today, and I think it has relevance to the entire bible, especially when word definitions start being talked about.

a story in a written language is usually more than the sum of all the word definitions.

I'm not really sure why or how this developed, but it seems common that writers are often able to put things into a story that are not directly stated, but are expected to be inferred.

here's a brief overview from the education world
Inferences Worksheets | Reading Worksheets


and some specific examples
Inferences Worksheet 1 | Preview

 

[Dan_473]

Yeah, of course I'm doing some speculating, but based on God's Word and the evidence He left us in the fossil record. Evolutionists are totally against what I've been saying.

And yet, you're doing the same thing with the dinosaur egg thing on Noah's ark. And even if that was so, we'd still have huge dinosaurs walking around on the earth today, which of course, is NOT speculation, because they aren't.

say, DP,
I'm interested in talking about dinosaurs and humans with a resonable person who sees it differently than I do. you seem reasonable person, and of course, I think that about myself.
we both have access to pretty much the same bible texts and science data. in a sense, we're both in the same boat.

of course, anyone is welcome to join in,
I just wanted to start this exchange with a non-adversarial tone. I think discussions are usually more edifying when people are working together as a team, even if they end up drawing different conclusions.

so, when I read that God made all the land animals and all the birds and brought them to adam who named them, to me that sounds like the author wants to say that there weren't other animals around already.

what's your view?