Is a child of God always in the grace, love, and kingdom of God?

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know1

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2012
3,102
181
63
#1
Though this thread is not about salvation, or whether a person is osas or not, I'm sure it will morph into that.
Some may ask, how can you not be in the grace, love, or kingdom of God without talking about salvation?
Well, that's part of what I'm asking.
Is the child of God always and forever in the grace, love, and kingdom of God, or are the above mentioned conditional and temporal?
Again, this may look like I am asking if our salvation is conditional based on our works, but I am not. I'm separating salvation from the above mentioned.
If I were to ask, what is the grace of God? Some of you might say, it is the unmerited favor of God.
But is that all it is?
When God told Paul, "my grace is sufficient for thee, was He just saying, it is my will that you suffer and my grace will help you bear it?
After all, you may ask, isn't it the will of God for us to suffer for the name of Christ?
I personally do not agree with this doctrine.
Was God referring to Paul's salvation or situation, when He mentioned His grace being sufficient?
God's grace had nothing to do with Paul's salvation but everything to do with his thorn in the flesh.
So can there be more to God's grace than just His unmerited favor?
Are we in the grace of God if we complain about a situation we don't like, or take medication to alleviate any kind of sufferings?
Many of you, I am sure, would say, of course we are, but are we really?
Those of you who agree with this belief or doctrine, again, are tying God's grace to salvation, and I say, it is not.
Can the grace of God be more about where we are, rather than who we are in Christ?
I asked also, is the grace of God conditional?
I asked the same about the love of God. Is it conditional to be in the love of God?
And what about the kingdom of God? Is it conditional to get in and stay in or not?
 
Sep 17, 2016
8,959
4,613
113
#2
Though this thread is not about salvation, or whether a person is osas or not, I'm sure it will morph into that.
Some may ask, how can you not be in the grace, love, or kingdom of God without talking about salvation?
Well, that's part of what I'm asking.
Is the child of God always and forever in the grace, love, and kingdom of God, or are the above mentioned conditional and temporal?
Again, this may look like I am asking if our salvation is conditional based on our works, but I am not. I'm separating salvation from the above mentioned.
If I were to ask, what is the grace of God? Some of you might say, it is the unmerited favor of God.
But is that all it is?
When God told Paul, "my grace is sufficient for thee, was He just saying, it is my will that you suffer and my grace will help you bear it?
After all, you may ask, isn't it the will of God for us to suffer for the name of Christ?
I personally do not agree with this doctrine.
Was God referring to Paul's salvation or situation, when He mentioned His grace being sufficient?
God's grace had nothing to do with Paul's salvation but everything to do with his thorn in the flesh.
So can there be more to God's grace than just His unmerited favor?
Are we in the grace of God if we complain about a situation we don't like, or take medication to alleviate any kind of sufferings?
Many of you, I am sure, would say, of course we are, but are we really?
Those of you who agree with this belief or doctrine, again, are tying God's grace to salvation, and I say, it is not.
Can the grace of God be more about where we are, rather than who we are in Christ?
I asked also, is the grace of God conditional?
I asked the same about the love of God. Is it conditional to be in the love of God?
And what about the kingdom of God? Is it conditional to get in and stay in or not?
The condition is through faith. To apostate is to abandon faith.

