Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
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That is not a judicial basis for anyone's salvation. Since you believe that God just carte blanche saves all infants, babies, children, etc., then what would be His judicial basis for doing that since all of us come into this world born in Adam.
Are you saying the saints wont be able to sin in the last stage of this process aka eternally with God?
According to the Bible: Having a belief in the gospel message and His Word (the Bible) is the same thing as having the faith in such things. Lets look at Scripture to see what I am referring to.
Romans 5:2 KJV
"By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God."
1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures.
Mark 1:15 KJVAnd saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel."
Romans 10:16–17 (KJV)But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Notice carefully that we have access to God's grace by faith according to Romans 5:2.
Calvinists seem to think we have access to God's grace in Election or Predestination. Meaning they see the order like this:
Grace → Regeneration → Faith → Justification → Sanctification. But Romans 5:2 says we have ACCESS to God's grace by faith.
Anyway, getting back to my main point:
1 Corinthians 15:1-2, and Mark 1:15 tie in "the gospel" with the word "believed" or "believe" (i.e., a belief).
Yet, in Romans 10:16, it ties in those who have not obeyed the gospel with the word "faith" in verse 17.
So Scripture ties a belief in the gospel, and faith in the gospel.
Nowhere does the Bible say that faith and belief in the gospel are two different concepts.
The word "faith" and "believe" are simply synonyms. They are saying the same thing.
Side Note:
Some Calvinists do not really believe in Sanctification because they are hardcore sin and still be saved salvationists. Granted, this does not reflect the view of all Calvinists (of course).
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God opens wombs and gives life. Human nature was corrupted by sin. God could have done things differently. He chose to save men, make them partakers of the divine nature, and remake them into the image of His Son.So God creates imperfect souls, I see.
All through the scriptures if you look. People are being judged for what they do, not what God fails to do.
If salvation has no call upon our lives whatsoever and is purely God's choice who to save? Then what sort of God won't even fulfill His own desires yet expects us to believe Him when He says He will give to us all our desires if we delight in Him?
That is one very confused god.
So...no level field doctrine. Which is correct. How did God level the field for all those who never heard the gospel? He of course didn't.
He created Adam's body and soul and breathed into him life. Not necessary for the rest of humanity. We are conceived and inherit all that he had.
Man became a living soul when God breathed the breath of life into him. (Genesis 2 v 7)
Not all are going to make it. Matthew 13:41-42 says the Son of man (JESUS) will send forth his angels and gather out of HIS Kingdom all who offend and who do iniquity (sin) and they will be cast into the furnace of fire (the Lake of Fire). This confirmed even more if you read John 8:34-35. Meaning, the servant of sin will not abide in the house of Christ forever. So a believer can be cast out of the Kingdom if they later decide to justify sin. So nothing is forced upon you. God is not forcing you to obey Him anymore than He is forcing you to believe. That is insanity. Otherwise all the verses in the Bible that refer to God desiring men to believe is just a sham.
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I was simply making the point that soul did not precede the breath of life being breathed into Adam's physical body.
I forgot to include "God's grace" before "Regeneration," which they see as Election or Predestination. This is the general order of salvation (ordo salutis) in Calvinism (the standard classic version). So the standard Calvinist order is:
God's grace → Regeneration → Faith → Justification → Sanctification.
As for folks here:
Well, I think you may have Calvinists who hold to some classic form of Calvinism, and yet others here are subscribing to something less orthodox to actual classic Calvinists (although they may hold to the 5 points of TULIP in general). But you are right. Many here appear to be very vague about their beliefs here (which to me is very puzzling).
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Doubt it seeing as he can't recognise his own failings as evil, like saying I'll wait for an apology from God before i apologise for condemning a Christian to hell.Hmm...maybe he doesn't believer there's such an animal as an evildoer either.
