The Error of KJV-Onlyism

My NIV Bible has 1812 pages! This is iron-clad proof that God gave Russia a successful defense of the French invasion by Napoleon in that year!

Does the last page talk about Russia?

See, this is what is silly about your claim here. You have no understanding about how biblical numerics work.

For example: You will not find a number like 777 tied to God and Jesus multiple times in an insane amount or anything similar in any other book. This is tied to Jesus and God in the book itself. Also what do you do with Jesus’ name appearing 70 x 7 times in the odd books of the New Testament and 70 x 7 times in the even books? This is not a random number but Jesus told us to forgive 70 x 7 times. In other words, the numbers are tied to what the text is talking about and it is a repeat pattern. Ever check-out Revelation 13:18 in a deep study before? It talks about wisdom. Wisdom is knowledge + experience. So what experience and knowledge is it talking about in this verse? Let the person who has understanding count the number. What understanding? Counting so as to further understand the number of the beast. It is the number of man. But man’s number is not precisely 666, but is 6. The number of the beast is man’s number (6) in a multiple of three. In other words, when we say God’s number is 7, we can show instances in the Bible of 777 being attached to God.

Oh. So now you do count words? Weird. I thought you said that was for morons.

didn't i say from. the beginning i had learned to consider it more fruitful to make lighthearted jokes than throw all my energy tearing down kjv-onlyism-arguments?

i do think there are fruitful conversations to be had about Pascha vs easter tho. seeing the circumstances under which the word originated, how narrowly confined its use is, how it is unrelated to the actual feast on which Christ rose, the probabilities of its etymology... this path leads one (or at least led me) to a much greater appreciation of the actual testimony of Christ all over scripture, how that there is no 'Jewish scripture vs Christian scripture' but one scripture, how valuable Leviticus is even tho we aren't under the Law...

of course to appreciate how Christ is magnified in Pesach and diminished by easter, one has to set aside doggedly defending the word 'because it appears in kjv' so there is the thread-relevant, ulterior motive...
but my suggestion bro, going forward, is try to focus on glorifying God rather than focus on 'defeating' someone. not saying i am good at that or that i always remember to, but, it's good advice, and also good advice our brother Paul gave - if at all possible, be at peace with all men. Mssr Highlighter isn't our enemy, he's our brother.

for myself i think the most critical factor is, "is this literally what the best manuscript evidence known to us says?"
i want to avoid interpretation in translation, and be able to read the closest thing to the original in the original language i can, without being myself able to actually read Greek and Hebrew. so i abhor versions like the nlt that take liberties with the text instead of being as close to the original words as possible.
the Bible calls it equally evil to add to the word as to take away from it.

i'll repeat what J. Vernon Mcgee used to say about the topic - the kjv isn't the best translation, but it's the best translation we've got.

IMHO Bible numerology is TOTAL NONSENSE. My comment about the number of pages in my NIV Bible is just as valid as your nonsensical claims.

You do realize, don't you, that there is no standard set of source documents. There is a collection of scrolls that differ from each other, sometimes significantly.

Are you able to verify your numerology in the ancient languages (ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek)? I seriously doubt it!!!

In your (flawed) KJV, Matthew 18:22 reads " Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven" but in the NIV and most other versions it says "Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times". That is the case with many other translations. So "seventy time seven" has poor scriptural basis.

Revelation 13:18, "This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. That number is 666." Even your KJV says "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. ". In every translation, it says the number of a man is 666, not 6!

Your numerology is PHONY!!!

Numerology is witchcraft!

We cannot expect perfection in any translation, the most perfect word of God is Hebrew. All the people God gave His word to had Hebrew as their original tongue, even those who wrote in Greek. They had been taught scripture in Hebrew, and when they wrote in Greek about that scripture, they had to translate that Hebrew teaching to Greek.

The KJV had at least 47 scholars working together to create it, they did a miraculous job. However, we must study the world these scholars lived in and wonder if it affected their thinking. In Spain, for instance, Jews were punished. If you search the KJV for indications that discrimination against the Jews affected the translation, you will find it. For example, the word Easter is not an accurate translation of the original.

So if counting numbers to figure out something is witchcraft then why is Revelation 13:18 telling you to do this?
Looks like you simply do not understand or believe what Revelation 13:18 is telling you to do.

