Bible Vs Scientism

[MichaelBoll]

The Bible teaches us that God created the heaven, the earth, the sea, and everything in them in six days - and then rested on the seventh. This occurred a little over 6000 years ago. I believe this, because God's written word is my ultimate authority.

Science is a process... an investigation and collection of raw data. Science doesn't actually "say" anything - as the common idiom "science says" indicates. Science is only the collection of the data itself. Then flawed human beings interpret that data in many different ways. Those interpretations are not science itself, but conclusions based on the data which was collected via the scientific process. Those conclusions come complete with personal biases, and much conjecture and speculation.

Scientism is a blind belief in those INTERPRETATIONS/CONCLUSIONS.

For example, we know through science that there are lights in the sky that appear to move over the earth in repeated patterns. It is not science itself, but the interpretations/conclusions/speculations of flawed men which tell us that those lights are giant fireballs in a vast vacuum, that they are moving away from us, and that this movement means that they were at one time all squished together into a hot, dense ball of energy. And Scientism is the faith-based belief IN those interpretations.

So the cult of Scientism (not science itself) claims that our world began as an explosion/expansion of a singularity about 14 billion years ago. The Bible teaches that our world began as a six day creative action taken by God... about 6000 years ago.

Which of those is the truth?

 

[pottersclay]

6000 yrs seem right to me. In fact it fits in to Gods time frame.

 

[SomeDisciple]

So the cult of Scientism (not science itself) claims that our world began as an explosion/expansion of a singularity about 14 billion years ago.

The age number keeps getting older too; really, scientism's claim, is that the earth and the universe are as old as whatever they say at any given time. It's however old they need it to be to fit their theories. So... my vote is definitely not for the 14 billion, because even the scientists are gonna make that number bigger soon enough.

 

[Magenta]

Welcome!

 

[Melach]

whats the difference between the number christians invented and scientists invented? both guess work in my opinion

the bible doesnt say the exact age of the earth. if it does somewhere point me the verse(s) i stand corrected.

 

[DavidTree]

Are we on a ball spinning thru space and the stars all spinning and everything excelerating away from each other in a spiral spin???

Can we actually observe this or is this the production of satanists/globalists?

If on a ball spinning, which causes centrigugal force, what keeps the oceans in place since the proven observable Law of Waterslides (lol) states that water seeks it's own level.

What are the measurable pounds force of 'gravity' required to hold to a 500 ton Dump Truck to earth while upside down?

Simple math would tell you = at least equal to sum total of the weight of the Dump Truck = at least 500 tons.

What would happen to your physical body should you step into this gravitational field being exerted upon the 500 ton Dump Truck to keep it stuck on the earth while upside down??? = you would be squashed like a bug hitting the windshield of your car at 50mph.

Well, enough of this gibbly gop globalist science forum freelance philosphical time lapse synopsis of unequated formula driven madness that relegates the quad-dimensional realms beyond which the human eye has been prevented by encapsulated gobbly gook known as the flesh as it it attached to a encapsulated jello-fatness-mush inside a calcium crash helmet.

Question: “Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you understand.

 

[Aerials1978]

Science has a broad spectrum depending what area is being researched or discussed. Obviously due to the complexity of the natural world, theories are either proven or disproven, but that doesn't change the uniformity of it or that it operates in orderly process.

 

[Nehemiah6]

the bible doesnt say the exact age of the earth. if it does somewhere point me the verse(s) i stand corrected.

True enough. But the Bible does meticulously present the genealogies of the ancients, from which a very solid chronology can be derived.

Following that we know the years of the reigns of various Gentile kings through Ptolemy's chronology (which is off by an excess of 83 years according to chronologer Martin Anstey). So we do have a very clear picture of the age of the earth, using the date of the creation of Adam as AH 1 which is Anno Homini (the Year of Man). Then we have Anno Domini (AD) which means "the year of our Lord) going back to 4 BC (AD 1).

But from God's perspective the earth has been around for only about six days. Yet gives the "appearance" of having been around for billions of years. And God has no plans of leaving this earth in the wretched condition that it is in. The Green Fanatics have no idea that this earth and its atmosphere (possibly even space which is contaminated with all kinds of debris) will be supernaturally burned up (on the surface) to make room for the New Heavens and the New Earth wherein dwelleth righteousness. This corresponds to Daniel's prophecy that God will establish everlasting righteousness of earth.

