Bread used for Communion
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False. Since symbols signify spiritual realities, they need to be truly representative. Leaven equals sin and corruption, therefore unleavened bread correctly represents the body of Christ, who had no sin and did no sin. The same with unfermented grape juice which would represent the sinless blood of Christ.
Actually according to Christ and according to Paul there would be ONLY ONE bread and ONLY ONE cup of blessing. This too is symbolic of the one Passover Lamb (the Head) and His one Body (the Church). Please note carefully what Paul says: The cup [singular] of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread [singular] which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ? For we being many are one Bread, and one Body: for we are all partakers of that one bread. (1 Cor 10:16,17)
The word "communion" is from the Greek κοινωνία (koinōnia) which means spiritual fellowship. The one cup and one bread speak of fellowship with God and with believers. So this is not only (a) a Remembrance Feast, it is also (b) a Thanksgiving Feast, and it is also a (c) Fellowship Feast. And those symbols are "blessings" -- blessed by God and raised up to God in thanksgiving. Hence the "giving of thanks" (Gk eucharist) is also associated with the Lord's Supper. And he took the cup, and gave thanks [eucharist], and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves:.. And he took bread, and gave thanks [eucharist], and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me. (Lk 22:17,19).
You say false and then you say it's symbolic.
Question: if for some reason the world ran out of grape juice, would you use a substitute or just forever forego communion?
Ok...
As far as unleavened bread goes....
Most of the time I grab plain Matza crackers in the grocery store. Salted but not the onion ones. They aren't as expensive as the little cross stamped wafers....those cost an arm and a leg.
Then use store brand grape juice. (100% grape juice) However we have used the carbonated grape juice...it's not pure grape but it tastes good. Most grape juice is cut with Apple or pear juice because they are even sweeter with no flavor and cheaper than grape juice.
If I couldn't get matzoh I would grab FLOUR tortillas instead. They are closer to
Fresh matzoh than anything else.
Wonder bread? Flatbread for sandwiches? Using the same cup to drink from? Dipping Flatbread into a cup of juice? Prepackaged grapejuice and cracker together for a communion service? (Set up in baskets outside the sanctuary) Seen it all at one time or another.
Sometimes you just wonder what they were thinking.
The elements are not exclusively critical if it's the best that you can do.
But usually I find that when not much effort is made to do this part well the overall teaching and behavior of the congregants is not made from a different level of effort either.
Yeast is a symbol of a populist message.
Grape juice/wine is a symbol of joy.
Oil, honey, salt, all have various things that they mean. Same with the dipping of the bread into the grapejuice (Judas's portion) sure it tastes fine....but....I want nothing to do with him. I just don't.
YMMV.
As far as unleavened bread goes....
Most of the time I grab plain Matza crackers in the grocery store. Salted but not the onion ones. They aren't as expensive as the little cross stamped wafers....those cost an arm and a leg.
Then use store brand grape juice. (100% grape juice) However we have used the carbonated grape juice...it's not pure grape but it tastes good. Most grape juice is cut with Apple or pear juice because they are even sweeter with no flavor and cheaper than grape juice.
If I couldn't get matzoh I would grab FLOUR tortillas instead. They are closer to
Fresh matzoh than anything else.
Wonder bread? Flatbread for sandwiches? Using the same cup to drink from? Dipping Flatbread into a cup of juice? Prepackaged grapejuice and cracker together for a communion service? (Set up in baskets outside the sanctuary) Seen it all at one time or another.
Sometimes you just wonder what they were thinking.
The elements are not exclusively critical if it's the best that you can do.
But usually I find that when not much effort is made to do this part well the overall teaching and behavior of the congregants is not made from a different level of effort either.
Yeast is a symbol of a populist message.
Grape juice/wine is a symbol of joy.
Oil, honey, salt, all have various things that they mean. Same with the dipping of the bread into the grapejuice (Judas's portion) sure it tastes fine....but....I want nothing to do with him. I just don't.
YMMV.
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Locoponydirtman
Guest
Im not going to go back and fourth with you. You think what you think for what ever reason, Ill never convince you other wise, and like wise I will not change my mind.
You are sacramentarian, I am sacramental. This is also why I all for closed communion, it would be syncretism for me to take communion with you or you to take communion with me.
I ask you to consider one thing. Paul said that the Corinthians were taking communion in an unworthy manner because they did not discern the body of Christ and said in doing so they were guilty of the Body and Blood of Christ. Just consider it. No need to reply to me; i already know we disagree. Consider the passage without bias or reasoning, just the passage.
I’m interested in knowing if you’ve gouged out your eyes and severed one of your arms. If you’re going to be literal about Jesus’ words pertaining to Communion then you need to be literal about all of Jesus’ instructions.
GOOD POINT. It seems when one follows the tenants of their particular religion, they are bound by its dogma, instead of the plain teaching of the Bible.
I might be in big trouble here... I'm not even sure what I am!
I think you might be kosher.
According to one rabbinical council in The United States......
Oysters, crabs, lobsters, shellfish and sharks are all non-kosher, but there is a difference between oysters and the others. Oyster shells are rock-hard and so clearly not a food that it is generally accepted that the shell itself is “kosher”; therefore, oyster shells are approved as a (very common) source of kosher calcium. On the other hand, the shells of crabs, lobsters and shellfish, and certainly the cartilage of sharks, are soft and flavorful enough to be given the status of the fish they come from, and are therefore non-kosher
Are "sacramentarians" saved? Are they part of the body of Christ?
I still consider you a Christian brother and would have no problem partaking of the bread and wine with you as we remember the great sacrifice of our Lord and Saviour together. I believe that being born again under and in the Son is what makes us worthy in the eyes of the Father.
This is referring to what we are
feeding on daily in a spiritual sense.
Are we feeding on Christ who is the bread from heaven. Or feeding on the chaff of the world.
Whatever we feed on, it shows in our conversation/how we conduct ourselves.
John 6:58 KJV
….“he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.”
John 6:53 KJV
Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
Partaking at the Lords Table was as He said “in remembrance” of Him.
Not something that gave us life or eternal life,
As He said in verse 54.
John 6:54,56 KJV
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
[56] He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
See that word “dwelleth,” it refers to abiding or continuing.
1 John 3:24 KJV
And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
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Locoponydirtman
Guest
L
Locoponydirtman
Guest
Im not a contortionist. Jesus clarified Himself on the night He broke bread with those who remained with Him.
So why is it your call to refuse them communion?
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Locoponydirtman
Guest
I get it. On the moment Jesus said that many of those who followed left. Even His disciples struggled with His words. So this isnt so foriegn.
I mean many of yall dont even believe what scripture says about baptism either. I Just believe what Jesus said. I domt really care how many of you scoff or make non sequatious analogies.
I mean many of yall dont even believe what scripture says about baptism either. I Just believe what Jesus said. I domt really care how many of you scoff or make non sequatious analogies.
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Locoponydirtman
Guest
Because the meaning of the word communion.
Why would you commune with someone who dont belueve what you believe about what is going on.
I don't remember anything in the New Testament that teaches that it's the responsibility of the overseers or anyone else to decide who gets to take part in communion. It says each person should examine themself and make their own decision. If you want to participate in a system that advocates what you're saying that's you're business, but it's not Biblical.
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Locoponydirtman
Guest
Would you marry someone who dont believe what you believe about marriage?
So why would you commune with someone who dont believe what you believe about communion. Being i believe its a blood covenant, i certainly to want to share that with someone who dont believe that.