The number of the beast is 666 and it is the number of a man seeing man’s number is 6. 666 is a multiple of 6. This is why the verse is saying that you already have wisdom and understanding in counting. Otherwise, why is it telling you to count? While 666 is not precisely 6, it is derived from multiplying that number three times. It is a repeat of man's number three times. Again, If you did the study, man's number is 6 in the Bible. There is even a whole book on it. But go ahead and speak more like you know the topic, when you are totally clueless.

As for Matthew 18:22:

If you bothered to even look at several translations, you will find your corrupted Vaticanus and Sinaiticus Modern Bibles also say the same thing as the KJV in the NAS95, NLT, BLB, LSB, CSB, AMP, ASV, etcetera. So looks like you have to attack them, too. Anyone who disagrees with your reading is your enemy. See, this is why you are your own authority, and there is not one Bible you believe is the standard. You get to pick and choose what you want God to say.

Anyway, you are deflecting away from the truth here. What are the odds of both the even books of the New Testament and the odd books of the NT both just so happen to have the word "Jesus" 70 x 7 times in each? Yet also be tied to what the KJV says in Matthew 18:22? Keep in mind that there are more words in the odd books than the even books in the New Testament. Coincidence? But Jesus is tied to the number 7 in so many other ways (or multiples of 7). For example: Do you think it is just another coincidence that Jesus is the 77th from GOD the Father in Luke's genealogy? What about the Trinity or the Godhead being tied to 777? Again, coincidence? I have already provided other examples. You have to willfully bury your head in the sand to such truths. No ordinary book can randomly do all that I have presented. If you think otherwise, you need to prove it. But you cannot.

Apparently you don't understand that if the number of a man is 666 and also the beast if you bother to read Revelation 13:18: "This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. That number is 666.

" So according to your voodoo numerology, man and beast are one and the same!

BTW, 3 x 6 = 18 not 666 (basic math).

BTW, you got one thing right (probably by accident). You wrote "you will find your corrupted Vaticanus and Sinaiticus Modern Bibles also say the same thing as the KJV", therefore the KJV is corrupt!

See, this is why you are your own authority, because you believe (falsely) that one Bible translation is the standard, even though it has been modified several times since its creation. (Which revision is the correct one???)

You pick and choose what you want God to say, based on your decision beforehand what you want it to say.

I read the Bible objectively,

to understand God's truths, not to bolster a false interpretation that just happens to fit my predetermined dogma. Frankly, I have never read such rubbish in my entire life! You have "gone off the deep end" by ignoring what the Bible says -- God's message to humanity -- and changing it into some bizarre numerology. TRY PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT GOD SAYS IN THE BIBLE INSTEAD OF PLAYING WITH CYPHERS!

I don't need to prove anything in regards to your voodoo numerology.

You (or someone else) is inventing all kinds of phony "facts" based on nothing.

Can you prove to me that the moon isn't made out of green cheese?

Finally, I have better things to do with my Sunday morning than debate with someone who won't use logic or rational thought.

Look, we are agreed that the number of the beast is 666.
People who are not even Christian are aware of this fact.

But on the other part you are failing to grasp what I am trying to say.
You can say 666 is the number of man but this is in the sense that man’s number 6 being repeated three times.
Imagine if an early day Christian made a perfect copy of the New Testament originals that God endorsed. Along with the originals: This would not be two entirely different New Testaments that were foreign or different to each other. In essence, it would only be one New Testament that Christians are to follow. The NT originals and this perfect copy of the NT would be mirror reflections of each other. So in this case, they both could be referred to as the one New Covenant (With one being the original, and the other a perfect copy). But they are not entirely different in the sense to say they are two entirely different New Testaments just because there are two physical versions of them. It’s like seeing a mirror reflection of yourself. There is technically only one ”you” but a mirror makes it appear like there are more.

Imagine if a Pastor had three New Testament Bibles on his podium and he told the church in his speech that we are to follow only one New Covenant or New Testament as he touched these bibles. Technically there is only one New Covenant even though there may be mirror reflections or duplicates representing that one true teaching given to God’s people throughout time in the form of Scripture.

