Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

[notuptome]

Yet still refuse to believe.

Believe that water baptism saves? Yes you are correct. Grace saves not water baptism. Gods mercy not water baptism. the blood of Christ not water baptism.

I sincerely doubt you have a grasp of either the logistical or greek issues of Acts 2.

No matter how sincere you wish to appear Acts 2 is not water baptism.

According to Acts 2:38 its water baptism not anything called baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Repeat it as often as you like but you cannot make salvation contingent on water baptism.

Perhaps it is not given to you to comprehend that water baptism cannot save. Only the Holy Spirit is able to teach that truth to the believing heart. I hope I'm wrong but I must consider the possibility.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Metternich]

The greek text does not say REPENT AND BE BAPTISED FOR REMISSION OF SIN. It does not. So any translation which says it does is flawed.

In the greek, Peter tells EVERYONE to repent, and the subject which they would recieve is the GIFT of the spirit.

He then told those who recieved this gift. Top be baptised based not he fact theory had recieved remission of sin.



Try learning some language skills. (Greek) And maybe then you will see.

Can you provide an accurate translation? I use Logos Bible software and I have Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament and I went word by word and it shows the translation of each word at the bottom and it seems the KJV has a pretty good translation.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You are adding your own flawed thinking in there... baptism is NOT a "work".... it is an act of obedience.

All acts of obedience are works. Why is this so hard for you to comprehend. Obedience to the law was called works of the law. Obedience to Gods commands are called works of righteousness. Baptism is a work. And if we are being baptised as a means of being saved or as part of the salvation process. it is not only a work of righteousness, But it is a work one does to earn the WAGE.

He said it happens by two things... the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Spirit. Two separate things.

Your right, they are two different things, and BOTH are accomplished by the HS. Why do you refuse to Give God credit and want to take credit for yourself?

We understand what the renewing of the Holy Spirit is.... what do you suppose the "washing of regeneration" could be? What other term, even by YOUR explanations, is used to signify a "washing" ?

Well lets see. We are dirty because of sin. That dirt must be cleansed before we are made clean. And this cleansing must be accomplished before we are regenerated, are made alive in Christ. Or as paul said in eph, we where were dead in trespasses and sins he has made alive, it is all an act of God. It is HE who does the washing, NOT your pastor. And it happens because of our faith in the word. Not because we were immersed in water.

So how are we washed?

The bible says it is by the word (eph) and by the HS (titus 3) Jesus said it is by the word which was spoken to us, we are made completely clean.

So again, what is so hard about this concept?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Again, you are putting YOUR spin on what scripture says. Water baptism is a representation of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus...

No, I am not putting a spin on anything, I would agree with you, Water baptism is a representation as physical circumcision in the OT was a representation of a people being cleansed vs those who are on the outside and unable to partake in Gods blessings..


That is what Paul brings together in this wonderful passage. We are not cleansed and made a seperate people by some man cutting off our foreskins to make us clean, We are cleansed and made seperate form the world by the hands of God. And this is done through a spiritual baptism, where we are buried with him, and raise in him THROUGH FAITH in the WORKING OF GOD.

Again, it is the work of God, not your pastor. And it is his death we are baptised into. Not water.

by doing that, we are joining with Jesus in his death, burial, and resurrection. It is a physical representation of the spiritual happening.

Well thats your opinion. But the actual event happens the moment we place faith in Christ. We then obey God and get baptised in water as the answer of a goood conscious to God. And as a means to show the world our faith. While giving our testimony of our faiht in Christ. A very useful tool I may add, many have come to christ watching others give their testimony.

 

[Jabberjaw]

No, I am not putting a spin on anything, I would agree with you, Water baptism is a representation as physical circumcision in the OT was a representation of a people being cleansed vs those who are on the outside and unable to partake in Gods blessings..


That is what Paul brings together in this wonderful passage. We are not cleansed and made a seperate people by some man cutting off our foreskins to make us clean, We are cleansed and made seperate form the world by the hands of God. And this is done through a spiritual baptism, where we are buried with him, and raise in him THROUGH FAITH in the WORKING OF GOD.

Again, it is the work of God, not your pastor. And it is his death we are baptised into. Not water.




