Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Kroogz]

You honestly believe this is how I would answer such a question?

No. You would never tell him the things you believe and witness to us.

 

[HeIsHere]

His flesh was dead.

Selective application is the real problem over and over again.

 

[Magenta]

Flesh serves the law of sin. For the flesh craves what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are opposed to each other. Nothing good lives in my flesh. Who can say, “I have kept my heart pure; I am clean and without sin”? Who can bring what is pure from the impure? No one! The flesh brings forth fruit unto death. Romans 7 v 25, Galatians 5 v 17, Romans 7 v 18, Proverbs 20 v 9, Job 14 v 4, Romans 7 v 5 (Romans 8 v 13 and James 1 v 15)

 

[Magenta]

Selective application is the real problem over and over again.

Your selective application is 100% faulty.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

But what your bolded statement above does not say is that God wills or has decreed that everyone be saved! And that was my point in my last post to you. Thank you for affirming that for me.

And, by the way, God's intentions in his salvation is even revealed in what YOU wrote. God intends to save all those who have faith and He intends to condemn all who don't. (A synonym for "intend" is purpose for your info.) You make much ado about nothing.

“But what your bolded statement above does not say is that God wills or has decreed that everyone be saved! “

yes you and some others do that constantly you avoid what it says and then say “ bit it doesn’t say these exact words that I’m saying “ …. Constant creations of straw men to distract from what’s there

“For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“ it doesn’t say all men without exception “

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“ it doesn’t say all creation without exception and they can’t hear it unless they are chosen “ ….. it’s not a fruitful situation to use one’s time spinning corcle and playing word games musical chairs

“My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: and he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭2:1-2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

a ot he o ly died for those who are als ready saved not the world “ …. Never gets anywhere because no one accepts the information that’s actually there

 

[Cameron143]

No. You would never tell him the things you believe and witness to us.

I have told them all I tell you, but I would never answer that question the way you proposed I would.

 

[Cameron143]

Selective application is the real problem over and over again.

The flesh versus the spirit is at the heart of the matter at hand.

 

[Cameron143]

If there are none that seek after God, and someone shows an interest in the things of God, why would I dampen that interest. It's the very thing I look for. It probably means God is at work. Jesus did always what He saw the Father doing. What do you see God doing? How do you know when God is at work?

 

[cv5]

probably studies the Bible instead of explaining the Bible

“For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭4:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: and whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?”
‭‭John‬ ‭11:25-26‬ ‭

“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14:9‬ ‭

brother it isn’t a weakness to learn a new thing or acknowledge we had something not quite right it’s a strength.

No ones dead to God yet some are dead to us but not to him

“For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭20:38‬ ‭

Whether a person is living or dead Jesus is thier lord and they will hear him and rise up from thier slumber

“all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth;


they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”

So you are telling us that the Bible states that a deceased Lazarus, a deceased little girl, and BILLIONS of both redeemed and condemned deceased persons CAN in fact "hear"?

Wow, that is quite a shocking deficit on the part of the super-determinists.

I would go so far as to say that such an abject failure is doctrinally catastrophic.

What do you think @NightTwister sir? Are you with me on this?

 

[Rufus]

I'm sure that Satan is thrilled when the super-determinists proclaim a Salvation that is both unavailable and unobtainable by means of the preaching of the gospel message.

And the bonus for Satan: proclaiming fatalistic Calvinism makes Jesus out to be a fraud and a liar.

The only liars here are you FWers! You just can't resist posting stupid straw men rebuttals, can you? No one here ever claimed what you wrote. I, for one, have frequently said that one must be born of the WORD (i.e. "gospel message") AND the Holy Spirit. So...salvation is certainly available and obtainable by God's efficacious grace.

I see that you still haven't come up with a passage that proves that Adam exercised faith after he sinned. You're having a tough time, are you, in proving from scripture that you didn't lie about that as well? Okay.... maybe you can answer this next question re the Parable of the Banquet in Lk 14:16-24. There are three groups of people mentioned in this parable to wit:

A. The invited (vv. 17-20)
B. The ones brought into the banquet (vv. 21-22)
C. The ones who were compelled to attend (vv. 23-24)

My question to you if you think you're up to it is this: Of these three groups, which ones, if any, were called to attend the banquet?

And the rest of you FWers, feel free to jump in and answer this question.

 

[Rufus]

Grace!!!!!!!!! Its is God's intervention with man, to make what is impossible for man, yet required by God... to accomplish.


2 Corinthians 12:8-9

Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me.
But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.”
Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ’s power may rest on me."

God did not tell Paul to be a man about it, and gut it out, and be strong!
Instead?
God provided the power needed that Paul did not possess!

Likewise...

When hearing the Gospel?
Being spiritually dead, we need spiritual POWER given to us to know what is needed to know to be saved.