Not necessarily. The soul wasn't alive until the breath came. It could still have been present but not animated.
still kicking against your goad,
The very fact that you just demote grace to mean absolutely nothing to people that constantly reassure people all can be saved by his enabling grace shows how little respect you have for his word and his children.
Mr. Genez, you still haven't come up with any biblical proof for your latest lame theory of the creation of TWO (2) new heavens and two new earths? You Dispens are a real piece of work! Dichotomizing the bible is your specialty, isn't it?
Let me help you out some because you're more ignorant of the scriptures that I even imagined: First, Peter wrote:
2 Peter 3:13
13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, the home of righteousness.
NIV
Peter clearly taught that there will be ONE new heaven and one new earth, with ONE home of righteousness. He certainly didn't believe in multiple recreations.
Then John wrote:
Rev 21:1
21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
NIV
So, here we are very close to the end of the story to God's redemptive plan for mankind, and John is seeing the new creation that followed the FIRST. So tell me, Einstein, whatever happened to the second heaven and the second earth? If they are legit, they certainly should appear in the last book of the bible. AND...if there are two new recreations, then why didn't John write that he saw the first two heavens and first two earths pass away?
And Paul wrote:
Rom 8:18-22
18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 The creation waits in eager expectation for the sons of God to be revealed. 20 For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time.
NIV
So, tell me, Mr. bible expert, at which new creation (2nd or 3rd) will the creation be liberated from its bondage and decay? And at which creation will the sons of God be revealed (2nd or 3rd)?
And finally, Luke wrote:
Acts 3:20-21
20 and that he may send the Christ, who has been appointed for you — even Jesus. 21 He must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.
NIV
So Jesus "must remain in heaven" until THE TIME (not until the times come) for God to restore everything. Well...if God restores EVERYTHING at a particular point in time, why would He have to restore everything again? God's plan failed? How come plan A didn't work out for God? And how can there be two distinct, separate restorations when Jesus only leaves heaven to restore everything once? Does Jesus ascend back into heaven after the first failed restoration? And then He returns again? If so, this passage is very misleading, since it speaks to only one restoration...of EVERYTHING. Or does God "send the Christ" from the first failed restoration to the 2nd restoration?
Let me help you out some because you're more ignorant of the scriptures that I even imagined: First, Peter wrote:
2 Peter 3:13
13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, the home of righteousness.
NIV
Peter clearly taught that there will be ONE new heaven and one new earth, with ONE home of righteousness. He certainly didn't believe in multiple recreations.
Then John wrote:
Rev 21:1
21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
NIV
So, here we are very close to the end of the story to God's redemptive plan for mankind, and John is seeing the new creation that followed the FIRST. So tell me, Einstein, whatever happened to the second heaven and the second earth? If they are legit, they certainly should appear in the last book of the bible. AND...if there are two new recreations, then why didn't John write that he saw the first two heavens and first two earths pass away?
And Paul wrote:
Rom 8:18-22
18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 The creation waits in eager expectation for the sons of God to be revealed. 20 For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time.
NIV
So, tell me, Mr. bible expert, at which new creation (2nd or 3rd) will the creation be liberated from its bondage and decay? And at which creation will the sons of God be revealed (2nd or 3rd)?
And finally, Luke wrote:
Acts 3:20-21
20 and that he may send the Christ, who has been appointed for you — even Jesus. 21 He must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.
NIV
So Jesus "must remain in heaven" until THE TIME (not until the times come) for God to restore everything. Well...if God restores EVERYTHING at a particular point in time, why would He have to restore everything again? God's plan failed? How come plan A didn't work out for God? And how can there be two distinct, separate restorations when Jesus only leaves heaven to restore everything once? Does Jesus ascend back into heaven after the first failed restoration? And then He returns again? If so, this passage is very misleading, since it speaks to only one restoration...of EVERYTHING. Or does God "send the Christ" from the first failed restoration to the 2nd restoration?
It is a general failing of these free willing Pelagian heretics.Hmm...maybe he doesn't believer there's such an animal as an evildoer either.