The Security Of The Believer

God died for the World and taught the world hates Him and will Hate us.

So, He LOVED a world He knew hated Him.

And still Died for them.

This is not as difficult as you make it.

He Died out His Love for a World that 90% will end up in Hell forever.

That is just the facts.

I believe the Moment we're Saved these Promises apply.

But clearly afterwards, we can become a DEAD BRANCH and be cut off or Jesus would not even be warning us of that fact.

You have to explain for me.( I am a little dense!)

That does not make any sense to me.

If I claim to be saved, right now , at this moment and He promised I will never perish. How can the dead branch mean that I can perish? That would mean that the promise would not apply.

Because the moment you are regenerated you are Saved with the Promises connected to being a Child of God.

As for the other portion, the Branch is connected to Jesus and gets cut off.

You can only be connected to Jesus by being regenerated.

But Jesus is showing that regenerated people can become to a point of not producing Good Fruit and the Father cuts the Branch off.

That is what the Bible says.

I did not understand it for a long time.

But when I eventually read where Saved people will fall away and can become deceived, it made more sense.

I still don't follow you. I could be wrong, but I was sure that you claimed "being cut off" was thrown into hell and not saved.

So His promise to me that I shall never perish, does not apply. I don't see how I can see that any other way? Unless I am mistaken about what you believe "cut off" means.

Jesus even says it:

10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other



***so, as it should be, Paul, is backing the literal words of Jesus...not the other way around***

From what I have studied, this is the great white throne judgement. It is for unbelievers only. "In that day" is the final judgment, and every knee shall bow......Hence the "my Lord,my lord."

The frightening thing to me is the fact that these people did MIGHTY works in His name and not one sin is mentioned. These were obviously, good , moral, upstanding and law abiding people. From what they claim they did for the Lord, we can assume they were church goers also.

Not one sin mentioned, but the Lord called them evildoers.

Why were they not saved? Thoughts?

tell me, it feels like you're trying to trap me into something. so answer this before i answer you.

the Saved, Paul, speaks about that will Fall Away from the Faith, will become Deceived, are these Believers, Paul is discussing, going to Hell?

Agreed. I should have payed more attention.

My point is that particular sins are not brought up, because Jesus Christ died for all sin. So what is judged are our deeds, our human works.......That is why religion is so dangerous. A good, moral,upstanding,law abiding life is as filthy rags to God.

Rev 20-12--And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds.

ergon: work
Original Word: ἔργον, ου, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: ergon
Phonetic Spelling: (er'-gon)
Definition: work
Usage: work, task, employment; a deed, action; that which is wrought or made, a work.

They are believers. And not going to hell. All believers enter His Kingdom, but those that fall away or become deceived will lose reward,inheritance,crowns, temporal and eternal blessing, ect. And may face harsh discipline.They will be least and naked in His Kingdom. And have shame at the Bema seat of Christ.

John 10:28 His sheep will never perish.

I am not trying to trap you, I read His promise to me that I shall never perish. And I believe Him. You seem to be saying that I can perish? The branch being cut off is me perishing? If this is what you are saying , it nullifies His promise to us.

where does it say they [that fall away from the Faith] are still Saved?

you might as well say go and practice Witchcraft because you have a Promise that not even you can break.

The Lord Jesus Christ says that I will never perish. I believe Him. John 10:28

you do understand this is TRUE ^

if

you are doing this:

Verse before it:

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me

as long as you are hearing you are Following.

so, even Jesus shows us another example of us doing something to keep ABIDING/REMAINING in Him.

You did not answer my question. I can't demand it, but I would like to hear your answer.

For me it is a glaring contradiction.

I am one of His sheep. He says I will never perish. If being cut off is me perishing. There is a huge contradiction there.

i am only showing you that Doctrines are made many times from a SINGLE cherry picked Verse, when the Verse before or after clarify the true meaning.

that's why many of the Grace Doctrines are pure Baloney.

it's Single Cherry picked Verse, completely ignoring the Context and content of the Verses surrounding it.


personally, my feelings towards this, is i don't want to test it.
i don't want to Stand before God and say, but i reasoned out through Cherry Picked Verses that I am Saved automatically and yes, i get it, i ignored all Your Commands and Warnings, but i feel this Doctrine is true.

i can only imagine what God would say in return?

also, i showed you where real deal Biblical Scholars and Theologians claim the cut-off end up in Hell.



and to be completely transparent here:
Jesus said those who fall away are not Saved, He said, only the ones who "endures" will be Saved.

so, how can i go against the Words of Jesus, knowing those Verses are together, not a single cherry-picked effort?

I really would have appreciated an answer to my question. And I remember giving you 8 or 9 verses to back up my confusion to what it seems you are saying about being cut off.

I cannot get around the contradiction. Sorry.