Are there any who will admit they believe in the doctrine of Immortalization

[markss]

Where in these passages does it say we've been given eternal life independently of Christ? If we remain in Christ we have eternal life, not in ourselves. If someone is granted eternal life independently of Christ, where's the incentive to remain in Christ?

Don't you intend to, want to "remain in Christ"? It is only under threat that you'll want to "remain saved"?

1 Peter 1
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

God is keeping you safe.

Much love!

 

[presidente]

This doctrine is especially prevalent in groups influenced by the Latter Rain movement and Manifested Sons of God theology. Probably the most high-profile of these groups are Word of Faith and the NAR, but it's increasingly finding its way into a lot of different arenas. I'm not saying everyone in the NAR or Word of Faith believes it; I'm just saying a lot of authors and online ministries connected to these groups teach and promote it.

I'm not talking about the instantaneous change and glorification believers will experience at the appearing of the Lord. The immortalization doctrine teaches that by living a life of holiness and submission to God we can attain a state of immortality here and now. I've noticed milder forms of this creeping in, such as the notion that we can are not sinners and the "little gods" doctrine.

There's a good article on the Latter Rain and Manifested Sons of God here: https://www.wayoflife.org/reports/latter_rain_and_manifest_sons_of_god.html

My wife and I had a conversation with a woman once who said she had dated Carmen, who got into this teaching. (I have no reason to think Carmen believed in this, and her allegedly dating Carmen may have been many years prior.)

She interpreted these verses from John 11 to support that idea:
[25] Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: [26] And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die.

But this was years ago, and she wasn't a spring chicken. I figured if we live long enough, we can see how that works out for her.

I asked her about the apostles in the Bible who died. I can't remember her exact response, but it was something along the lines that this was something that could be experienced, but they didn't attain to it. I don't remember if she made an exception for martyrdom. I think we should interpret Jesus words through the teaching and example of the apostles.

I do believe in Christians becoming immortal, of course, at the resurrection.

 

[ResidentAlien]

"I urge you in the sight of God who gives life to all things, and before Christ Jesus who witnessed the good confession before Pontius Pilate, that you keep this commandment without spot, blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ’s appearing, which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen." 1 Timothy 6:13-16

 

[ResidentAlien]

I am God almighty???

 

[Evmur]

This doctrine is especially prevalent in groups influenced by the Latter Rain movement and Manifested Sons of God theology. Probably the most high-profile of these groups are Word of Faith and the NAR, but it's increasingly finding its way into a lot of different arenas. I'm not saying everyone in the NAR or Word of Faith believes it; I'm just saying a lot of authors and online ministries connected to these groups teach and promote it.

I'm not talking about the instantaneous change and glorification believers will experience at the appearing of the Lord. The immortalization doctrine teaches that by living a life of holiness and submission to God we can attain a state of immortality here and now. I've noticed milder forms of this creeping in, such as the notion that we can are not sinners and the "little gods" doctrine.

There's a good article on the Latter Rain and Manifested Sons of God here: https://www.wayoflife.org/reports/latter_rain_and_manifest_sons_of_god.html

This is what they are teaching, it is false. it is merely a greatly accentuated form of the human freewill doctrine which is believed by 90 % of the church. It is that doctrine brought to it's logical conclusion. A form of human perfection.

One of it's worse manifestations is busybodyism [spying to make sure everybody is being perfect] and extreme control freakery. Will end in great disappointment.

 

[Evmur]

Itching ears

Not quite, it is that intense desire within the human psyche for that which is perfect. Only to be found in Jesus folks. It comes up from the holiness teaching. John Wesley had mild leanings towards it and the extreme holiness movements from the 18th century on all find their roots in Wesley.

The great strength of the Pentecostal movement is that it arises from the holiness movements ... this is also it's great weakness. [paradox]

 

[Evmur]

I don't know any one that believes or teaches this " by living a life of holiness and submission to God we can attain a state of immortality here and now. "

Are we not right now living forever? That new man which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness born from above can not die . Never heard of this "doctrine".

Yes this is the deeper truth we can take away from this and rejoice in

We ARE made perfect ... in God's eyes. hallelujah praise His name forever. Jesus IS our perfection ... forever and ever.

 

[ResidentAlien]

Holiness promotes sanctification = good. Pentecostalism promotes baptism in the Holy Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues = not good.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The immortalization doctrine teaches that by living a life of holiness and submission to God we can attain a state of immortality here and now.

Another bizarre heresy.

 

[ResidentAlien]

A very common teaching among those who teach divine healing is that physical health is provided for in the atonement. Think about this, if perfect health is provided for all believers in the atonement, the next logical conclusion is death itself is no obstacle.

This is indeed what some Word of Faith healers now claim; that is, they can raise the dead. William Branham's followers believed he would rise from the dead and his burial was postponed for almost four months. Of course he didn't come back to life.

 

[notmyown]

This doctrine is especially prevalent in groups influenced by the Latter Rain movement and Manifested Sons of God theology. Probably the most high-profile of these groups are Word of Faith and the NAR, but it's increasingly finding its way into a lot of different arenas. I'm not saying everyone in the NAR or Word of Faith believes it; I'm just saying a lot of authors and online ministries connected to these groups teach and promote it.