Well thats your opinion. But the actual event happens the moment we place faith in Christ. We then obey God and get baptised in water as the answer of a goood conscious to God. And as a means to show the world our faith. While giving our testimony of our faiht in Christ. A very useful tool I may add, many have come to christ watching others give their testimony.

Where is the scripture for this spiritual waterless baptism you speak of?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Can you provide an accurate translation? I use Logos Bible software and I have Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament and I went word by word and it shows the translation of each word at the bottom and it seems the KJV has a pretty good translation.

Look up words. Repent is second person plural, as is gift of the spirit.

where as baptize is third person singular.

Then read what it says, that those who recieved the word (repented) were baptised.

it all fits..

what does not fit is that peter says baptise is essential for remission of sin, but on the account of the fact they recieved remission of sin (it was a testimony to God)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Where is the scripture for this spiritual waterless baptism you speak of?

lol. DO you have a reading problem? Read my last few posts. I gave all kinds of examples.

 

[Jabberjaw]

lol. DO you have a reading problem? Read my last few posts. I gave all kinds of examples.

That's what I thought.

All baptism was done by disciples, they couldn't baptized with anything but water no more than John the Baptist could, this includes Peter. Mat 3:11

When disciples were commissioned to make disciples, Jesus didn't send them out so He could baptize them, he told the disciples to baptize them
Mat 28:19

 

[preston39]

"The other word is bapto which means to submerge and is applied to Holy Spirit baptism"

The highlighted part is contrived, in other words you made it up.

For clarity...bap-tid-zo...greek.

 

[preston39]

we are commanded to do a lot of things, and we should do them all. But to claim one is saved BECAUSE of doing even one of them, is claiming we save ourself by our own work. Which means Grace is basically nullified.

e...,

It seems you spin here;

Do you save yourself by repentance?

Baptism is not a... works...it is something we are commanded to do to complete the sin cleansing process to be eligible to live a righteous life and thereby being granted eternal salvation.

Nothing one does for ....repentance .....can be considered ...works.

 

[preston39]

Look up words. Repent is second person plural, as is gift of the spirit.

where as baptize is third person singular.

Then read what it says, that those who recieved the word (repented) were baptised.

it all fits..

what does not fit is that peter says baptise is essential for remission of sin, but on the account of the fact they recieved remission of sin (it was a testimony to God)

e...,

Do you really think we should rely on the interpreters, translaters and writers to be that precise in final presentation? I don't.
The important thing to consider is...what is G-d's intent.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

That's what I thought.

All baptism was done by disciples, they couldn't baptized with anything but water no more than John the Baptist could, this includes Peter. Mat 3:11

When disciples were commissioned to make disciples, Jesus didn't send them out so He could baptize them, he told the disciples to baptize them
Mat 28:19

Yeah thats what I thought. You see only through stained glass. And your blinders.

As I said,

Jesus spoke of the baptism to which he would be baptised with (the cross)

Jesus said we too would be baptised with that same baptism

John spoke of the baptism of the Holy Spirit and of baptism of Fire

We are told of the jews Being baptised into moses

Peter spoke of being baptised by the HS, and spoke of a group of gentiles being baptised with the HS BEFORE they were baptised in water.

then we have romans 6 and first cor 12. Where we are told we were baptised into his death and burial and christ himself. And col 2 where it says we were buried in baptism and raised in newness which was a work of God.

So your wrong. Flat out. Wrong.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

e...,

It seems you spin here;

Do you save yourself by repentance?

If I do nto repent. I will never trust God. I will continue to trust in self. Or whatever God I have made up. So I am not spinning anything.

Baptism is not a... works...it is something we are commanded to do to complete the sin cleansing process to be eligible to live a righteous life and thereby being granted eternal salvation.

Circumcision was commanded to. Or they could not have any part of Gods promises. Yet it is called a work. So again your wrong.

A work is something you do to earn a wage, or a reward. Getting baptised so as you say be granted eternal salvation, is saying you are using the work of baptism in order to recieve the reward of eternal salvation.

Nothing one does for ....repentance .....can be considered ...works.

Repent is not doing something, it is having a change of heart. It is taking your faith off self. And placing it on God. No works are involved, so I am not sure what your trying to say here, it makes no sense

 

[eternally-gratefull]

e...,

Do you really think we should rely on the interpreters, translaters and writers to be that precise in final presentation? I don't.
The important thing to consider is...what is G-d's intent.

