Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Magenta]

It is correct to make Calvinism a pejorative term, his character makes that clear.

Are you another one who lies about him being a murderer?

Maybe we should make HeIsHere a pejorative based on your character...

 

[cv5]

My reticence to Calvinism isn't the truths that it entails. It's the pejorative use of it. But we've already been through this. This and the fact that I came to believe as I have independently of the influence of Calvin. So how is one a Calvinist who hasn't studied the works of Calvin?

You are correct. Faith does magnify God because it evidences God at work in the individual. But faith generated by individuals apart from the work of God magnifies man. When individuals leave God out of any part of the salvation process, they magnify themselves in that regard.

Patently unbiblical pseudo-philosophical poppycock.
What is God doing exactly? Installing "faith generators" in some and not in others?
I mean is that the latest Calvinist thing?
But faith generated by individuals apart from the work of God magnifies man.

generated AND faith
occurs 0 time in 0 verse in the KJV.

There are no concordance results for generated AND faith in the KJV.

 

[Rufus]

Belief precedes, is still very clear.

Is it now!?

John 11:26
26 and whoever lives and believes in me will never die. Do you believe this?"
NIV

And,

Ex 14:31
31 And when the Israelites saw the great power the LORD displayed against the Egyptians, the people feared the LORD and put their trust in him and in Moses his servant.
NIV

Faith is not possible apart from the supernatural gift of the Fear of the Lord being instilled into the hearts of God's people. The Fear of God is what moved the ancient Hebrews to faith! The Lord displayed his power first -- then the people responded to that manifestation of his power. Just as God's power was effectual in parting the Red Sea, so is it just as effectual when applied by the Holy Spirit, in this New Covenant age to Abraham's spiritual descendants.

And,

Ps 145:19
19 He fulfills the desires of those who fear him;
he hears their cry and saves them.
NIV

Godly desires precede faith and those desires are the result of God's gift of the Fear of the Lord to his covenant people.

And,

Isa 33:6
6 Wisdom and knowledge will be the stability of your times,
And the strength of salvation;
The fear of the LORD is His treasure.
NKJV

The reason it's "His treasure" (or Zion's treasure, depending on translation) is because the Fear of the Lord is the beginning of godly wisdom and knowledge which in turn leads to salvation. No one can be saved apart from wanting/desiring to be saved, and that disposition of heart is God's supernatural/efficacious work when He instills into His covenant people the fear of Himself.

 

[studier]

This verse in it's entirety should be enough to suggest an unsaved person doesn't have any freedom.

If an unbeliever is at work, he will challenge the verse all over the bible.

The dangers associated to that is a person get led astray. (Stop them in there tracks, ask the question, do do you really believe an unbeliever has any real freedom here ?

If a believer is at work posting this thread they will accept it in a blink of any eye.

Corpses don’t walk in disobedience. Paul’s own words undo the corpse analogy. Why cut out the very verses that explain this?

 

[Magenta]

Is it now!?

What is clear is the FWer has a God-hater who is captive to the will of the devil and blinded to the truth and cannot
see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, deciding to believe what he hears as
foolishness when he can neither receive nor comprehend the spiritual things of God which he is actually opposed to.
They have that man which Scripture identifies as refusing to come into the light, as choosing to come into the light.
In short, their theology is quite mixed up and nonsensical because it rejects much of what is said of man.

 

[Genez]

The Church Fathers were not Calvinist.
And neither should you or anyone else be of that ilk.

BTW.....it's actually better defined as the Reformed TRADITION. And a lot of heavyweight Churches buy into it.

Fortunately, I am not the least afflicted, as I actually know better. Lucky me huh?
Well.....luck and thousands of hours of Bible lectures.

Over time, Satan got into the Church and took control over the minds via the RCC with its dogmas and rules designed for the superstitious and religious types.... of which there were plenty to be found.

Then, after the RCC could no longer hide the monster in the coset,... some believers with brains and having access
to the Scriptures came along to begin the Reformation.

