Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Rufus]

It is mind-blowing how many Scriptures they contradict and outright deny. They boast in men. Just bizarre!

1 Corinthians 3 v 19-21a, 1 Corinthians 1 v 19 ~ The wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness.” And again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile.” Therefore, stop boasting in men. For it is written: “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”

Well...you gotta give FWers this: They have this huge love affair with themselves. They think they're the center of the universe.

 

[Rufus]

Yes, Adam's faith was in himself, not God, just as is the FWers. Because of the choice he made, all creation fell into
corruption, except man, according to the free will crowd, who howl against the fact that man is in fact corrupted.

Hah...faith in SELF! That sounds like something the seed of the serpent would relish and glory in.

 

[Mem]

All you lowlife Cinderellas can't go to the ball, even though the ball was specifically orchestrated in order to find you! And even if the slipper fits perfectly, it won't stop the evil stepsisters from trying to cram their feet in it.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The gospel is the power of salvation for those who believe. That last part gets left off so often over
and over again by free willing folks, even after being corrected multiple times. I am glad you agree
it is Jesus Who gives us understanding. And that it is Him Who makes us free... not some philosophically
based self-exalting precept erroneously raised to the level of Bible doctrine, as if it were.

“The gospel is the power of salvation for those who believe. That last part gets left off so often over over again by free willing folks, even after being corrected multiple times”

not really no

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The gospel is preached to all creation and the ones who believe will them as a result of believing be saved. In other words the gospel is the power of god for salvation to everyone who believes it as it’s preached to the world .

“it is Jesus Who gives us understanding. And that it is Him Who makes us free... “

yeah if we believe the gospel he does . Ot was Jesus who accomplished the gospel then sent it to us for salvation .

“And that it is Him Who makes us free..”

yeah he does if we believe him lol

“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

But many reject what he said will save them make them free ….and then say “he’s gonna magically do it because I’m a chosen one but what he said isn’t true I don’t need to continue in his word and know the truth and be set free “

If we accept the gospel and if we don’t will determine the end

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”
‭‭John‬ ‭12:48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Magenta]

1 Timothy 6 v 3-5, and from 2 Corinthians 11 v 13 ~ If anyone teaches another doctrine and disagrees with the sound words of our Lord Jesus Christ and with godly teaching, he is conceited and understands nothing. Instead, he has an unhealthy interest in controversies and disputes about words, out of which come envy, strife, abusive talk, evil suspicions, and constant friction between men of depraved mind who are devoid of the truth. These men regard godliness as a means of gain. Such men are deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ.

 

[Rufus]

I'd say that "FREE WILL" is a necessary attribute of human life. Also it's a "Given" that Jesus SIN OFFERING (Isa 53:10) is completely sufficent for all humans.

The only REAL QUESTION is whether all humans HAVE (are given) THE OPTION to become Born again at some point in their lives, or whether CONVICTION OF SIN is not given to some (the question of "election".

My "time of decision" came when I was 20, and i could have turned it down if I had chosen to.

I surrendered, and repented.

I couldn't. I was graciously compelled to repent and believe the gospel per the Parable of the Banquet (Lk 14). I think God kinda knew that He had to save me from myself!

 

[Rufus]

Rufus.... you should have stuck with "Walking the Dog" and not wandered to where you now find yourself.

I still love that song!
Used to play it in a band in my younger years as I watched all the energized dancers on the floor.

Loved those years!

Give me one example in scripture wherein God's grace (favor) failed to accomplish a positive result. How many of Jesus' gracious miracles failed?

You not only have an extremely low view of God (due to your inordinate high view of yourself), but your view is just as corrupt re his grace. You do not see His grace as being supernatural power which He exerts on his elect.

 

[Magenta]

I couldn't. I was graciously compelled to repent and believe the gospel per the Parable
of the Banquet (Lk 14). I think God kinda knew that He had to save me from myself!

My flesh did not conjure up the fear of God. Isaiah 11:2 describes it as from the Holy Spirit.

 

[Blain]

When dire persecution arises the Biblical mandate is to flee. However, when the evil ones are firing up the ovens, fighting for your life and the life of your family may mean taking up arms and making a defense.

If did not already know, the earthy saints are literally engaged in armed warfare against the AC and his armies so noted in Revelation. Years of armed warfare in fact.

Yes the saints are armed against the antichrist however that is not the same as being armed against each other

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Nobody starts out as a believer. The whole world is blinded. Why do people deny this? Oh. Satan.

The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

It would be impossible to believe something we haven’t heard no one believes the gospel before they hear it and no one rejects it before they hear it

The order is 1 preach the gospel to everyone

2 whoever believes shall be …

3 whoever doesn’t believe shall be …

we couldn’t believe the gospel until it was fulfilled and preached to all creation that’s what Paul’s saying in Roman’s ten

faith comes from the preaching of the gospel we can’t believe anything if we haven’t heard about it before but when we hear something then we can believe or disbelieve it

to be a believer or a non believer one has to hear or see the object or subject of the proposed belief

I couldn’t say I believe the gospel of I didint know what it was and couldn’t say I don’t believe the gospel until I heard what it was

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Yes the saints are armed against the antichrist however that is not the same as being armed against each other

“But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Rosemaryx]

Yes, Adam's faith was in himself, not God, just as is the FWers. Because of the choice he made, all creation fell into
corruption, except man, according to the free will crowd, who howl against the fact that man is in fact corrupted.

