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Guojing said:
If you begin from 1 peter 1, you will see that, to peter, salvation is always given at the end when Jesus return for Israel

You can also begin from acts 3:19-21 to get that same doctrine from him. Israel sins will only be blotted out during that time of refreshing
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You can have your opinion here, that is fine.
 
Chester said:
I didn't say that, did I? :eek:
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I realized you keep doing this thing where you disagree with my point, and then when I was trying to clarify what you actually meant, you start to backtrack and say you are not disagreeing with me.

Alright then, let’s move on ;)
 
throughfaith said:
Yes we were
' Dying to self 'is not a bible verse found anywhere . However it is found in the new age movement and Hinduism. Again it sounds real preachy in church and is used to guilt trip everyone listening.
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Rom 6
6Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
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Yes. Live that and you will be taking up your cross daily.
 
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Scribe said:
Yes. Live that and you will be taking up your cross daily.
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No . We are transformed by the renewal of our mind . rom 12 ) This is a internal transformation that affects externally ( not the other way round ) . We reckon ourselves as dead to sin . Rom 6 . This is something we ' reckon as true ' this is a truth we trust is true because the bible says so . Rehabilitation is what the world does . Its what we believe that transforms . romans 12 .2
 
Composition. According to the Epistle itself, it was composed by the Apostle Peter, an eyewitness to Jesus' ministry. If 2 Peter 3:1 alludes to 1 Peter, the audience of the epistle is the various Churches in Asia Minor in general (cf. 1 Peter 1:1).
 
throughfaith said:
Eternal security is only during the church age with the Giving of the Holy Spirit which now permanently indwells believers until the Adoption ( rom 8.23 ) David prayed 'not to take the Holy Spirit from him ' because he saw it come and go on Saul . And there are many instances where we see this in other places with others in the OT . No one was ' born again ' and sealed by the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption ( eph 4.30 ) And no one in the OT was baptised into the body of Christ. During the Tribulation no one have the above things stated either. Eternal security is just for the church age . until the rapture .
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Their salvation in teh OT had nothing to do with the coming and going of the holy Spirit but Faith in Gods coming deliever.
Same now.
The Holy Spirit is a helper and a tutor.
Much like the law was the helper and tutor under the old covenant.

The Holy Spirit is not your new birth, it is your conception.
Until Christ is fully formed in you there is reason for concern just like with any pregnancy.
God has given us the context of creation so we might understand, not in the vain imaginings of our own minds but by what God
has revealed of himself and his nature and ways through creation.
 
Scribe said:
Yes. Live that and you will be taking up your cross daily.
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Lion222 said:
Their salvation in teh OT had nothing to do with the coming and going of the holy Spirit but Faith in Gods coming deliever.
Same now.
The Holy Spirit is a helper and a tutor.
Much like the law was the helper and tutor under the old covenant.

The Holy Spirit is not your new birth, it is your conception.
Until Christ is fully formed in you there is reason for concern.
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I'm not sure I follow ?
 
The holy spirit is the "Sperm of God" the seed.
Birth comes later after Christ is formed in you.
It is like walking around in the dark with a lamp for your feet
Until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts. (birth into the light , the fullness of Christ Jesus in you)
 
The salvation work of the holy Spirit is the full formation of Christ in you and you have a role to play in that.
You must abide in the vine, the umbilical...
You must lay aside sin and stay connected to Christ to receive from God what is needed to cause you to grow into likeness of Christ Jesus.
It is either that or die prematurely before ever being born again.
 
Lion222 said:
The holy spirit is the "Sperm of God" the seed.
Birth comes later after Christ is formed in you.
It is like walking around in the dark with a lamp for your feet
Until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts. (birth into the light , the fullness of Christ Jesus in you)
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Woah!, that's new . So this isn't the new birth .Titus 3 5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; ?

1cor12
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
 
throughfaith said:
Are you saying that the adoption ( rom 8.23 ) is when christ is fully formed in us?
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Well adoption rightly means placement as sons, placement in positions of authority over the house, it has nothing to do with adopting you own legitimate son.

The sons of the master with the sons of the slaves, the slaves do not remain in the house forever.
 
Lion222 said:
The salvation work of the holy Spirit is the full formation of Christ in you and you have a role to play in that.
You must abide in the vine, the umbilical...
You must lay aside sin and stay connected to Christ to receive from God what is needed to cause you to grow into likeness of Christ Jesus.
It is either that or die prematurely before ever being born again.
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So Jesus didn't really need to die , be buried and rise again ?
 
throughfaith said:
Woah!, that's new . So this isn't the new birth .Titus 3 5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; ?

1cor12
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
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everything being Gods work still applies.
IF you abide in the vine you are depending on God to bring about a fully formed Christ in you.
 
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