 

[DavidTree]

Science has a broad spectrum depending what area is being researched or discussed. Obviously due to the complexity of the natural world, theories are either proven or disproven, but that doesn't change the uniformity of it or that it operates in orderly process.

There is true science which is like water = it always seeks it's own truth for it must since it is obedient to HIM who created ALL Things.

Then there are people who make 'interpret' science for their own pleasure and, just like religion, create their own dogmas on how they view the world.

i greatly enjoy true science because it is everywhere all around us. When the birds sing in the morning as the sun takes its course and the wind blows and the trees and flowers grow.

Science in the hands of men who hate God = very BAD, never ends well = KABOOM

 

[Ted01]

The Bible teaches us that God created the heaven, the earth, the sea, and everything in them in six days - and then rested on the seventh. This occurred a little over 6000 years ago. I believe this, because God's written word is my ultimate authority.

Science is a process... an investigation and collection of raw data. Science doesn't actually "say" anything - as the common idiom "science says" indicates. Science is only the collection of the data itself. Then flawed human beings interpret that data in many different ways. Those interpretations are not science itself, but conclusions based on the data which was collected via the scientific process. Those conclusions come complete with personal biases, and much conjecture and speculation.

Scientism is a blind belief in those INTERPRETATIONS/CONCLUSIONS.

For example, we know through science that there are lights in the sky that appear to move over the earth in repeated patterns. It is not science itself, but the interpretations/conclusions/speculations of flawed men which tell us that those lights are giant fireballs in a vast vacuum, that they are moving away from us, and that this movement means that they were at one time all squished together into a hot, dense ball of energy. And Scientism is the faith-based belief IN those interpretations.

So the cult of Scientism (not science itself) claims that our world began as an explosion/expansion of a singularity about 14 billion years ago. The Bible teaches that our world began as a six day creative action taken by God... about 6000 years ago.

Which of those is the truth?

I enjoyed reading your point-of-view and agree with much of it.

"Scientism", as you called it, is very much ruled by conjecture, speculation, and mere, opinion.

However, how did you come to the conclusion of 6000 years? I've heard that opinion before and understand that it's a commonly held belief... I just don't know how accurate it is? Not sure that the math for reaching it are taking all things into account, which would include my belief that there is missing data in Scripture to arrive at any conclusion...?

 

[MichaelBoll]

whats the difference between the number christians invented and scientists invented? both guess work in my opinion

the bible doesnt say the exact age of the earth. if it does somewhere point me the verse(s) i stand corrected.

Hi Melach, the age of the earth can be calculated through the the genealogies in the Bible. We cannot get an "exact age" from that, but a ball park estimate that the earth is currently somewhere between five and seven thousand years old. There was about 2000 years from Adam to Abraham, about 2000 years from Abraham to Jesus, and about 2000 years from Jesus to now. Here's some more info if you are interested...
https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/

 

[MichaelBoll]

“Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you understand.

There you go, David! The point of the thread is to determine whether we hold the Bible, or the Cult of Scientism, as our ultimate authority. God told us how the foundations of the earth were created... and when. The only question is whether or not we believe Him.

 

[MichaelBoll]

True enough. But the Bible does meticulously present the genealogies of the ancients, from which a very solid chronology can be derived.

Absolutely!

But from God's perspective the earth has been around for only about six days. Yet gives the "appearance" of having been around for billions of years.

I don't agree that there is any "appearance" of billions of years anywhere on earth. What would the results of billions of years of time even look like - as compared to 6000 years of time? And while I agree that God doesn't experience time like we do, the metaphorical statements made by Moses and Peter don't apply to the actual age of the earth.
Cheers

 

[JaumeJ]

There you go, David! The point of the thread is to determine whether we hold the Bible, or the Cult of Scientism, as our ultimate authority. God told us how the foundations of the earth were created... and when. The only question is whether or not we believe Him.

If this is the ultimate question in the OP, perhaps one should consider and understand dthe ultimate teacher cannot be scienc nor the written Word,, rather the Holy Spirit which is clearly taught by the Word, Itself.