Man was created on day 6 (Genesis 1:27).
Man was given six days to work (Exodus 20:9, Exodus 31:5).
Six Cities of Refuge: In Joshua 20:7-9, six cities were designated as cities of refuge where someone who accidentally killed another person could flee for protection. These cities were provided for the safety of individuals, highlighting the concern for human life.
Think. God told Joshua to march around Jericho seven times and not six times.
Why? Because six is the number of man, and seven is God’s number.
God took down the walls of Jericho and it was not the might of man.

I know you don’t believe any of this, but facts are facts.
You can do whatever you want with those facts.
They exist nonetheless.



So is Revelation 13:18 telling you the reader (if you have understanding) to count a specific number? Yes, or no?
Is that voodoo numerology? Yes, or no?
Why is Revelation 13:18 telling you to count a specific number if it already gives you the answer?
This is where you cannot answer because you don’t have understanding to count in light of what Revelation 13:18 teaches.



First, nowhere I was I referring to multiplication of 6 x 3. 2nd graders know how to do multiplication in basic Math. So don’t assume that is what I was talking about.

Second, here is what Perplexity says.

Yes, saying that 666 is a multiple of 6 threes is correct. In the context of the number 666, it can be viewed as a multiple of 6 threes, which emphasizes the significance of the number in relation to imperfection and incompleteness. The repetition of six three times in 666 symbolizes the completeness of sinful incompleteness found in the beast, highlighting imperfection despite appearing to strive for divine perfection[3][4]. This interpretation aligns with the symbolic nature of numbers in Revelation and their figurative significance rather than a literal gematria calculation[1].

Source:
https://www.perplexity.ai/search/If-I-say-q.rSh1ppSaWoLXsrjfuP0g



So you are of the view that Christians for hundreds of years were using a corrupt Bible?
Two Textus Receptus Bible translators died giving us the line we have that leads to the KJV.
They died for nothing? What about all the great revivals that happened involving the KJV? Just forget about all that?
What about the black abolitionists who used the KJV to help end slavery in this country? Just forget about all that?
They had a corrupt Bible and so they were wrong? What kind of good fruit have the Modern Bibles produced? I will tell you.
Confusion, and lots of money lost buying multiple versions of the same Bible even. Your NIV is not the same as your later NIV and even your side has complained about the gender inclusive language within it. No doubt to fit the Leftist agenda.



Uh, sorry. You cannot play the same card I gave to you. I believe in one Bible and not many like you that say conflicting things. You don’t have any standard or any one Bible that you believe is God’s Holy Word. You get to pick and choose whatever reading you feel is best. I don’t have that luxury. So sorry. You cannot make the same claim that I have said to you before. It doesn’t apply here.



So now you are a mind reader? You have no idea of my motivations when I read Scripture. But just to fill you in, I believe in letting the Bible speak for itself. One Bible and not many bibles like you believe.



You don’t have a Bible (singular). You don’t believe any Bible is the perfect, inerrant, inspired words of God that you can holds in your hands.



Again, what is Revelation 13:18 telling you or the reader who has understanding to do?
Is it wrong of God to give you or the reader who has understanding to count the number of the beast to figure out his number?
So a number is attached to a specific person. There is a number and it has a meaning attached to it. Is this voodoo numerology?



Careful now. If it is in the Bible as taught in the Bible (Revelation 13:18), then you would be insulting God’s instruction to you and claiming it as evil. This would not sit well with you at the Judgment of Christ if you continue to do so.



In your mind it does not exist because you don’t understand what the Scriptures are teaching on this matter.
However, it is good thing your understanding does not determine reality.



It is a logical deduction that it isn’t made out of green cheese based on the observable data.
I don’t know the Earth is round, but I do know that it is round or a sphere based on the data we are given.



And you don’t think I believe you are being illogical and irrational?
I believe you are being illogical and irrational for not believing in one Bible that you can hold in your hands and just believe it without question. To suggest that the Bible has errors in it is to become your own authority.

I'm sure you're aware that some of the manuscripts have 616, not 666. I'm sure you're also aware that those numbers are both gematria for the same person using different languages. I'm sure you're also aware that because of this, all of your blather about 666 is far off the mark.

Or... maybe you aren't. I have occasionally been wrong.

Take notes on this video and ask yourself, is this really random chance?

I’m not interested in your numerolatry.