Can Christ disobey the command given by the LORD?

[kleronomos]

Psalm 110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
2 The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.
3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.
6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.
7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.

How would it be possible for there to be a 'pre trib rapture' if Christ can't leave until after Satan is kicked out?

I have been told that some people believe that Christ left to talk to Paul and John, (which I personally don't agree with but understand why someone would need that explanation with all the crazy doctrines) but even those are SO entirely different than what a pre trib rapture would require. So if anyone has a different explanation I would like to hear it.

And if that could be explained, maybe the answer to my other question - if there was a 'pre trib rapture', would it be to go fight the war in heaven?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

If Christ is the Eternal God, the Eternal "I AM," then it would seem illogical that Christ would not follow His own pre-written, Eternal Plan.

John 8:58 NLT - "Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, before Abraham was even born, I AM!"

Ephesians 3:9-12 NLT - "I was chosen to explain to everyone this mysterious plan that God, the Creator of all things, had kept secret from the beginning. God's purpose in all this was to use the church to display his wisdom in its rich variety to all the unseen rulers and authorities in the heavenly places. This was his eternal plan, which he carried out through Christ Jesus our Lord. Because of Christ and our faith in him, we can now come boldly and confidently into God's presence."

 

[LoveBrokeThru]

Psalm 110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.

What you wrote, has happened.

Notice this verse.

Matthew 28. : """ Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me."""

See that?
Jesus is now LORD, vs, "suffering Messiah".
Christ went into the tomb as the slain lamb.
Messiah walked out of the Tomb as the LION.

He's coming back soon as this... 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9.

 

[Nehemiah6]

How would it be possible for there to be a 'pre trib rapture' if Christ can't leave until after Satan is kicked out?

Another tiresome anti-Pre-Tribulation Rapture thread! So here's a response that should shut this down: "WITH GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE!"

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Romans 12:18 NKJV - "If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men."

This includes the intentional demeaning of a specific person.

 

[kleronomos]

What you wrote, has happened.

Notice this verse.

Matthew 28. : """ Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me."""

See that?
Jesus is now LORD, vs, "suffering Messiah".
Christ went into the tomb as the slain lamb.
Messiah walked out of the Tomb as the LION.

He's coming back soon as this... 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9.

Hebrews 2:5 For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
Hebrews 2:6 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man that thou visitest him?
Hebrews 2:7 Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:
Hebrews 2:8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.

 

[kleronomos]

If Christ is the Eternal God, the Eternal "I AM," then it would seem illogical that Christ would not follow His own pre-written, Eternal Plan.

John 8:58 NLT - "Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, before Abraham was even born, I AM!"

Ephesians 3:9-12 NLT - "I was chosen to explain to everyone this mysterious plan that God, the Creator of all things, had kept secret from the beginning. God's purpose in all this was to use the church to display his wisdom in its rich variety to all the unseen rulers and authorities in the heavenly places. This was his eternal plan, which he carried out through Christ Jesus our Lord. Because of Christ and our faith in him, we can now come boldly and confidently into God's presence."

Yes, and both our LORD and Christ are right where they have been since we saw the lamb worthy to open the book. And there He will stay until all enemies made his footstool.

 

[pottersclay]

Psalm 110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
2 The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.
3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.
6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.
7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.

How would it be possible for there to be a 'pre trib rapture' if Christ can't leave until after Satan is kicked out?

I have been told that some people believe that Christ left to talk to Paul and John, (which I personally don't agree with but understand why someone would need that explanation with all the crazy doctrines) but even those are SO entirely different than what a pre trib rapture would require. So if anyone has a different explanation I would like to hear it.

And if that could be explained, maybe the answer to my other question - if there was a 'pre trib rapture', would it be to go fight the war in heaven?

The enimies of the Christ will be drawn into one location surrounding Israel. Where Jesus shall descend splitting the mount of olives. This is whats meant by footstool which means in its simplest form.... under him ...beneath him.

Many such as myself believe in a pre trib rapture because we are not appointed to wrath according to scripture.
Jesus died and forgiveness was given. If we are dead in christ we shall also be raised in Christ. Justified and holy.