I agree, what is Gods intent? That he so loved the world he sent his son that whoever entrusts themselves to him will never perish but hae eternal life. For whoever calls on the name of the lord will be saved.

After your saved, what is his intent? God give a testimony of faith and be baptised in my name, my fathers name, and the HS’s name

 

[loverofjesus27]

TOday i found out i’m already baptized.

 

[preston39]

No, I am not putting a spin on anything, I would agree with you, Water baptism is a representation as physical circumcision in the OT was a representation of a people being cleansed vs those who are on the outside and unable to partake in Gods blessings.

I am not aware of scripture which says anyone is excluded?


That is what Paul brings together in this wonderful passage. We are not cleansed and made a seperate people by some man cutting off our foreskins to make us clean, We are cleansed and made seperate form the world by the hands of God. And this is done through a spiritual baptism, where we are buried with him, and raise in him THROUGH FAITH in the WORKING OF GOD.

Again, it is the work of God, not your pastor. And it is his death we are baptised into. Not water.

Yes...water is used as a symbol of that action...thru baptism.

Well thats your opinion. But the actual event happens the moment we place faith in Christ. We then obey God and get baptised in water as the answer of a goood conscious to God. And as a means to show the world our faith. While giving our testimony of our faiht in Christ. A very useful tool I may add, many have come to christ watching others give their testimony.

e...,

It appears that you wish to apply PC to G-d's work...I can find anything in The Bible that allows for PC application...really, do you?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

who are on the outside and unable to partake in Gods blessings.

I am not aware of scripture which says anyone is excluded?

Anyone who was not circumcised was excluded. Anyone who is not washed by God is excluded. They are dead to christ.

Yes...water is used as a symbol of that action...thru baptism.

Exactly, A symbol. A symbol represents the actual event.

It appears that you wish to apply PC to G-d's work...I can find anything in The Bible that allows for PC application...really, do you?

PC?

 

[Jabberjaw]

Yeah thats what I thought. You see only through stained glass. And your blinders.

As I said,

Jesus spoke of the baptism to which he would be baptised with (the cross)

Jesus said we too would be baptised with that same baptism

John spoke of the baptism of the Holy Spirit and of baptism of Fire

We are told of the jews Being baptised into moses

Peter spoke of being baptised by the HS, and spoke of a group of gentiles being baptised with the HS BEFORE they were baptised in water.

then we have romans 6 and first cor 12. Where we are told we were baptised into his death and burial and christ himself. And col 2 where it says we were buried in baptism and raised in newness which was a work of God.

So your wrong. Flat out. Wrong.

Wow, look at all those baptisms you attest to, yet our Lord tells us there is only one :

Ephesians 4:5 KJV
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

The one disciples can do and were commanded to do so:

Matthew 28:19 KJV
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Note He didn't say He would be baptizing them but the disciple.

Our Lord would not tell us there is only one baptism then command us to do another

 

[notuptome]

Wow, look at all those baptisms you attest to, yet our Lord tells us there is only one :

Ephesians 4:5 KJV
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

The one disciples can do and were commanded to do so:

Matthew 28:19 KJV
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Note He didn't say He would be baptizing them but the disciple.

Our Lord would not tell us there is only one baptism then command us to do another

Your theology is all wet. The only baptism that saves is the Holy Spirit baptism. If water baptism saves then the men doing the baptism are saving souls and not Jesus. So the one baptism in Eph 4 is Holy Spirit not water.

Mat 28 is not baptizing in water. It is teaching all nations. You cannot baptize a nation. You can teach them about Christ.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Jabberjaw]

Your theology is all wet. The only baptism that saves is the Holy Spirit baptism. If water baptism saves then the men doing the baptism are saving souls and not Jesus. So the one baptism in Eph 4 is Holy Spirit not water.

Mat 28 is not baptizing in water. It is teaching all nations. You cannot baptize a nation. You can teach them about Christ.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

There is one baptism that saves, and Christ commissioned the disciples to baptize all nations, you're massaging scripture because it doesn't match your man made doctrine.

You can baptize nations, it's God's will:

1 Timothy 2:3-4 KJV
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; [4] Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.