We have a saying, 'self praise is no recommendation.' If she was speaking of herself in the future as something special (incidentally there is no suggestion that it is a prophecy) then it would not tie in with her later words. But if she meant (as she did) that God had blessed her by making her the mother of the Messiah, then there was no self-exaltation, but only humble gratitude
Catholic Heresy (for the record)
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We have a saying, 'self praise is no recommendation.' If she was speaking of herself in the future as something special (incidentally there is no suggestion that it is a prophecy) then it would not tie in with her later words. But if she meant (as she did) that God had blessed her by making her the mother of the Messiah, then there was no self-exaltation, but only humble gratitude
With all due respect to your friends, God has declared that all men are sinners, that the wages of sin is death and salvation is a gift received from God not earned or deserved. Read the book of Romans and ask God to show you what is going on in the world. Later in the book of Romans God says that He has concluded all in unbelief that He might have mercy on all. We all have nice friends but nice does not get one into heaven. Only the blood of Christ can atone for our sins.
The gospel of John is the next book to consult to learn of why Jesus Christ came to this world and what He accomplished for our benefit.
I cannot judge but God has judged already.
The fields are white unto harvest but the laborers are few.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
M
mattp0625
Guest
In this thread, there are things said like:
As I said..
I will give you an example...
See my previous post...
Notice the common denominator.
Love each other, as I have loved you.
As I said..
I will give you an example...
See my previous post...
Notice the common denominator.
Love each other, as I have loved you.
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Is it unloving to warn souls of hell? Jesus warned of hell more than He spoke of heaven.
Perhaps you do not see because you are not able to perceive.
Jesus Christ founded His church in Jerusalem not in Rome.
The fields are white unto harvest but the laborers are few.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
M
mattp0625
Guest
M
mattp0625
Guest
L
lumberjack
Guest
Just some thoughts on your post, I'm just a lost soul seeking Love. thanks
In order:
1. he did say "do this in remembrance of me". But, yes, your correct, he didn't tells us how often to remember him. I would think daily for that matter...
2. Sacraments, they shouldn't offend you so much. Getting baptized, married, receiving comminion, repenting from your sins etc. These acts shouldn't give any Christian the chills.
3. Mother of God. Well, she literally was though, she gave birth to our Lord God and Savior. its not worship of her, its kind of like a blessed title. Like Elizabeth, "hail Mary full of Grace, the Lord is with you.....blessed are you among women". In Luke it also states Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit when she proclaimed that. So, I don't know, I don't think its necessarily wrong for her to have that title.
4. Agreed
5. I get what your saying, but we as Christians most certainly fall from grace from time to time. Think of it this way, when God gives us grace, we obviously come to a certain understanding, I call it love, but when we fall from that grace, its not a punishment, but another opportunity to seek him. I'm almost certain, once saved always saved is incorrect, in addition I see grace acting in the same manner, in a sense, coming and going. Its exactly how we learn to love our neighbor, both when are full of grace and when we aren't. We learn to love no matter what!
In order:
1. he did say "do this in remembrance of me". But, yes, your correct, he didn't tells us how often to remember him. I would think daily for that matter...
2. Sacraments, they shouldn't offend you so much. Getting baptized, married, receiving comminion, repenting from your sins etc. These acts shouldn't give any Christian the chills.
3. Mother of God. Well, she literally was though, she gave birth to our Lord God and Savior. its not worship of her, its kind of like a blessed title. Like Elizabeth, "hail Mary full of Grace, the Lord is with you.....blessed are you among women". In Luke it also states Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit when she proclaimed that. So, I don't know, I don't think its necessarily wrong for her to have that title.
4. Agreed
5. I get what your saying, but we as Christians most certainly fall from grace from time to time. Think of it this way, when God gives us grace, we obviously come to a certain understanding, I call it love, but when we fall from that grace, its not a punishment, but another opportunity to seek him. I'm almost certain, once saved always saved is incorrect, in addition I see grace acting in the same manner, in a sense, coming and going. Its exactly how we learn to love our neighbor, both when are full of grace and when we aren't. We learn to love no matter what!
From the Roman Catholic Churches Official Catechism
966 "Finally the Immaculate Virgin, preserved free from all stain of original sin, when the course of her earthly life was finished, was taken up body and soul into heavenly glory, and exalted by the Lord as Queen over all things, so that she might be the more fully conformed to her Son, the Lord of lords and conqueror of sin and death."[SUP]508[/SUP] The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin is a singular participation in her Son's Resurrection and an anticipation of the resurrection of other Christians
(They just forgot to mention it in the New Testament)
The early church discussed whether she should be called Mother of God and it was rejected. It was agreed she be called theotokos - God bearer
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She bore God, she is the mother of His manhood. She is not the mother of God. God does not have a mother. God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, is eternal. When the early church discussed this matter it was agreed that she should be called theotokos, 'God-bearer'.
As did Mary. Indeed Jesus had to repudiate her motherhood for a time because she was trying to hinder His work.(Mark3.21, 31-35). And He stated that those who heard the word of God and did it were more blessed than MARY (Luke 11.28).
However, we do not fall FROM grace (except doctrinally) we fall INTO grace
Theotokos is Mother of God or Birth-Giver of God to be more precise. What was rejected was not Mother of God, but instead Mother of the flesh of Jesus, because it lead to a heresy about the hypostatic union of Christ.