Hebrews 11:6
New King James Version

6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
5,928
3,628
113
Frankston, Victoria
christianlife.au
#3
Though this thread is not about salvation, or whether a person is osas or not, I'm sure it will morph into that.
Some may ask, how can you not be in the grace, love, or kingdom of God without talking about salvation?
Well, that's part of what I'm asking.
Is the child of God always and forever in the grace, love, and kingdom of God, or are the above mentioned conditional and temporal?
Again, this may look like I am asking if our salvation is conditional based on our works, but I am not. I'm separating salvation from the above mentioned.
If I were to ask, what is the grace of God? Some of you might say, it is the unmerited favor of God.
But is that all it is?
When God told Paul, "my grace is sufficient for thee, was He just saying, it is my will that you suffer and my grace will help you bear it?
After all, you may ask, isn't it the will of God for us to suffer for the name of Christ?
I personally do not agree with this doctrine.
Was God referring to Paul's salvation or situation, when He mentioned His grace being sufficient?
God's grace had nothing to do with Paul's salvation but everything to do with his thorn in the flesh.
So can there be more to God's grace than just His unmerited favor?
Are we in the grace of God if we complain about a situation we don't like, or take medication to alleviate any kind of sufferings?
Many of you, I am sure, would say, of course we are, but are we really?
Those of you who agree with this belief or doctrine, again, are tying God's grace to salvation, and I say, it is not.
Can the grace of God be more about where we are, rather than who we are in Christ?
I asked also, is the grace of God conditional?
I asked the same about the love of God. Is it conditional to be in the love of God?
And what about the kingdom of God? Is it conditional to get in and stay in or not?
God allows us to endure trials of many kinds. We are exhorted not to get discouraged or to complain. Trials are a part of Christian growth. (1 Peter 4:12)

God's grace is huge, greater than any trial, greater than any problem that we might face and greater than any danger. It's not always what we imagine, expect or even pray for. Many years ago, I need a tooth pulled. I prayed that it would be easy and painless. It was a two hour ordeal that left me shattered. Yet I could even joke with the dentist. He had to send the rest of his patients home. I said I'd go home and we could finish tomorrow. Sure, with the job nowhere near done. What good came out of that? I'd worried about my teeth for decades. The dentist told me that my jaw was like iron and my teeth the toughest he'd had to treat. Grace does not prevent troubles, but it enables us to endure and overcome.

Spiritually, we fall from grace when we trust anything but the finished work of Jesus for our salvation. That can happen through false teaching, pride, rebellion, complacency or ignorance. It does not mean that we lose our eternal life. It does mean that God will leave us to our own resources, which will inevitably lead to failure and defeat. Grace welcomes us back after we learn our lesson.

The church in Corinth had turned to false teachers, as Paul stated in his second letter. They were at risk of receiving God's grace in vain. (2 Corinthians 6:1). To understand Paul's statement, we have to read the preceding chapters.

The some of the Galatians had fallen from grace (Galatians 5:4). Why? They fell for the false teaching that we have to obey the Law to be saved. Were they still born again? Yes. But some at least were deceived. How could they be restored to grace? By repenting and confessing their sin. And it surely is sin to deny that the death and resurrection of Christ is not enough to save us.

Some years God spoke to me. asking "How were you save?" I thought about and replied, "By grace". He asked me, "What saves you today?" I considered that also. "Grace" God spoke again, "What will save you tomorrow?" I got the point by then. Grace.

The old song says that grace is greater than all our sin. That is true but only in part. Grace is greater than the world, the flesh, self and Satan. Grace is Jesus doing for us what we cannot do for ourselves. What can we do for ourselves? Nothing of any spiritual worth (John 15:5). Oh, we can do many things, do many good works and form great ministries. I assure you that anything done apart from the leading and empowerment of Christ is nothing in God's sight.
 
Nov 3, 2024
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#4
I believe that a portion of God's grace is given to every human that finds them selves waking to greet a new day.
As long as the gift of forgiveness is offered by God so shall his grace be.
The Lord not only created mankind he sustains it. Offering life eternal for those who chose to believe.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
15,233
6,170
113
#5
Though this thread is not about salvation, or whether a person is osas or not, I'm sure it will morph into that.
Some may ask, how can you not be in the grace, love, or kingdom of God without talking about salvation?
Well, that's part of what I'm asking.
Is the child of God always and forever in the grace, love, and kingdom of God, or are the above mentioned conditional and temporal?
Again, this may look like I am asking if our salvation is conditional based on our works, but I am not. I'm separating salvation from the above mentioned.
If I were to ask, what is the grace of God? Some of you might say, it is the unmerited favor of God.
But is that all it is?
When God told Paul, "my grace is sufficient for thee, was He just saying, it is my will that you suffer and my grace will help you bear it?
After all, you may ask, isn't it the will of God for us to suffer for the name of Christ?
I personally do not agree with this doctrine.
Was God referring to Paul's salvation or situation, when He mentioned His grace being sufficient?
God's grace had nothing to do with Paul's salvation but everything to do with his thorn in the flesh.
So can there be more to God's grace than just His unmerited favor?
Are we in the grace of God if we complain about a situation we don't like, or take medication to alleviate any kind of sufferings?
Many of you, I am sure, would say, of course we are, but are we really?
Those of you who agree with this belief or doctrine, again, are tying God's grace to salvation, and I say, it is not.
Can the grace of God be more about where we are, rather than who we are in Christ?
I asked also, is the grace of God conditional?
I asked the same about the love of God. Is it conditional to be in the love of God?
And what about the kingdom of God? Is it conditional to get in and stay in or not?
look how thier actions impact it

