Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[BillyBob]

The bogus dogma of the determinists is effortlessly debunked.
Unfortunately, it is equally easy for them to deny the truth.

Don't worry! Your unbelievable streak of being in error continues to get longer each day. . . .

 

[Jordon]

And what is the devil's lie you are referring to?

there's to many to count, but yeah the free willers have many they've been deceived by.

It's a bit of a sticky when you can't even answer a simple question.

 

[Rufus]

What does that even mean? How can a person have another person's faith? Faith is being persuaded by and putting confidence in something someone says, in this particular case, the gospel.

In the same way a person can have another person's righteousness.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

In the same way a person can have another person's righteousness.

You don't have another person's righteousness. You have been credited with Christ's righteousness and you learn to walk in his righteousness and be conformed to his image as you obey his voice.

 

[Rufus]

You should be ashamed. Ashamed of your false doctrine regarding Mary and the Holy Spirit.
The incident of 2 Samuel 11-12 (rape of Bathsheba) proves conclusively the contrary.

In this situation, Uriah is a type of Adam, Bathsheba a type of Eve, David a type of Satan.
Uriah had to make a fateful CHOICE to "save" his FORMERLY "clean" and innocent wife Bathsheba.....by sacrificing himself.

All of this utterly destroys @Rufus' aberrant views of Adam as well.

Neither of you understand any of this of course. And I doubt that you ever will. Too bad so sad.

2Sa 11:27
And when the mourning was past, David sent and fetched her to his house, and she became his wife, and bare him a son. But the thing that David had done displeased the LORD.

2Sa 12:9
Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in his sight? thou hast killed Uriah the Hittite with the sword, and hast taken his wife to be thy wife, and hast slain him with the sword of the children of Ammon.

If my views of Adam are "aberrant" then how would you characterize the bible's totally negative commentary on Adam?

And by the way, you don't have the first clue on what Typology is about. The types are found in the OT and their antitypes are always found in the NT.

 

[Jordon]

You don't have another person's righteousness. You have been credited with Christ's righteousness and you learn to walk in his righteousness and be conformed to his image as you obey his voice.

yep that's right but the free willers have mans righteousness exalted way to high.

You'll catch on to Rufus eventually, so you've joined a debate it's called ludicrously verses madness from the free willers, so Rufus is speaking there madness to you

 

[Rufus]

You don't have another person's righteousness. You have been credited with Christ's righteousness and you learn to walk in his righteousness and be conformed to his image as you obey his voice.

You're playing a bad game of semantics. Righteousness is a divine gift given to God's elect. Through the obedience of one man, the many were made righteous. So, yes, I have my Lord's righteousness imputed to my soul. By His merits, I am as righteous as He is! And since you don't believe this about yourself, it's very likely you're a stranger to God's grace.

 

[BillyBob]

You're playing a bad game of semantics. Righteousness is a divine gift given to God's elect. Through the obedience of one man, the many were made righteous. So, yes, I have my Lord's righteousness imputed to my soul. By His merits, I am as righteous as He is! And since you don't believe this about yourself, it's very likely you're a stranger to God's grace.

You are correct. I wise man once said:
A tree is alive, not because it produces fruit, but it produces fruit because it is alive. The fruit is the evidence of life, but not the source of life.

 

[Rufus]

Judas was chosen for service he failed.
All are welcome to believe in Christ Jesus and receive the gift of salvation but some do not believe in Christ Jesus for salvation.

Actually, Judas was chosen so that scripture would be fulfilled!

John 17:12
12 While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe by that name you gave me. None has been lost except the one doomed to destruction so that Scripture would be fulfilled.
NIV

Judas was eternally destined for destruction and he played the role God assigned to him on the divine world stage perfectly -- to a tee --and willingly, once again demonstating the compatibility of the divine will with the human will. When Jesus chose Judas to be one of his 12, the Lord was fully aware that He chose a devil (Jn 6:70-71).