Satan, realizing his plight with people breaking away from his control during the reformation, quickly established
a new system to replace the old.

TULIP appealed to a certain mindset and would prevent deep spiritual growth…

It got promoted. And, it has become the new alternate for the RCC, for those with enough sense to realize that the RCC was nonsense religion, only using the name of Christ to appease the religious ones seeking a sense of human dignity.

It's the ones who, by the leading of the Spirit, who will keep growing in understanding and wisdom who will mature in Christ.

All denominations with their dogmas and regulations lock people's minds down while offering a sense of stability,
having a sense of a religious satisfaction, to make one feel right with God.

The way to destruction is broad and wide. Take your pick!

The way that leads to life is under pressure (narrow) and demands strict (strait) interpretation technique.
God provides for such teaching....

Making for a very relaxed people when they find themselves in spiritual maturity.

So B it.

 

[Cameron143]

Bet that as it may, it clearly states belief precedes all the rest.

No it doesn't. It merely states belief comes before sealing.

 

[Cameron143]

Patently unbiblical pseudo-philosophical poppycock.
What is God doing exactly? Installing "faith generators" in some and not in others?
I mean is that the latest Calvinist thing?
But faith generated by individuals apart from the work of God magnifies man.

generated AND faith
occurs 0 time in 0 verse in the KJV.

There are no concordance results for generated AND faith in the KJV.

Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Word of God produces hearing.
Hearing produces faith.
Faith is produced by the Spirit employing the word of God.

 

[DeanM]

Over time, Satan got into the Church and took control over the minds via the RCC with its dogmas and rules designed for the superstitious and religious types.... of which there were plenty to be found.

Then, after the RCC could no longer hide the monster in the coset,... some believers with brains and having access
to the Scriptures came along to begin the Reformation.

Satan, realizing his plight with people breaking away from his control during the reformation, quickly established
a new system to replace the old.

TULIP appealed to a certain mindset and would prevent deep spiritual growth…

It got promoted. And, it has become the new alternate for the RCC, for those with enough sense to realize that the RCC was nonsense religion, only using the name of Christ to appease the religious ones seeking a sense of human dignity.

It's the ones who, by the leading of the Spirit, who will keep growing in understanding and wisdom who will mature in Christ.

All denominations with their dogmas and regulations lock people's minds down while offering a sense of stability,
having a sense of a religious satisfaction, to make one feel right with God.

The way to destruction is broad and wide. Take your pick!

The way that leads to life is under pressure (narrow) and demands strict (strait) interpretation technique.
God provides for such teaching....

Making for a very relaxed people when they find themselves in spiritual maturity.

So B it.

Not just Calvinism. Jesuits were and still are the tool of satan. The soldiers in the RCC's counter protestant war. The Oxford Movement was a good example.

 

[studier]

So you, too, think that Adam manifested faith in the post-Fall narrative as CV5 does? And you, TOO, believe that Adam was this superhero who sinned only because he wanted to save Eve who he loved so much even though he threw her under the bus? And CV5's latest theory is about commandments and man's ability to keep them is that God didn't give the Law of Moses to Israel expecting full, perfect and complete compliance -- only compliance "in good faith". You agree with all his unsubstantiated theories?

I think what I said in response to this:

CV5 is the biggest fabricator of lies I have ever met on any "Christian" forum. He thinks nothing of making things up out of whole cloth to support his man-made theology.

Which was:

Here, let me adjust the font....

PROJECTION.

 

[Magenta]

Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Word of God produces hearing.
Hearing produces faith.
Faith is produced by the Spirit employing the word of God.

Romans 10 v 13-15 ~ Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. How then shall they call on Him in Whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of Whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach, except they be sent? As it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

 

[rogerg]

Corpses don’t walk in disobedience. Paul’s own words undo the corpse analogy. Why cut out the very verses that explain this?