 

[kleronomos]

Another tiresome anti-Pre-Tribulation Rapture thread! So here's a response that should shut this down: "WITH GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE!"

Yes, yes it is. YOU KNOW who is tired of them? THOSE who believe in PRE TRIB rapture.

AND YES, ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE EXCEPT FOR HIM TO LIE.


Psalm 12:1 Help, LORD; for the godly man ceaseth; for the faithful fail from among the children of men.

2 They speak vanity every one with his neighbour: with flattering lips and with a double heart do they speak.

3 The LORD shall cut off all flattering lips, and the tongue that speaketh proud things:

4 Who have said, With our tongue will we prevail; our lips are our own: who is lord over us?

5 For the oppression of the poor, for the sighing of the needy, now will I arise, saith the LORD; I will set him in safety from him that puffeth at him.

6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.

7 Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

8 The wicked walk on every side, when the vilest men are exalted.


HIS WORDS ARE PURE. PURIFIED SEVEN TIMES. WE CAN COUNT ON THEM TO BE TRUTH. CONFUSION IS NOT TRUTH. SIMPLICITY IN CHRIST MEANS IT IT SAYS STAY UNTIL IT MEANS STAY UNTIL NOT GO AWAY UNTIL.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Yes, and both our LORD and Christ are right where they have been since we saw the lamb worthy to open the book. And there He will stay until all enemies made his footstool.

I cannot comment on Eschatology, as I admit that I am unlearned on the subject. But as for the Plan of God, things can only turn out one way . . . and that is according to the pre-written Plan, written within the Heavenly Scroll of the Lord. Nothing can thwart this Plan, otherwise, it cannot be the Eternal Plan. "Eternal" implies the inability to fail.

 

[DanielLL]

Psalm 110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.

Yes, "pre-trib" rapture is impossible, Christ would never disobey the Father: "Not my will, but thy Will be done."
You also commented on Paul, making it impossible for Jesus to leave the Hand of the Father and go to the wilderness, If you get what I'm saying. The implications are hugeee my friend.

WITH GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE!

Not "all things" as you are trying to present them. It is not possible for Christ to disobey the Father, because it is not possible for God to disobey Himself, All Three are in Divine Harmony.
A few examples are: it is not possible for God to sin, It is not possible for God to be tempted:

James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

 

[kleronomos]

The enimies of the Christ will be drawn into one location surrounding Israel. Where Jesus shall descend splitting the mount of olives. This is whats meant by footstool which means in its simplest form.... under him ...beneath him.

Many such as myself believe in a pre trib rapture because we are not appointed to wrath according to scripture.
Jesus died and forgiveness was given. If we are dead in christ we shall also be raised in Christ. Justified and holy.

That is correct, we are not appointed to wrath.


SO EXACTLY HOW FAR does one need to be for GODS WRATH to not touch them while at the same time falling on others?


Here is a great example


Numbers 16:26 And he spake unto the congregation, saying, Depart, I pray you, from the tents of these wicked men, and touch nothing of their's, lest ye be consumed in all their sins.

27 So they gat up from the tabernacle of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram, on every side: and Dathan and Abiram came out, and stood in the door of their tents, and their wives, and their sons, and their little children.

28 And Moses said, Hereby ye shall know that the LORD hath sent me to do all these works; for I have not done them of mine own mind.

29 If these men die the common death of all men, or if they be visited after the visitation of all men; then the LORD hath not sent me.

30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.

31 And it came to pass, as he had made an end of speaking all these words, that the ground clave asunder that was under them:

32 And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods.

33 They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation.

34 And all Israel that were round about them fled at the cry of them: for they said, Lest the earth swallow us up also.

35 And there came out a fire from the LORD, and consumed the two hundred and fifty men that offered incense.

36 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

37 Speak unto Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest, that he take up the censers out of the burning, and scatter thou the fire yonder; for they are hallowed.



To you and I TODAY, we stand with Our Lord and Savior and JUST AS THE ground didn't open up or the fire didn't fall upon THEM it will not open up or fire upon us. GOD KNOWS HIS OWN.