 

[BillyBob]

Actually, Judas was chosen so that scripture would be fulfilled!

John 17:12
12 While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe by that name you gave me. None has been lost except the one doomed to destruction so that Scripture would be fulfilled.
NIV

Judas was eternally destined for destruction and he played the role God assigned to him on the divine world stage perfectly -- to a tee --and willingly, once again demonstating the compatibility of the divine will with the human will. When Jesus chose Judas to be one of his 12, the Lord was fully aware that He chose a devil (Jn 6:70-71).

 

[Rufus]

Then why does anyone have to do anything if they are already saved?

Because that's how any professing believer knows (made aware of, conscious of) whether or not he has been called by God into a personal, intimate, loving, covenantal relationship with Him.

 

[BillyBob]

Isn't it amazing how God is allowed to chose someone for destruction but cannot chose people to be saved?

 

[Rufus]

Something?
The universe belongs to God!

Stop making excuses.

And, you are making excuses.

Spiritual laziness destroys potential.

Which means God has every right to do as He wills with all the inhabitants of his universe that He owns.

 

[Rufus]

The Bible tells us that every created human being has been given a measure of Faith.

This is why Romans 1 says when God manifested Himself to them [(THEY {{CHOSE NOT TO CLAIM HE IS GOD}})].

God gave those who reject Him a measure of Faith just like God gives those who believes in Him a measure of Faith. But in Romans 1 Paul writes they KNOW GOD, and you can only know who God is because God gave them a measure of Faith, but they REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE that God is God.

So just saying believers get a measure of Faith is calling God a liar because to know God is God but to refuse acknowledging that God is God can only happen because they can believe in God, but instead they reject God.

So Paul proves Free Will multiple times.

You literally have to call God a liar to claim Free Will doesn't exist in all natural man when God gives all natural man a measure of Faith!

That is a lie; for which you will find zero scriptural support.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

You're playing a bad game of semantics. Righteousness is a divine gift given to God's elect. Through the obedience of one man, the many were made righteous. So, yes, I have my Lord's righteousness imputed to my soul. By His merits, I am as righteous as He is! And since you don't believe this about yourself, it's very likely you're a stranger to God's grace.

Future tense. Many shall be made righteous, not were made righteous. We aren't made righteous until the resurrection

For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. Romans 5:19​

 

[posthuman]

What happens if a person becomes saved and then decides to live like he wants without regard to what God wants?

 

[posthuman]

If my views of Adam are "aberrant" then how would you characterize the bible's totally negative commentary on Adam?

totally negative?

he is the first recorded to hear and believe the gospel, perhaps the only human ever to not be deceived, and he is specifically called a type of Christ - - this seems pretty positive to me!

 

[Rufus]

Future tense. Many shall be made righteous, not were made righteous. We aren't made righteous until the resurrection

For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. Romans 5:19​

Look at Rom 5:18. If you are not righteous in Christ right now, you are most definitely hell-bound. Only the righteous go to heaven when they die, and heaven is but an intermediary pit stop between this life and the eternal, visible Kingdom of God on earth.

 

[cv5]

Don't worry! Your unbelievable streak of being in error continues to get longer each day. . . .

Have you noticed that the Reformed crew are hopelessly biblically illiterate?
I mean that is their primary and defining trait.

In stark contrast to someone like @studier ....

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Look at Rom 5:18. If you are not righteous in Christ right now, you are most definitely hell-bound. Only the righteous go to heaven when they die, and heaven is but an intermediary pit stop between this life and the eternal, visible Kingdom of God on earth.

Romans 5:18 says declared righteous, not made righteous. You clearly don't undertand the faith. Righteousness is a hope that we wait for through faith; it's not the present reality. Through faith we walk in Christ's righteousness until we are clothed with an incorruptible righteous body at the resurrection

For we by spirit of faith await the hope of righteousness. Galatians 5:5​