Apostles

Could be 4 fold ministry.

Pastor/teacher.

Not a big deal one way or another IMO.

Eph 4:11
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

apostle means one who is sent with a commission. it may be "fun" for someone to read the apocryphal but it is not Holy Spirit inspired which means it doesn't belong in God's Bible. know that the books of the Bible are scripture because they gave evidence of revelation, were uniquely used by the H.S., contain evidence of apostolicity & are inspired. when the church collected the 66 books into the canon, it didn't make the books scripture, they were scripture the moment the Holy Spirit authored them.

And that is a determination made by God Himself. Twelve is the number of divine government, therefore Christ promised that the 12 apostles would sit on 12 thrones judging the 12 tribes of Israel. Similarly there are 12 x 2 = 24 elders who surround the throne of God in Heaven. Numbers have significance to God, who is the Supreme Mathematician. Even nature is designed with mathematics as seen in the design of fractals and many other natural phenomena.

Getting back to apostles and prophets, they are presently embedded in Scripture through their writings. Yet there are some today who are insisting on calling themselves apostles and prophets. These are all false.

Hi ph,

Thank you for looking into what I posted and giving such a detailed reply.

3 & 4. `of note among,` eminent among the Apostles.

6. `stewards of the mysteries of God,` (1 Cor. 4: 1) `mystery....revealed by the Spirit to His Apostles and prophets...` (Eph. 3: 3 - 5)

7 & 8. The word `we` is constant throughout.

9. `apostolos,` (Gk) Apostle.

10. Does the work of an Apostle - appointing elders.

Barnabas was an apostle, so too Timothy and Silvanus. They were not the 12 Apostles of the Lamb but they were apostles. The Holy Spirit does only what He receives from the Son. Barnabas was commissioned by the Spirit and confirmed by the laying on of hands of teachers and prophets. I can deduce that Timothy and Silvanus were likewise commissioned. To be true to the scriptures, apostles, today, are likewise commissioned.

I am french speaking so I do sometimes use improper words,

Blessings,

Even Paul said he was least of them 1cor chapter 15

Rom16:7
Greet Andronicus and Junia, my fellow Jews who have been in prison with me. They are outstanding among the apostles, and they were in Christ before I was.

Eph 2:20

20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

1cor 12:28
28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.

Gifts of Christ, known as the "didōmi " which HE gave to the church

Eph 4:11

11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers,


it is not a title. It is an office by which one does the work of, i.e., prophet, (a)postle, Evangelist, pastor/teacher, all are valid for today.

It's kinda cultic how everyone thinks the number 12 is special, even getting rid of Matthias. I always hated when people used that argument. There were 13 apostles and more since the Bible never said only these 12. In fact you have no scripture that limits apostles to the twelve. If God offers the list of ministries then obviously he didn't just say twelve only. I do believe the Bible is divinely put together but why not read the other works of that time. Other people have writings that qualify. And for the record I wasn't talking about the apocrypha. There are much better works.

Hi JB,

The 12 Apostles of the Lamb were to WITNESS of the Lord`s life, death, resurrection and ascension. (Acts 1: 22) They will rule over the 12 tribes of Israel from the NJ. (Matt. 19: 28, Rev. 21: 14)

The ascension Apostles are those the Lord, the Head of the Body gave to His Body to equip them for the work of the ministries. (Eph. 4: 11 & 12)

Good to know the distinction.

In the New Testament we see the chief apostle, our Lord Jesus Christ, Heb 1v2, 3v1; then there are the twelve apostles who had a unique position, and were chosen by Christ after a night of prayer. Mk 3v13-19, Lk.6v12-16, Mt 10v1-5, Acts 1v13,26. After the apostasy of Judas, the remaining eleven apostles taught others their hallowed memories of Christ's life, glory, and His public and private teaching, they also enjoyed additional special revelation and outstanding personal spiritual experiences. See Acts 1v1-4, for Christ's 40 days of ministry to them after His resurrection. It is interesting to note how many brothers were in the twelve, Simon Peter and his brother Andrew; James and his brother John; Philip seems to have been Bartholomew's brother, otherwise known as Nathanael, Lk 6v14 with Jn 1v43-51; James the son of Alphaeus could have been the brother of Matthew as well as the brother of Judas, not Iscariot. Tradition says that James the son of Alphaeus was brother to Matthew, Simon Zealotes, and Judas, not Iscariot. Lk 6v16. Families, who have learned to live together and love one another, can be really used by God; they are a strong unit for God, if they keep close to Him.