WE DON'T GO ANYWHERE TO BE PROTECTED FROM GODS WRATH EXECEPT to the BLOOD OF THE LAMB.

That takes place when we ARE SAVED.

 

[Nehemiah6]

It is not possible for Christ to disobey the Father, because it is not possible for God to disobey Himself,

Who said anything about God disobeying God? You have concocted this out of thin air. I do not plan to waste any time in this thread.

 

[Nehemiah6]

AND YES, ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE EXCEPT FOR HIM TO LIE.

Therefore when Christ said that the Rapture occurs before any Tribulation, why did you doubt Him? So who is the liar -- the one who doubts Christ or the one who believes Him?

 

[DanielLL]

Who said anything about God disobeying God?

He can't leave His Fathers Hand until all His enemies are destroyed in the Great Tribulation, The Sign of the Son of Man is after the Tribulation:

Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

The rapture is actually the last thing that happens.

 

[kleronomos]

Therefore when Christ said that the Rapture occurs before any Tribulation, why did you doubt Him? So who is the liar -- the one who doubts Christ or the one who believes Him?

I WILL NEVER AGAIN SPEAK ABOUT THE PRE TRIB RAPTURE DOCTRINE IF YOU WILL JUST TELL ME WHERE


CHRIST SAID 'the Rapture occurs before any Tribulation"


QUITE THE DECLARATION.

WHO IS THE LIAR? THE ONE WHO DOESN'T BELIEVE WHAT IS WRITTEN BUT INSTEAD CHOOSES TO BELIEVE

THE

"HATH GOD SAID?"


LIKE WHEN GOD SAYS

Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

BUT SATAN TWISTS WITH

Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?


Kinda like TAKING THESE VERSES


2 Thessalonians 1:4 So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;

And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

WHAT DAY ARE WE READING ABOUT??? THE ONE IN WHICH

In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

When he shall come TO BE GLORIFIED IN HIS SAINTS and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:

That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.


WHAT IS THE SUBJECT? THE DAY 'TAKING VENGEANCE'

Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition

and trying to make them say SOMETHING ELSE

 

[Gideon300]

Psalm 110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
2 The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.
3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.
6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.
7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.

How would it be possible for there to be a 'pre trib rapture' if Christ can't leave until after Satan is kicked out?

I have been told that some people believe that Christ left to talk to Paul and John, (which I personally don't agree with but understand why someone would need that explanation with all the crazy doctrines) but even those are SO entirely different than what a pre trib rapture would require. So if anyone has a different explanation I would like to hear it.

And if that could be explained, maybe the answer to my other question - if there was a 'pre trib rapture', would it be to go fight the war in heaven?

Lord Jesus is in heaven right now. Lord Jesus has given the Church the authority and power to deal with Satan. Lord Jesus has already defeated Satan. Our job is to enforce that victory. In Romans 12 we read that Satan, the accuser of the brethren, will be cast down to the earth. When that is done, those who cast Satan down will be raptured.

Those who are left will be the unbelievers, the unconsecrated Christians, those who have let to yield to the Lordship of Christ and those who live for themselves. God gives people another chance to repent. It will not be pleasant for those left behind.

Lord Jesus will destroy Satan when He appears and by the "breath of His mouth." (2 Thessalonians 2:8). The overcomers are those who restrain the lawless one. This they do by engaging in spiritual warfare, binding the enemy of our souls and resisting the devil.

It's part of God's incentive program to get real with Lord Jesus here and now. Some do not take God seriously. They will regret it.

 

[Proverbs_Four]

Psalm 110:1 - "The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool."

This will be fulfilled in Revelation 20:4, 6 . . . the Resurrection of the Old Testament Saints, which is still considered to be a part of the First Resurrection. The Church is taken in Revelation 4.

 

[Oblio]

Jesus said that He only does what He sees the Father doing...I believe Him.

 

[posthuman]

And if that could be explained, maybe the answer to my other question - if there was a 'pre trib rapture', would it be to go fight the war in heaven?

it would be to begin the days of the wedding feast