Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
- Thread starter LifelongLearner
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Lol, it is you who conflates the physically dead with the spiritually dead as though they are one and the same.
Sure, but it still has relevance. He is dead. The invisible things of God are known by the things that are seen.
It is truly sad that we have believers today that minimize the story of Lazarus to try to "prove" to us that we can't see/hear nor believe the Gospel. TRULY SAD.
And the true GLORY that the Lord Jesus Christ is foreshadowing through Lazarus is lost. It just becomes a "proof text" for the calvies.
Is that why you tell people to go preach in cemeteries? You are so confused. Spiritually dead
people are spoken of and you repeatedly mock the idea as if there were corpses walking around.
So it is obvious that you conflate spiritually dead with being physically dead.
You and some of your cronies here. Your discernment is about zero.
Y'all don't even see the very thing you do.
From ChatGPT:
You said:
What biblical evidence is there that Lazarus was saved before he became sick and died?
ChatGPT said:
The Bible does not explicitly say whether Lazarus (the brother of Mary and Martha, John 11) was "saved" before he became sick and died, but several passages give strong indications about his spiritual state and relationship with Jesus:
1. Jesus’ Love for Lazarus
- John 11:3, 5 – “So the sisters sent to him, saying, ‘Lord, he whom you love is ill.’ … Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus.”
- Jesus’ love for Lazarus is highlighted multiple times, implying a close personal relationship. In biblical context, Jesus’ love often reflects a covenantal and salvific relationship (cf. John 13:1; John 15:9).
- John 11:11 – “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.”
- Jesus calls Lazarus “our friend.” In John 15:14-15, Jesus says, “You are my friends if you do what I command you.” While not proof by itself, the title “friend” often implies discipleship.
- Martha’s Confession of Faith – John 11:21-27 shows Martha’s belief that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God.
- While this explicitly records Martha’s faith, it suggests the household was one of faith and hospitality toward Jesus (cf. Luke 10:38-42, where Mary listens to Jesus’ teaching). Lazarus likely shared in this household faith environment.
- John 11:4 – “This illness does not lead to death. It is for the glory of God, so that the Son of God may be glorified through it.”
- This indicates Lazarus’ death served a divine purpose rather than judgment. Often in Scripture, those who experience suffering “for God’s glory” are believers (e.g., John 9:3).
- The Jews who mourned Lazarus said, “See how he loved him!” (John 11:36). While not conclusive, this reinforces that Lazarus was known as one loved by Jesus.
He was already alive. But sleeping aka physical death like this little girl. Jesus woke him up and did a renovation and re-installation.
[Luk 8:52 NKJV] 52 Now all wept and mourned for her; but He said, "Do not weep; she is not dead, but sleeping."
probably studies the Bible instead of explaining the Bible
“For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.”
1 Peter 4:6 KJV
“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: and whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?”
John 11:25-26
“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
John 5:28-29 KJV
“For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.”
Romans 14:9
brother it isn’t a weakness to learn a new thing or acknowledge we had something not quite right it’s a strength.
No ones dead to God yet some are dead to us but not to him
“For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.”
Luke 20:38
Whether a person is living or dead Jesus is thier lord and they will hear him and rise up from thier slumber
“all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth;
they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
Don't forget Jesus said to Martha before awakening Lazarus that Lazarus would rise again and Martha said yes at the Resurrection.
This indicates Lazarus is Saved.
It's just more evidence that in having no idea what you believe, they are more than happy to mock and misrepresent it.
Im pretty sure the rising of Lazarus has nothing to do with the free will or God's will debate. For either side.
Jesus waited that long so there could be no confusion. It wasent like some guy passed out from heat stroke. He was bloated stinky and in the tomb. Heck after that long flies might have been on him. It was done that way so people would believe the signs that God was amoung them. So the word of what Jesus was doing would spread throughout the land to the glory of God.
How far down the rabbit hole are we gonna go here?
Jesus waited that long so there could be no confusion. It wasent like some guy passed out from heat stroke. He was bloated stinky and in the tomb. Heck after that long flies might have been on him. It was done that way so people would believe the signs that God was amoung them. So the word of what Jesus was doing would spread throughout the land to the glory of God.
How far down the rabbit hole are we gonna go here?
But what your bolded statement above does not say is that God wills or has decreed that everyone be saved! And that was my point in my last post to you. Thank you for affirming that for me.
And, by the way, God's intentions in his salvation is even revealed in what YOU wrote. God intends to save all those who have faith and He intends to condemn all who don't. (A synonym for "intend" is purpose for your info.) You make much ado about nothing.
Do you suppose that God is capable of making the distinction between those that want to believe but cannot and those who do not want to believe?
Not if someone actually jumped into the water and pulled him out first! Your god is either a coward or he doesn't like to get is feet wet. He'd rather play it safe and keep his distance from the water, right?