Then how do they walk? In obedience? The physical actions of man reflect their spiritual state - whether they be spiritually dead or alive. If they walk in disobedience, it is because they are spiritually dead with their disobedience as the result. Though spiritually dead, yet not physically dead, they walk in disobedience - disobedience being a manifestation of spiritual death, that comes from someone who is spiritually dead.

 

[Magenta]

Faith magnifies God, not self.

FWers magnify self, not God. They scream about God's sovereignty and tell us how unfair He
is, and it is not beneath them to blaspheme the Name of God rather than admit they are wrong.

 

[cv5]

Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Word of God produces hearing.
Hearing produces faith.
Faith is produced by the Spirit employing the word of God.

@studier and @HeIsHere will need to take care of this I'm out for a bike ride.

Standard heresy reboot protocol in play here. Standard @Cameron143 gameplay.
Wash rinse and repeat......

 

[studier]

If they weren't dead, then why did God have to make them alive?

Because being separated from God is death. Restoration is God making us alive in Christ. Paul defines death as alienation, not as corpses unable to respond.

 

[Magenta]

Ephesians 1 v 13-14, Hebrews 10 v 23 In Him, having heard and believed the word of truth - the gospel of your salvation - you were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, Who is the pledge of our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession, to the praise of His glory. Let us hold on to the confession of our hope without wavering, for He Who promised is faithful.

 

[Jordon]

There are many who are initially dismissive, thinking that being able to choose what colour of socks to wear proves man has a will that is free, but that is a very shallow view of man and not at all what is under consideration, since it has no bearing at all on the eternal fate of one's soul... what is really under view is what Scripture says of the unregenerated man: being a lover of darkness and a slave to sin, blinded to the truth, under the power and influence of the wicked one, captive to the will of the devil, incapable of obeying or submitting to God, refusing to come into the light, unable to receive or comprehend the spiritual things of God which he is actually opposed to as a God hater etc etc and much of it too is dismissed by the free willers, because many of them are Pelagian heretics. But to those reading along who are not Pelagian heretics and see the truth of Scripture presented? Glory be to God for opening their eyes to the truth of the matter.

Pelagian heretics insist man is inherently good. From within the hearts of men come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, wickedness, deceit, debauchery, envy, slander, arrogance, and foolishness. Mark 7 verses 21-22 Every inclination of man's heart is evil from his youth. Genesis 8 verse 21b Who can bring out clean from unclean? No one! Job 14 verse 4 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Matthew 7 verse 18

I understand all this magenta all I'm saying is really if you respond out of kindness and not in kindness to there numerous multiple attempts to attack your faith, you then give them even more fuel to attack your faith further.


Like yet another attempt to attack your faith above here which no doubt you can't see that one either.

And this is even despite pointing out religious racism is a criminal offense.....

No notice has been taken.

So sharing the word of God with this kind of mentality can help, but

But seeing as there only interested in attacking your faith, there also going to trash your feelings as well as the feelings you have for God.

Please don't let them upset the feelings you have For God, coz if you do it will only give them the fuel they need to attack your faith more, because more often than not when a person responds out of upset to a person of this kind of hatred, they won't be concerned for your feelings and hurt you even more. Then when you say something bad out of hurt they've won. Don't let them win pet.

 

[Magenta]

Because being separated from God is death. Restoration is God making us alive in Christ. Paul defines death as alienation, not as corpses unable to respond.

God made us alive while we were dead, not after as a dead person we chose something we were opposed to and did not understand.

 

[Cameron143]

@studier and @HeIsHere will need to take care of this I'm out for a bike ride.

Standard heresy reboot protocol in play here. Standard @Cameron143 gameplay.
Wash rinse and repeat......

One day you'll get it. Hang in there.

 

[studier]

But it doesn't demonstrate the efficacy of his grace by which one believes the gospel. The difference isn't with God, remember?

The difference isn’t with God’s grace. it’s always sufficient and offered to all. The difference is in man’s volitional response, which is why Scripture holds unbelievers accountable.