Predestination is misunderstood...

That's not sorrow...it's grace.

Who said that the Gospel "saves"? The Gospel generates saving faith (Rom 10:17). But all will not believe. Many will resist the convincing and conviction of the Holy Spirit. Some perhaps at the beginning, and some even after many opportunities to repent. But only those who obey the Gospel are saved by grace through FAITH (Eph 2:8,9). And that is why we have Christ's commands to go into all the world and preach the Gospel to every creature. He that believes is saved, but he that does not believe is damned (Mark 16:15,16). However God wants ALL MEN to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth (1 Tim 2:3,4).

God wanted mankind back that he had lost at a point in time.

God does not love the world.


So why does it say in John 3:16?



The word "loved" is in the past tense.
God does NOT love the present world.

What God loved was the world He intended the world to be!

That is why He has redeemed men back to Himself. Bought to make man to become as God always intended man to be!

It does not say that God gave His Son because He loves the world.
He does not love what man is now become.
God gave His only Son because of how God envisioned man is to be when creating him.

We have been saved so God can return us to what He always intended us to be!

grace and peace .....................

The doctrine of original sin is not stated in the bible and is not a prerequisite for acceptance into Christ and every spiritual blessing in Him.

You're right: I don't. Jesus did.


You seem to think you have profound insight into the deeper things of the word of God. Unfortunately, it's all blather and foam, but when you're asked to back it up, there is no substance behind it.

Good day, Forest. I know you believe all Scripture must harmonize. What do you make of Jesus' words in John 16:7-9?

Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter
will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the
world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me;

There must be some way... otherwise, you have people born again who have no faith, since they do not believe in God, and yet
somehow the as yet unborn again person must be able to be convicted of their sinful standing before a just holy and loving God.

I see in another of your posts to me which I did not yet see when I made the above portion of this post to you, that you have quoted the same verses back to me. So again you are saying people are born again who have zero belief/faith. That makes no sense to me.

He also said found in their LAW. Psalms is "not" any part of the Law. He used the same tactic they used when they tried to trap Him with greatest Commandment, the divorce issue of Moses, and even stoning the woman caught in adultery.

I appreciate your patience with me, and your desire to understand the doctrine of Christ more fully, as we seek to harmonize the scriptures.

The scriptures teach us that God's elect are comprised of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation (Rev 5:9). All of his elect are spiritual Israel represented by Jacob, whose name was changed by God to be no more called Jacob, but to be called Israel (Gen 32:28) (Rom 9:6-13).

Spiritual Israel turned away from God and began to worship Idols (Zeph 3:11). God left in the midst of them a remnant that shall trust in the name of the Lord (Zeph 3:12-13) (they trusted in the Lord, but had no knowledge of the doctrine of Christ). Both the disobedient spiritual Israel, and the remnant are God's elect.

The old testament saints were born again in the same manner as the new testament saints are, by God's grace with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (Isiah 63:11).

Therefore, there are people who are born again (all of spiritual Israel, both disobedient Israel and the remnant) in whom all have faith in God, but are ignorant of the doctrine of Christ.

The mystery of the doctrine of Christ remained a mystery until it was revealed to the apostle Paul, by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit
during the three years that he was in the desert (Gal 1:15-18).

God is indeed love but because God loves justice He must cast the wicked into Hell.

Isa_61:8a "For I, the LORD, love justice;

If God did not compromise His perfect justice in sending Christ to be killed then what makes you think He will compromise it for anyone else including yourself?

It is because God is love that He perfectly hates evil and must punish it.

If you refuse to listen to Scripture then then there is no further purpose in warning you any further as to do so would only be me casting pearls before swine and lead to your greater condemnation if God does not grant you grace to see the offense of your sin against His holiness.

I sincerely pray that God gives you absolutely no peace until you are humbled by Him to cry out for mercy and hope it doesn't take a tragedy in your life to do so.

He doesn't have to feel "spiritual guilt", whatever that is. The issue of sin has moral implications as well. How else could an atheist recognise murder is wrong?



The people he is talking to are not the ones who, knowing God exists, suppress the truth of His existence. He is talking to believers in Christ about those who deny God's existence. The ones Paul is talking to are saved, the ones he is talking about are not and never will be saved but they are without excuse. They could be saved if they weren't so highly arrogant but they refuse to humble themselves even at the most basic level of God consciousness. This sort don't just turn from God in confusion and or ignorance and follow after the lusts of their flesh, they actively suppress the truth and indulge themselves to the hilt. These are not the sort of people who are simply lost or misled, upon whom you would have compassion. These are the sort you want to keep as far away from as you possibly can.

He doesn't have to feel "spiritual guilt", whatever that is. The issue of sin has moral implications as well. How else could an atheist recognise murder is wrong?



The people he is talking to are not the ones who, knowing God exists, suppress the truth of His existence. He is talking to believers in Christ about those who deny God's existence. The ones Paul is talking to are saved, the ones he is talking about are not and never will be saved but they are without excuse. They could be saved if they weren't so highly arrogant but they refuse to humble themselves even at the most basic level of God consciousness. This sort don't just turn from God in confusion and or ignorance and follow after the lusts of their flesh, they actively suppress the truth and indulge themselves to the hilt. These are not the sort of people who are simply lost or misled, upon whom you would have compassion. These are the sort you want to keep as far away from as you possibly can.

As I said before, you have a person saved (regenerated) in order to be saved. Makes no sense whatsoever but you keep on refusing to see it.

Nope the sons of Jacob went on to be called Israelites after his father had his name changed, which is nothing to do with the spiritual Isreal.

However the Israelites have been chosen to be saved like everyone else, because theres no difference between an Israelite and a Muslim, there both dead until they repent in Jesus name and believe. and are still not saved so no the Israelites are not spiritual at this stage.

Infact there dead sent into exile as they chose to worship baal.

So your now saying God not striking a person dead is an unmerited favor.

What an absolute joke that is.

God is choosing not to strike you down because of his sorrow he has for the sinner

As in clothing Adam and eve

It have nothing to do with any type of favor.

thank you, to you as well.

how many different ways does the Apostle John use the word kósmos in his writings?

I see no spiritual references. Are these your thoughts, or are they based upon the scriptures?

Clearly, you don’t understand what the word “favour” means, in this context.

Nice try to provoke reaction,

I've got news for today,


Today I have brushed my feet with you 😊

You can play with word games all you like.

A favor is favour no matter how you look at it merited or unmerited.

There's only one people who God favours and that's the humble.

Which is not unmerited is it, that's merited.

Its those people who repent who humble themselves, that God shows favor to which makes his favor merited

Nice try to provoke reaction... hypocrite.