Then explain to me why God's grace is so ineffective with the majority of the people in the world. Why was it impossible for them to believe and repent when Jesus said everything is possible with God? It seems to me God's ineffectual grace just makes it more impossible for most to believe. Some divine favor is your idea of His grace. God needs to upgrade his kindness.

 

[Rufus]

Excellent proofs because these people were only mere generations from the Apostles and would have proper Biblical understanding than Augustine would have had.

What unmitigated nonsense! So, were all the false prophets, false teachers, false preachers and false shepherds "only mere generations from the Apostles"! So, what is you point, again? As I posted once: 24 of the 26 NT books contain warnings about such people -- and all those books were written in the first century! And false gospels still abound today in this dark, forlorn world!

 

[HeIsHere]

The flesh versus the spirit is at the heart of the matter at hand.

When you abandon Augustine's unfounded view of the flesh based on his own heretical beliefs and pagan life, then, it will be the heart of the matter.

 

[Rufus]

ok ... if you have questions about something someone else said, you should ask them.





To clear up any misunderstanding. Communicating in an open forum through words typed is a little more difficult than if we were sitting in a kitchen with open bibles.





No, I do not question that faith is a precious gift from God. Everything we are and have is a precious gift from God.

I do believe all mankind has faith ... and we either believe truth or lies. the more lies we believe, the worse off we are. Atheists believe there is no God ... pagans believe in many gods ...

If/When we hear Scripture or read Scripture and believe what we hear or read, God strengthens that little kernel of faith He so graciously placed within mankind.

We can be weak in faith or strong in faith ... the more we know of God's Word, the stronger our faith becomes because God gives increase. I do not believe we get more and more and more faith ... I believe God causes our faith to get stronger and stronger.

When the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ is revealed, a person can either believe or suppress the truth in unrighteousness. When a person believes, he or she is born again.

That's just how I see this issue, Rufus ... and please note that it is God Who births Holy Spirit within the believer ... it is God Who strengthens our faith ... it is God Who matures the believer from babe in Christ to eating the meat of the Word to eating strong meat and having spiritual insight and discernment. We do not strengthen our own faith ... God does, so I am ever so thankful to Him that He gives us His Word to believe ... that He strengthens faith within each time His truth is believed ... that is all God ... the person utilizing that which God has provided is not the person "saving him or herself" ... do you think you're better than anyone else just because you breathe or think ??? ... but if we believe something God has written ... or believe God's Word when someone witnesses to us ... all of a sudden that's making God's Will subservient to ours? ridiculous!
.

So, why did you ask whether faith is a gift or not?

 

[Magenta]

The flesh versus the spirit is at the heart of the matter at hand.

Do you know that some of them do not even know what they push for?

So, why did you ask whether faith is a gift or not?

When FWers believe they have produced their own faith from the flesh, they cannot see it as a gift.

They refuse to. It detracts from their vain man-exalting doctrine.

 

[Hakawaka]

You honestly believe this is how I would answer such a question?

Nah you wouldnt answer it that way. You would answer it the biblical way but then keep that TULIP framework in your mind.

"Im gonna repeat this and if he believes it hes one of the chosen frozen"

Wheres waldo?

 

[Hakawaka]

“But what your bolded statement above does not say is that God wills or has decreed that everyone be saved! “

yes you and some others do that constantly you avoid what it says and then say “ bit it doesn’t say these exact words that I’m saying “ …. Constant creations of straw men to distract from what’s there

“For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“ it doesn’t say all men without exception “

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“ it doesn’t say all creation without exception and they can’t hear it unless they are chosen “ ….. it’s not a fruitful situation to use one’s time spinning corcle and playing word games musical chairs

“My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: and he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭2:1-2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

a ot he o ly died for those who are als ready saved not the world “ …. Never gets anywhere because no one accepts the information that’s actually there

Thats how the devil likes to do things. Take verses that CAN be interpreted in another way, like the calvinist proof texts that can be explained thru foreknowledge as Romans 8:29 and 1 Peter 1:2 confirms and twist them to fit the TULIP interpretative grid.

Then take CLEAR CUT VERSES like 1 Tim 2:4 that EVERYONE can understand, some of the simplest verses in the Bible that only a theologian could fail to understand and twist them as well to fit the TULIP grid.

 

[Rufus]

Amen and remember that hell wasn't even created for humans to begin with

Matthew 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

But could there be a more appropriate place for the seed of the Serpent to spend all eternity? Besides...those lost souls love their spiritual daddy, so they would want to stay very close to him, I would imagine.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The flesh versus the spirit is at the heart of the matter at hand.

Amen and our choice of which to follow and serve

“Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Cameron143]

When you abandon Augustine's unfounded view of the flesh based on his own heretical beliefs and pagan life, then, it will be the heart of the matter.

I've never read Augustine on the subject.