“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:19-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Again

“For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭5:5-7‬ ‭

notice how these are warnings written to the same people he has said this to in the same epistle earlier

for instance chapter 2
“Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That shouldn’t be taken in a vacuum but with the rest of nt he epistle which earns about our behavior and the resulting inheritance we can’t serve sin and also inherit the kingdom of God

The children of God your asking about have a doctrine like this

“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

but if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭6:14-15‬

they are children either way but thier actions determine the result according to the son of God who came to teach the doctrine that makes children of God

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus doctrine is the truth about agod and his children it tells us all we wish to know about the relationship
 
Nov 12, 2021
1,872
693
113
#6
If I were to ask, what is the grace of God? Some of you might say, it is the unmerited favor of God.

But is that all it is?
No ----

AI
"hen" in Hebrew can indeed be associated with grace, favor, and even mercy, it's more accurately understood as "grace" or "favor" and encompasses healing, vindication, and strength


Grace is not just something God extends out to us -----Grace is actually a Person ----God is full of Grace ---Grace is part of God's character -----Jesus came Full of Grace and Truth ----Jesus is Grace ----

That is why God said to Paul my grace is sufficient ---

Corinthians 12:9, where Paul writes, "But he said to me, 'My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.

the Greek word for----- power here
dýnamis (able, having ability") – properly, "ability to perform" (L-N);
for the believer, power to achieve by applying the Lord's inherent abilities. "Power through God's ability"


So weakness here means a couple of things -----it can be a physical sickness or it can be a Spiritual harassment from Satan --which was the case for Paul -----

Strong"s Concordance ===
The term "astheneia" primarily denotes a state of weakness or lack of strength. In the New Testament, it is used both in a physical sense, referring to bodily ailments or sickness, and in a metaphorical sense, indicating moral or spiritual weakness. It often highlights human frailty and the need for divine strength.


Is the child of God always and forever in the grace, love, and kingdom of God, or are the above mentioned conditional and temporal?
God's Agape ---Love is free and unconditional to all people ---always

There are several types of graces -----that God gives ----only one is free

there is Common Grace --is temporal ---------which is given freely to all people ------no conditions --when you open your eyes in the morning --your alive by God's Grace ===for the just and the unjust --God allows rain and sun to shine on the just and the unjust ----

The Rest of the Graces are conditional as you need the inbirthing of the right Faith to access these graces ----as these Graces come through Christ's faith ----this faith comes through hearing the Gospel and not all people get inbirthed with this faith ---You have to accept God the Father's pull on your heart so He can change your hardened Heart to a heart that receives the Gospel ------

John 6:44, which states: "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him,

All conditional -----
Serving Grace ---
Sanctifying Grace --
Justifying Grace ---
Saving Grace ---

The Kingdom of God is Conditional -----Period ----no unsaved person can ever experience the Kingdom of God that is here on earth now which requires you to accept Jesus as your Lord and saviour ---- and have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit -----or the Kingdom of God in Heaven ----there is No Second chance to get into the Kingdom of God when you die ---Salvation is for the here and now -----Folks

1744064942527.jpeg
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
63,413
32,093
113
#7
When God told Paul, "my grace is sufficient for thee, was He just saying, it is my will that you suffer and my grace will help you bear it?
After all, you may ask, isn't it the will of God for us to suffer for the name of Christ?
I personally do not agree with this doctrine.

Philippians 1:29a + Romans 8:17b For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for Him. Indeed, we suffer with Him, so that we may also be glorified with Him.