There are other apostles besides the original twelve mentioned in the New Testament, Matthias, Acts 1v26; Paul and Barnabus, 1Cor 9v5,6, Acts 14v4,14, Gal 2v9; Apollos, 1Cor 4v6-9; Timothy and Silas, 1Thess 1v1, 2v6. “Messengers” in Greek can sometimes mean “apostles,” Epaphroditus and Titus could have been apostles, the word for “messenger” in Phil 2v25 is “apostolos,” and “messengers” in 2Cor 8v23 is “apostoloi,” it could mean that Titus and Epaphroditus were “sent-ones” of the churches as distinct from the “sent-ones” of God, but they could have been apostles for God as well as men. James the Lord's half brother, also became an apostle. Gal 1v19, 2v6, James 1v1. It is also possible that Andronicus and Junia were apostles, they had been Christians before Paul, and had suffered imprisonment with him it seems from the words “fellow-prisoners.” Rom 16v7. “Of note among the apostles” could mean “highly esteemed among the apostles,” but it probably more likely that they were “distinguished among the apostles,” or literally, “stamped, marked, bearing a mark, among the apostles.” They had by their suffering for Christ certainly fulfilled an essential qualification for apostleship. 1Cor 4v9-13. If Junia was an apostle, it could mean that there was one woman apostle.

12 (# of governmental order) x 2 (higher level)

I happened to decide to take a gander and stroll into an "Apostolic Church" once a long long time ago.

The main takeaway was that they were habitually and continuously calling each other "apostle Joe" and "apostle Pete".
The whole escapade was bizarre and I beat a hasty retreat. Frankly, I recognized the disturbingly predominant fleshly hypocrisy instantaneously. All in all......no bueno.

It seems any label men put on a church makes them beholden to the label.

In the Bible, it is clear that the church has a variety of gifts and that all gifts are necessary, like all parts of a body are necessary for the whole. Prophetic churches will "666" you to death; apostolic churches will have an over-inflated sense of value; churches run by pastors will sacrifice truth for the sake of inclusion, etc.

No, man, it's just the church in (fill in the location). We are not to be known by our predecessors or a particular martyr we venerate. We are to be known for the unity in the Spirit we have with Christ and the Father, and with each other.

m sorry but all that would do is cause confusion

Hi cv5,

Many groups use that name now. The movement from the Welsh revival I was brought up is NEVER used the name apostle to others. They all were `pastors` `elders,` and humble men.

Marilyn.

I agree and the difference is that the 12 Apostles of the Lamb are Kings, whereas the 24 Elders representing the Body of Christ, are Kingpriests - the 2 offices. And that is the order of Melchizedek as we know. Only in the highest can those 2 offices function from.

There are only 12 'true' apostles - Rev 21:14 The wall of the city had twelve foundations bearing the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. Many used it as a loose term to imply those who are followers - but not in the true sense / or they were attempting to decieve. Warning in Rev 2:1-3 relates to false apostles who go to Ephesus - '....you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false.....'

There were the twelve apostles over the church who originally were seated in Jerusalem, including Matthias who met the requirements for that. A few others were called apostles but were not in that same position, we know both Paul and Barnabas were called apostles.

The twelve were over the church though certainly not all wrote epistles. Some including James the brother of the apostle John did not live long enough, the number was reduced from twelve soon enough. The only epistles we are sure of being from apostles among the originally twelve are the ones from Peter and John. The James who wrote the epistle with his name was over the church in his life here, he was one of the brothers of Jesus, and was recognized as one who had been with Jesus when he walked in this world. Jude was also on of the brothers who grew up with Jesus. There is wide disagreement about who wrote the epistle to the Hebrews now, though when it was received it must have been known. I really, really, doubt it was Paul, though. The language shows otherwise.

Where would the twelve have been in the scenes of Revelation, if they were not among the twenty four elders on thrones? I think that representation was including them, along with twelve other individuals important to God for that.

Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome To Chat.

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided (+ I and II).

Grace, Peace, And JOY!… + RICH Blessings