It is written that the written word kills, understood to be the written word without the guidance of the Holy Spirit while it is the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, which gives it life.

I learned by personal experience that attmpting to read the Bible and understnd is futile without the Holy Spirit. I, personally , coud not get through two sentences in it before experiencing the infilling of the Holy "Spirit. I am not alone for all who truly have come to believe know this to be true.

Do not be deceived by what is falsely called knowledge lest it destroy you.

 

[MichaelBoll]

Science in the hands of men who hate God = very BAD, never ends well = KABOOM

Exactly! And precisely why I wanted to clearly distinguish "science" from "Scientism" in the OP. There is nothing in "science" that contradicts the scriptures. Scientism, on the other hand, is a cult of mostly godless men who reject our Creator.

 

[JaumeJ]

Just a Post Script to my post above.
What is falsely called knowledge applies to both science and reading the Bible without thegidance of the Holy Spirit for without the Holy Spirit one may onely create a new denomination to enter the arena of apostasy of the others.

Science is just as foolish if taken to the Maker of all that is for He is truly all Mighty and to create a univers takes Him ho more effort than to speak it into existence. A say to all who relyon their own understand, Watch and await what is coming now.

 

[MichaelBoll]

I enjoyed reading your point-of-view and agree with much of it.

"Scientism", as you called it, is very much ruled by conjecture, speculation, and mere, opinion.

However, how did you come to the conclusion of 6000 years?

Thanks Ted! Here's a good read on how we can come to the 6000 years age... give or take.
https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/

 

[Eli1]

The Bible teaches us that God created the heaven, the earth, the sea, and everything in them in six days - and then rested on the seventh. This occurred a little over 6000 years ago. I believe this, because God's written word is my ultimate authority.

Science is a process... an investigation and collection of raw data. Science doesn't actually "say" anything - as the common idiom "science says" indicates. Science is only the collection of the data itself. Then flawed human beings interpret that data in many different ways. Those interpretations are not science itself, but conclusions based on the data which was collected via the scientific process. Those conclusions come complete with personal biases, and much conjecture and speculation.

Scientism is a blind belief in those INTERPRETATIONS/CONCLUSIONS.

For example, we know through science that there are lights in the sky that appear to move over the earth in repeated patterns. It is not science itself, but the interpretations/conclusions/speculations of flawed men which tell us that those lights are giant fireballs in a vast vacuum, that they are moving away from us, and that this movement means that they were at one time all squished together into a hot, dense ball of energy. And Scientism is the faith-based belief IN those interpretations.

So the cult of Scientism (not science itself) claims that our world began as an explosion/expansion of a singularity about 14 billion years ago. The Bible teaches that our world began as a six day creative action taken by God... about 6000 years ago.

Which of those is the truth?

Both of these are true when not taken to their extremes and reasoned properly.
Scientism as a cult exist. Religion as a cult also exists.
But science and religion are not at war i Think Because science is us asking How And the Bible is not an engineering book but a relationship book with our Creator.

 

[MichaelBoll]

If this is the ultimate question in the OP, perhaps one should consider and understand dthe ultimate teacher cannot be scienc nor the written Word,, rather the Holy Spirit which is clearly taught by the Word, Itself.

But what do we test the spirit against to make sure it is of God - if not the written word?

Romans 1:19-20... For what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood from His workmanship, so that men are without excuse.

Notice that Paul doesn't say that they are without excuse because the Holy Spirit showed them this or that. We have our God-given senses, minds, and common sense too. According to Jesus, scripture cannot be broken. And scripture is there for the benefit of men, right? So while I agree that the Holy Spirit can lead us to truths in the scriptures and give us a better understanding of them, we must accept that a spirit from God will never teach you something that contradicts scripture. And scripture says God created the heaven, the earth, the sea, and everything in them during a period of six literal days... about 6000 years ago.

Cheers

 

[MichaelBoll]

But science and religion are not at war i Think Because science is us asking How And the Bible is not an engineering book but a relationship book with our Creator.

I agree that science and the Bible are not at war - and tried to make that clear in the OP. On the other hand, Scientism says Big Bang 14 billion years ago, while the Bible says God spoke 6000 years ago. Only one of them can be true.