I'm not talking about the instantaneous change and glorification believers will experience at the appearing of the Lord. The immortalization doctrine teaches that by living a life of holiness and submission to God we can attain a state of immortality here and now. I've noticed milder forms of this creeping in, such as the notion that we can are not sinners and the "little gods" doctrine.

There's a good article on the Latter Rain and Manifested Sons of God here: https://www.wayoflife.org/reports/latter_rain_and_manifest_sons_of_god.html

this sounds like we can make God our debtor. do i have that right? because surely, that ain't right.

 

[Polar]

Not quite, it is that intense desire within the human psyche for that which is perfect. Only to be found in Jesus folks. It comes up from the holiness teaching. John Wesley had mild leanings towards it and the extreme holiness movements from the 18th century on all find their roots in Wesley.

The great strength of the Pentecostal movement is that it arises from the holiness movements ... this is also it's great weakness. [paradox]

itching ears

it's in the Bible

 

[ResidentAlien]

this sounds like we can make God our debtor. do i have that right? because surely, that ain't right.

Unfortunately you're right. There are some who teach that God requires our permission to intercede in the material world. It goes like this: God doesn't have legal permission to act in the material world because He doesn't have a material body. Only spirit beings with a physical body have legal authority to act on earth. In the words of Myles Munroe: "Prayer is man giving God the legal right and permission to interfere in earth's affairs." (Understanding the Purpose and Power of Prayer, p.14, Whitaker House, 2002)

It should be obvious to any sane person this is made up nonsense; but this is what it's come to.

 

[notmyown]

Unfortunately you're right. There are some who teach that God requires our permission to intercede in the material world. It goes like this: God doesn't have legal permission to act in the material world because He doesn't have a material body. Only spirit beings with a physical body have legal authority to act on earth. In the words of Myles Munroe: "Prayer is man giving God the legal right and permission to interfere in earth's affairs." (Understanding the Purpose and Power of Prayer, p.14, Whitaker House, 2002)

It should be obvious to any sane person this is made up nonsense; but this is what it's come to.

God certainly does have a physical body! the Lord Jesus was raised and ascended in a physical body, didn't He?

For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” made His light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. (2 Cor 4:6)

 

[Pilgrimshope]

What do you think our glorified bodies might look/feel like?

probably a lot like these ones I think honestly we’ll look the same

my position is there are two realms of creation one is temporary like we’re placed in a garden and given a choice and then the spiritual is the result of what we chose and is eternal

i believe we’ll look about the same maybe a little brighter lol somewhere I can’t remember but it says we’ll still know one another as we did on earth so I’m just assuming we’ll be recognizable

I don’t think we’re going to be ghosts like in the movies but solid just above this realm

 

[Komentaja]

I am God almighty???

2 Thessalonians 2:4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God.

 

[oyster67]

I am God almighty???

Definitely not Christianity. Is he a Muslim? I know they talk about OT.

 

[Komentaja]

Definitely not Christianity. Is he a Muslim? I know they talk about OT.

Muslims don't quote the Bible, they quote the Qu'ran and the Hadith

 

[Locoponydirtman]

This doctrine is especially prevalent in groups influenced by the Latter Rain movement and Manifested Sons of God theology. Probably the most high-profile of these groups are Word of Faith and the NAR, but it's increasingly finding its way into a lot of different arenas. I'm not saying everyone in the NAR or Word of Faith believes it; I'm just saying a lot of authors and online ministries connected to these groups teach and promote it.

I'm not talking about the instantaneous change and glorification believers will experience at the appearing of the Lord. The immortalization doctrine teaches that by living a life of holiness and submission to God we can attain a state of immortality here and now. I've noticed milder forms of this creeping in, such as the notion that we can are not sinners and the "little gods" doctrine.

There's a good article on the Latter Rain and Manifested Sons of God here: https://www.wayoflife.org/reports/latter_rain_and_manifest_sons_of_god.html

Sounds almost as blasphemous as dispensationalists desiring to sacrifice animals in some future temple.

 

[Stephen777]

I believe that if you are looking for the Bible to say or support something, you are going to find it or interpret verses in that way. This is why we pray before ever opening it. We as humans do not like being in the unknowing category but what happens when trying to find the unanswered questions is we start limiting Gods powers and trying to put him in a box.
How can we even begin to comprehend a being that creates life from dust and lives outside of time and space?
Jesus Christ died for our sins and came back from death and ascended into heaven. What was said about our bodies was that we would be full of Joy and Wonder when we are finally in the presence of God. Our new bodies will be new and perfect that will never age, become weak or die. As the Angels themselves in heaven.
We only know what a perfect body looks like in magazines but in honesty we have no idea what perfect looked like in the beginning and that is due to evolution(micro evolution:not macro where we all come from the ooz of the ocean). Our soul is who we are and our spirit is the life, one is ours and one is Gods. I mean both really are Gods property but you get what I am saying I’m sure.
The Bible uses the word soul in different terms in the KJV and the word eternity, I have read an interesting article but do not recall the name. It was in a sense saying our body dies and our sin can kill the soul but the spirit has always been Gods and pulling us in His direction.

Just my 2 cents. I have no phd hanging on the wall or some resume claiming a large sum of educational feats, but I do have the Holy Spirit in me chilling with my spirit and soul.