I did read and think about everything you said - and I still say that my RC friends are loved by me, my friends and by GOD. You may not love them and think they will be judged badly. I just think the judgement is happening here on earth
You Roman Catholics will go to any lengths to defend your heresies and will produce any necessary lies. What was rejected was MOTHER OF GOD. The majority demanded she only be called BEARER OF GOD. It is quite clear to any intelligent person that she could not be the MOTHER of GOD because GOD DOES NOT HAVE A MOTHER. God is eternal. Mary was a creature of the 1st century AD, and like us all, a sinful one. She produced the Messiah. She did not produce God. God already existed.
Mary was the mother of the flesh of Jesus. That was what she conceived. The Holy Spirit implanted the Godhood. Mary was the channel by which He came into the world. She was in no real sense God's mother. She was the mother of the humanity into which God entered.
But when she tried to deflect Jesus from the course of His Messiahship He repudiated both her and His younger brother declared that His mother, sisters and brothers were those who did the will of God (Mark 3.21, 31-35).
Furthermore, when the woman cried out, 'blessed is the womb that bore you and the nipples that you have sucked', Jesus replied 'Yes RATHER blessed are those who hear the word of God and do it' (Luke 11.27-28).
Nor was she numbered at any time as one of His women disciples (e.g. Luke 8.2). It was not until the cross and the resurrection that she was brought back to her senses.
When the angel said to he 'hail Mary who is highly favoured' it was simply saying that she was highly favoured by being chosen to produce the Messiah, it was not saying anything about her essential future life. The same verb is used in Ephesians 1.6 of all true born again Christians who are 'highly favoured (same verb) in the Beloved'.
Zoii it does not matter if you love your Catholic friends or if your friends love the Catholics. What matters is who are you listening to? Are you listening to what God says or are you listening to what the Catholics says? I do not hate the Catholics because my whole family are Catholics. I do hate the lies the Catholics are teaching as Truths from God.
You CAN hate what a person is teaching while still loving the person!
Yes, the Catholics will be judged for the lies they are teachings. And yes most Catholics will not enter into Heaven because they teach a different Gospel then the one we have received from God.
Galatians 1:6-9
[SUP]6 [/SUP] I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel—
[SUP]7 [/SUP] not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
The Catholics are accursed by their many false doctrines about Mary. I did not say this, the Holy Spirit said it! The Holy Spirit clearly teaches that all those who teach a different Gospel ARE accursed!
Matthew 7:15-20
[SUP]15 [/SUP] "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles?
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Therefore by their fruits you will know them.
We are to beware of false brothers who claim to be a Christian but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.
Matthew 7:21-23
[SUP]21 [/SUP] "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
[SUP]23 [/SUP] And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'
These verses apply to the Catholics today. How can a Catholic do the Will of the Father while teaching a different Gospel? They cannot! Many Catholics have been judged by God and many Catholics will never enter into Heaven. Its a shame the Catholics are so willing to give up entering into Heaven just to Worship Mary as their God.
Repent Zoii! Ask Jesus Christ into your heart! Accept the Salvation He has for you before its too late!
You CAN hate what a person is teaching while still loving the person!
Yes, the Catholics will be judged for the lies they are teachings. And yes most Catholics will not enter into Heaven because they teach a different Gospel then the one we have received from God.
Galatians 1:6-9
[SUP]6 [/SUP] I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel—
[SUP]7 [/SUP] not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
The Catholics are accursed by their many false doctrines about Mary. I did not say this, the Holy Spirit said it! The Holy Spirit clearly teaches that all those who teach a different Gospel ARE accursed!
Matthew 7:15-20
[SUP]15 [/SUP] "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles?
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Therefore by their fruits you will know them.
We are to beware of false brothers who claim to be a Christian but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.
Matthew 7:21-23
[SUP]21 [/SUP] "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
[SUP]23 [/SUP] And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'
These verses apply to the Catholics today. How can a Catholic do the Will of the Father while teaching a different Gospel? They cannot! Many Catholics have been judged by God and many Catholics will never enter into Heaven. Its a shame the Catholics are so willing to give up entering into Heaven just to Worship Mary as their God.
Repent Zoii! Ask Jesus Christ into your heart! Accept the Salvation He has for you before its too late!
Read the decision of the Council. You will find that to argue that Mary is mother of the flesh of Jesus leads to a great heresy about Jesus. It turns the body of our Lord into a vessel and not something uniquely a part of who He was and is. That is heresy for it denies the hypostatic union.
You also wish to mistranslate "full of grace" as highly favoured. That is not what is said. The word is not favoured but perfected. She like us is perfected in grace by our Lord Jesus Christ.
Do not cut off your own nose to spite your face.
She herself is not Catholic, she just disagrees with you. And in return you infer she is damned? Is all who disagree with you lost? Who made you Jim Jones?
Hypostatic union is a way to create lie.
It is simple. God come to the earth in the form of Human. He is God but for temporary take human body.
His human body is regular flesh like other, need to be feed,
He still creator, and He create Mary. Mary is still His creator, and not Queen of heaven.
if the word means 'full of grace' (which it does NOT) then all Christians are 'full of grace in the Beloved' thus making Mary no more or no less than other Christians. (Eph 1.6) .. The actual meaning is 'engraced'. There is no FULL about it. If you simply mean that Christ has perfected for ever those who are being sanctified then again that is true of all Christians. So you are being dishonest in suggesting that it make Mary special as you constantly have tried to do. You have not only cut off your nose but seemingly had a lobotomy as well.