Genesis 3:9
Then the LORD God called to Adam and said to him, “Where are you?”
We see here even towards Adam that it was God who sought Adam...
Salvation belongs to God Psalm 3:8
All good things comes from the Father of Lights Amen

 

[Pilgrimshope]

My flesh did not conjure up the fear of God. Isaiah 11:2 describes it as from the Holy Spirit.

“The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: And the knowledge of the holy is understanding.”
‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭9:10‬ ‭

 

[cv5]

I should have read further before replying to see you'd already had the same thought that I just posted.

Don't have time to elaborate, but the actual idea for "narrow" is actually "established". God ESTABLISHED BELIEF as the "path" that He SECURED for salvation.

Which is a direct refutation of Calvinism when fully understood.

Word Origin: [akin to the base of G5147 (τρίβος - paths)]

Overview
The term behind Strong’s Greek 5147 appears three times in the New Testament, each within the Synoptic Gospels’ description of John the Baptist’s ministry. It denotes a roadway or path that has been beaten down by use, suggesting an established track that allows sure and unimpeded passage. This imagery provides a vivid metaphor for spiritual preparation for the coming Messiah.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Genesis 3:9
Then the LORD God called to Adam and said to him, “Where are you?”
We see here even towards Adam that it was God who sought Adam...
Salvation belongs to God Psalm 3:8
All good things comes from the Father of Lights Amen

Where did the gospel come from ?

“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

salvation is offered to all mankind in the gospel by God

 

[Blain]

“But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Yes precisely this verse speaks on this issue very well.

 

[cv5]

Yes the saints are armed against the antichrist however that is not the same as being armed against each other

Of course. I never intended otherwise. Nevertheless wise men and scribes refute heresies when necessary.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Yes agree this has been repeated often to the "inability" clan many times over many years.



But if we simply understand that faith is closely tied to the concept of "trust in" and the call and the condition is clearly set out by God throughout scripture we can see Augustine clearly overstepped in his view of fallen nature and St. Thomas Aquinas by far had the better understanding of scripture and the effect of the fall on mankind.

Thank you for this elaboration.

Correct, however the "inability group" follow the philosophy of Augustine via their local pastor so that a person's will, emotions and intellect are totally corrupted at the fall, affecting man in such a way he cannot respond positively from birth to the message in the Good News and therefore each person God has who is pre-selected will receive a special unique divine illumination/ regeneration so that they then can believe.

This of course is not taught in scripture.

“Yes agree this has been repeated often to the "inability" clan many times over many years.”

Do you see how if I’m not able …..then I can’t be held responsible ?

 

[Blain]

Of course. I never intended otherwise. Nevertheless wise men and scribes refute heresies when necessary.

Yes we are to refute heresies when necessary the issue is when we do it the wrong way
And some come here with a sword already in hand because they are used to such an attitude from debates.

But we must refute heresies in the correct way also it is important that fruits of the spirit be shown

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights,
who does not change like shifting shadows. People need to learn how to harmonize verses.
Otherwise we are left being told salvation is not a gift from God, which is pretty inane.

James 1:17-20 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath: For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.

Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth. That deserved underlining.

The reason I did not underline what you want underlined was because I was emphasizing that we are to be "swift to hear" and "slow to speak" and "slow to wrath: for the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God".

Background concerning the situation ...

Magenta submitted a verse of Scripture in one of her panels and I explained the verse.

Instead of discussing the verses submitted, the response from Magenta was "Nothing is nothing... except to those who pervert the Word of God. Paul says such people are conceited and understand nothing."

So, Cameron143 ... that is the reason I underlined the words I underlined ... and, hopefully, Magenta will utilize John 3:27 appropriately rather than hold it up as some sort of proof text for a meaning never intended by the Author of Scripture.

Another reason I did not underline the words you want underlined was because I believe Magenta is already begotten of God ... however, she may prove that I am mistaken by her continued unwillingness to consider verses of Scripture within the context the Author of Scripture has placed them and instead manipulates a verse here, a verse there without any comprehension that the verses do not support what she claims ...

You had absolutely no right to analyze text which was not underlined! @reneweddaybyday intended to post the following:

James 1:17-20 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath: For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.

please re-read my post, BillyBob ... I did not strike out the words you want struck out ... and I have every right to underline the text I underlined based upon the response I received when I provided information relating to the meaning of John 3:27.


For full understanding of the situation:

See my post Post 6730 ... and Magenta's reply at Post 6732. ... and my reply at Post 6744 which contains the verse of Scripture which offends BillyBob and Cameron143 because I didn't strike out something BillyBob wanted struck out ... or I didn't underline something Cameron143 wanted underlined.

And please note ... none of you has refuted what I explained to Magenta concerning John 3:27 ... instead, you all provide ample proof that you all need to be "swift to hear" and "slow to speak" and "slow to wrath: for the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God".

Maybe you all need to re-read all the posts submitted by Blain concerning the behavior in this thread ...

Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.
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